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Maitre D Veteran user 339 Posts 
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Roulette games on land have only one external force acting on the ball and wheel to produce its outcome -- gravity. Biased wheels on land are exploited by imperfections which result from this particular downward force (as well as the force due to friction, an internal force).
If we now consider a roulette wheel in motion on a ship, there is a completely new force acting on the ball and wheel which is perpendicular to gravity. This new force could be causing the ball to act on and magnify imperfections on the tilt, groove, frets, pits, etc., that were once negligible when gravity was the only factor (on land). What I'm thinking is -- A wheel which may pass as true at the manufacturer (on land) could in fact be biased at sea due to this ignored perpendicular force. That is unless they give the wheels a test for this before bringing it onto the ship... I have a sneaking suspicion they don't. But this is only theoretical until someone does an experiment, or tips what they already know. It is possible that the perpendicular force due to the ship in motion at a realistic speed is so negligible that it gets "washed away" (get it?) by the force of friction and gravity. Sorry if the pun was a little overboard. :banana: -Md' |
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silverking Inner circle 4574 Posts
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This is a great topic, and one that I've not ever read any serious analysis on.......except in this thread.
Cruise ships onboard stabilizing systems are impacted by only one thing.......random movements of the ship itself as caused by an ever changing sea. Whatever forces are impacting the wheel as a result of being in motion and on the sea would be completely random in nature, and thus (presumably) unexploitable. I suspect that modern ship stabilization systems are such that the fact the wheel is on a ship affects it only marginally more in normal seas than the breeze generated by dozens or hundreds of people simply walking by a wheel in a large land based casino.......or even the dozen or so players themselves gathered around the table breathing on the wheel and ball. (An aside......has anybody ever been on a cruise ship and seen a Roulette wheel closed due to increasingly rough seas?) A biased wheel at sea is simply a biased wheel......and would therefore be exploitable by the advantage player. If the sea were to cause minute (but random) impacts on the wheel, I suspect a biased wheel at sea might be somewhat less predictable for the advantage player than a biased wheel on land. Adding the random generator that is the sea itself to a biased wheel would effectively remove some of the advantage gained from completely stationary biased wheel, which tends to have its variables "smoothed" out due to the fact that it's stationary, and its operation involves operator repetition, thus allowing the wheels bias to take maximum effect. So, I would say that a Roulette wheel on a ship at sea definitely behaves differently than the same wheel on land....... the behavior of the wheel and ball will be different. But also that such effect is fundamentally 100% random in nature, and therefore not exploitable in normal play. A biased wheel on a ship at sea is still a biased wheel, and can be exploited. However, the same effect the ship has on the straight wheel (as laid out above) would impact the biased wheel, introducing randomness where before there was none. This additional randomness over the identical land based biased wheel would effectively reduce the advantage for the biased wheel player on board a ship. |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Systems do not have to actually work to make money from them, as the man who broke the bank at Monte Carlo taught us. Regain your spirit of adventure and use your imagination shipmates.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-09-01 20:28, tommy wrote: Tommy, that's what we use for equipment, and its all a crock of crap.... did it mention anything about when the monitor blinks red and you have to stop the wheel and the game so that you can call the manager to reset the terminal.... well this takes between 5-15 mins depending on where the manager is in the casino.... So during this amount of dead time, how many spins do you think the casino lost while correctng their machine that's supposed to get you more spins per hour??? This happens to this equipment every day... and don't even get me started on the chipping machines that's supposed to speed up the game, because that's another grey area.....
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-09-02 04:35, tommy wrote: that's because that's all he had left a few weeks after the big win...
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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You are not thinking.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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Expertmagician Inner circle 2478 Posts
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I don't want to change the subject...But, bear in mind that casinos also have systems which can track trends in real time for blackjack. They will not only be able to tell if someone is card counting by their betting patterns...but, they will be able to determine comps based upon their play and spot dealer errors.
Now back to Roulette ...
Long Island,
New York |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-09-02 15:16, Expertmagician wrote: Those systems are a big waste of money and a waste of time... just like a lot of machines that are supposed to increase revenue. (theoretcally) But thanks for sharing Expertmagician..
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Still not thinking are you? These systems make money.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Yup, I'm thinking with my other head tommy.... Mabee you can share with us how these systems make money?
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Lets suppose that in point of fact there is no bias in roulette wheels on these ships. But lets suppose, that despite the fact that there is no bias, the casino owners believe that there is. Or can be persuaded that it is so. Then the casino owners will buy systems for their protection. In the article above it speaks of monitoring by way of ip cameras remotely, webcams live-over-the-internet. This means one could set up a central station much like they do with burglar alarms. Which means you can monitor every wheel on every ship wherever it is in the world from your central station, your office in London or wherever your office is. All you need is a ip camera on each wheel. You BS them you have a supersonic central station equipped with high tech analysis computers that alerts you of any bias in the wheel and you then alert them via email or whatever. You charge them a fee for this service. Once you are set up you sit in your central office playing poker all day with their money and now again tell them one of their wheels is bias.
All you need is the art of illusion and the spirit of adventure. Illusion is a distortion of reality. Or one could sell the passengers a system, a device that tells them which way the ship is tilting etc and how to bet accordingly. It does not matter if does not win them money, the suckers shouldn’t be playing roulette anyway. If its plausible that the wheel is unbalanced at sea they, out greed, will buy it. Money for nothing and your trip for free. The man who broke the bank at Monte Carlo got backers, he was a con man, and one could do that. All based on belief. What your selling is the belief that wheels at sea are unbalanced.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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So tommy, have you been smoking crack again??
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Of course I have. Did someone tell you had quit the habit and gone out and got a job?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-09-03 06:44, tommy wrote: Oh, so you sell crack now.... good job...lol when I was talking about waste of time, I meant waste for the house, and not the guys peddling to the casinos those guys are definately raking in some $$$
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Yes we know when you was talking about waste of time, you meant waste for the house, we were just wondering why. Is there any reason why we should care about the house wasting their time and money? Well perhaps you care for your employer. They must have been feeding you them loyalty pills again. Are you going for casino employee of the month?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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iamslow Inner circle Proffessional Slacker 2001 Posts
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Quote:
On 2010-09-04 17:20, tommy wrote: Tommy, trust me, I couldn't care less if the place made money, I get paid the same regardless...the reason why I don't like these systems, is because it takes away jobs and makes the jobs of the ones left harder, look at the roulette chipping machines, those things jam quite a bit, and where I work, almost on a daily basis because of the heavy chip action. and when those jam up usually after a huge sweep, the chips spill onto the floor..... now the supervisor is on their hands and knees picking up chips, because the dealer needs to make payouts.... so after 5 mins, the players are all paid out and betting starts..... now you got a broken machine, and a dealer that sucks at chipping because they never had to chip because of the machine in the first place... then the ball drops and the sweep begins again, now theres no chips on the float everythings a mess, now the supervisor and the dealer are chipping trying to get the payouts to the players so they cand bet it all again... I can go on, but I know what I just wrote don't make sence to much... hope you understand...peace..
"Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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mike herbert New user mike herbert 53 Posts
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Hi there
as this subject is about roulette,I would like to know if there are any experienced VB players that I could chat to as I have a couple of problems that I need to iron out, thanks. Mike |
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tommy Eternal Order Devil's Island 16543 Posts
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Before I stated smoking crack I was a good volley ball player and now I am a champion. How much do you want?
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.
Tommy |
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Posted: Sep 2, 2010 02:07 am 
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