|
|
Ed_Millis Inner circle Yuma, AZ 2292 Posts |
I read somewhere that by the time of Jesus, none of the original Hebrew ms remained, and since Greek was the prevailing language of the region at that time, the scriptures used in the synagogue was the Septuagent.
Can someone illuminate this for me? Ed |
Terry Holley Inner circle 1805 Posts |
Here is a website that shares my understanding of the situation during the time of Christ:
http://www.jesus.org/birth-of-jesus/gene......use.html
Co-author with illusionist Andre' Kole of "Astrology and Psychic Phenomena."
|
themagiciansapprentice Inner circle Essex, UK 1381 Posts |
There is little evidence that either the Temple or Disciples used Greek translations of the Old Testament, in their Worship.
Few people read well in a pre-Industrial time! Where were the schools? The Bible was still taught by the 'oral tradition' in that way it was retained. Greek was the language of trade, and was a common tongue of many people the Disciples were preaching to - much like English and Spanish are today. Remember the copies of the early Manuscripts of the Gospels were lost, what we have are copies of copies from three different sources each with their own particular viewpoint that were collected together to tell the story of Jesus (often identified by letters.) I really can't accept that the Temple Priests abandoned their strict upbringing and were using an alien tongue in their worship. Especially after Judas Maccabees forced the Greeks and their pigs from the Temple . After previous invasions and exiles, the people learnt a different language for trade but still used Hebrew for their Worship. But following the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 we have little evidence either way.
Have wand will travel! Performing children's magic in the UK for Winter 2014 and Spring 2015.
|
Shagbeard New user 67 Posts |
I can come up with many resources that show the synagogues had Hebrew scrolls and that the people used Aramaic for daily life. LXX was used to the nations.
Magic speaks to the child in all of us. No matter how sophisticated we become, there's still a part of us who wants to believe in an alternative reality, where we can defy the laws of nature.
|
harris Inner circle Harris Deutsch 8812 Posts |
And happy Gutenberg Printing press day.
We are blessed to be able to have many Bibles in many languages.
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com music, magic and marvelous toys http://magician.org/member/drlaugh4u |
Mike Maturen Inner circle Michigan's Beautiful Sunrise Side 2726 Posts |
Many of the Old Testament quotes in the New Testament were, indeed, from the Septuagint. It is likely what was used by the Apostles.
During the time of Christ and the Apostolic Church the Jews did not even have a canonical list of Scriptures. The Sadducees regarded only the first five books of the Old Testament to be inspired. This is seen in the Gospel of Matthew 22:23-33 when they, the Sadducess, argued with Jesus against the resurrection. They could not see it in the five books of Moses because the later Scriptures which spoke of the resurrection, such as Isaiah and 2 Maccabee, were not believed to be inspired and canonical. The Pharisees held to a canon resembling the modern Jewish canon, one far larger than that of the Sadducees but not as large as other Jewish collections of Scripture. The rest, and majority, of the Jews at the time used the Septuagint. The Septuagint, which include the Deuterocanonical Books, is the Greek translation of the Hebrew text used by the Pharisees. This translation was used because at the time of Christ Hebrew was a dead language. The spoken language of time was Aramaic, which is what our Lord and the Apostles spoke (many references in the New Testament), and if anyone could read they read in Greek.
Mike Maturen
World of Wonder Entertainment The Magic and Mayhem of Mike Maturen 989-335-1661 mikematuren@gmail.com AUTHOR OF "A NEW DAWN--Weekly Wisdom From Everyday Life" member: International Magician's Society |
themagiciansapprentice Inner circle Essex, UK 1381 Posts |
Quote:
On Oct 4, 2014, Mike That is the true difficulty of this discussion. Few could read much before education became universal in Britain in 1870. In my own village only the Priest and the Lordvof the Manor could read. That was common, even in Ancient Times. Few texts were written and even fewer fragments survived AD70. From shortly after that versions in other languages exist. Now I've seen both Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew scripts from this time... Not just one language. That's not from books, but from Museums with my own eyes. I think too often we are sidetracked by Greek versions of the NT and reflect from this that the OT must have been written in Greek too. But where is the real evidence? How many of Jesus' friends, apostles or aquaintances could read Greek? Understand Greek? Being bi-lingual is a difficult skill which lawyers or scholars might have accomplished. Would a Rabbi to the fishermen and farmers have understood Greeknto read the scriptures, then translate them into a tongue that the followers would understand? That seems highly unlikely. There is no evidence to support that existing from this time.
Have wand will travel! Performing children's magic in the UK for Winter 2014 and Spring 2015.
|
Ed_Millis Inner circle Yuma, AZ 2292 Posts |
I live right next to the US/Mexico border. Bilingual is very common, especially among the youth. They have one language at home and another in the community. Us older guys gotta work a bit harder at it, but if it's needed and used then bilingual is not too difficult to manage.
If Paul and others were writing letters, then surely someone could read?? And then read to the congregation, of course. It's not at all unusual - even today - to find the common laborer unable to read much at all. And much of the Old Testament gets quoted. Did Paul read the OT in Hebrew and translate to Greek for his letters? Just for info: there's no great theological upheaval that must be settled by answering this question. I don't have any formal Bible education - just what I've read in a few books. Seeing all these footnotes in various translations about how the scripture reads in this ms versus that one can get the head scratcher going! Ed |
themagiciansapprentice Inner circle Essex, UK 1381 Posts |
Think of the context and location
Today many more folks are bilingual because of education , social media, television etc (including me!!) and in a world where Hebrew/Aramaic/different versions of Greek /Latin /all the other asian languages were all permiating? How many letters were written to the Jews? How many were written to communities where education was a much larger way of life? The Greeks (and their former Empire north of Lebanon) treasured Education. So too did the Latin speaking/writing Romans. So of course you'd write to them in a tongue they could understand. But that argument can't be taken of books they didn't access to ie OT
Have wand will travel! Performing children's magic in the UK for Winter 2014 and Spring 2015.
|
ZachDavenport Inner circle Last time I posted I had one less than 1196 Posts |
Quote:
On Oct 6, 2014, Ed_Millis wrote: Paul was a Pharisee as well as a Roman citizen, so he was very well educated. It is very likely that he could speak multiple languages.
Reality is a real killjoy.
|
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Good News! » » Bible question (non-magic) (2 Likes) |
[ Top of Page ] |
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2024 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved. This page was created in 0.03 seconds requiring 5 database queries. |
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic. > Privacy Statement < |