Hi all,

Ive been playing with Finger ring off rope and was wondering, is it possible to do Cheffelo knot with the ring on the rope, then ending up free once the knot unties?

Any pointers to a reference would be appreciated, either here or in a PM.

G'day friend, from the "other" end of the globe!

Topologically, I know of no way to release a ring from CHEFALO.

The late Jim Ryan (of Chicago) had a neat routine using the G.W. Hunter Shoelace Knot. He used it in a ring on stick routine. It was published in the "PHOENIX" in the '50s.

Have you considered Stewart James' "Sefalaljia"??

If this is of interest, I'll try to "dig it up".

I have played with four different ways of getting a ring off of a rope tied with a knot.

None work well with a finger ring and the overhead of time vs impact of effect gets lost.

With a larger ring and part of a flowing routine such a knot can work as an ending with the spectator trying to untie the knot:

Shoelace knot approach -- thank for the source DIck, I just saw it done and figured it out,
Sefaljia approach -- learned from an old Genii. Best with one on and one off I think,
Reverse Palfreyman - "Linking Rope Slip Knot" kept loose. Cumbersome but astonishing,
RemCut - ring on and off a tied necklace (my own creations)

A combination can allow this --

a red ribbon is tied into a loop by a spectator. A green ribbon is also tied with a borrowed ring on it and knotted by spectator.
The ring jumps from the green to the red ribbon. All handed out.

Again -- in practice these effects proof too convoluted and slow paced for today's audience.

If I have only five minutes to create a 30 year memory this would not be it.

If you can find a copy of "Two Jardine Ellis Ring-on-ribbon Routines Millidge" it tells how to do this with an Ellis Ring. I believe it can work with a finger ring as well.

I agree with Ken. Jim Ryan's "ROPE, RING and ROD" (published in PHOENIX #337, Sept. 1950, Vol I, #4 is a good commercial trick. Jim used it as a bartender, and was very successful with it. (Here comes the "but": But, it isn't a "quick trick". I know of several magicians who use it, today, but, for many it would, as Ken says, above, be too slow.

"Out Of This World" is one of the all time GREAT card tricks, BUT, "ya hafta pick your audience, and the TIME & PLACE!!!" IMO, Ryan's ROPE RING AND ROD, needs the same discretion.

Ditto, with Stewart James' basic Sefalaljia (with the safety pin, under a handkerchief) It's a GREAT PRINCIPLE, but Clifton, Grismer, and Nelson's contributions, plus the new one a few years ago with the m....t and shoelace (I can't remember the name) have moved the penetration EFFECTS ahead! TEMPO-TIMING-TIME!!!

I knew Stewart James, and, Jim Ryan. When I say this about "their" tricks, it is not to denigrate them. They were not only good friends, but, were also fine magicians. Both have passed, years ago. I still miss them.

To further clarify the 'THREE "T's": Most of my show is tricks I learned from TARBELL. (Here comes another "but" >>>But, I've adapted the PRESENTATION to modern audiences!

Bill! That's interesting! (Ellis). I haven't played with an Ellis for years.

Back in the early '70s, Charlie Miller showed me a a ring off rope, with ring tied in an overhand knot! It's a winner!

Thankyou gentlemen ill head to those references!! Much appreciated!

@dick, I have considered the shoelace knot, I think it was Marc Desouza that uses it in his quadringle routine. If you have details of sefalalija I would be most thankful!!

@funsway, yeah I know what youre saying, I am looking to put together a fast routine for walk around. I did have a routine with a larger ring based on Tabaray and a Lewis Ganson manuscript, that unfortunately I cant find anywhere. The ring would be to big to cart around!

@bill, thankyou for the reference, I hadnt considered using an ellis ring, but I will look up the reference.

Ive also been looking at routines with a ring and chopstick!

Thanks again

I'll check my "rope" file, to see what I have, and PM you.

Thanks heaps!

Sefalaljia is available free on the Internet, do you know how to use the Google search engine? Just put the word "magic" behind the name, and hit enter.

Thanks, Bill!

I didn't know that!

No I'm computer illiterate and am dictating these posts, to someone computer savvy! Thanks

The Ency. of Rope Tricks has several ring & rope effects, including Chefalo Release p211.

Howsomeever, as Funsway mentioned, doing this with a finger ring and string would probably be nasty (too hard to tie all that with string).

Instead I would look at some fake knots designed for finger rings..

I think I remember one such knot in Ring Leader, but can't think of the name

GaMBIT_101!

Sorry, I'm so late returning to your thread!

I didn't make a note to reply, and, my ancient brain "lost it"!

In downsizing my reference library, I disposed of my old Abbott "Encyclopedia of Rope Magic". and, I had totally forgotten any references to the CHEFALO KNOT and a ring release. Thanks to John Long for his reference above!

The question that comes to my mind, which *I* forgot to ask: Why a Cheflao Knot?

To me, as I think Funsway was alluding to, due to their complexity, they take quit of time to tie, and I would think prone to miss-tying. Beyond that, they look like such a mess (to me) I think it would be hard to motivate, and even suspicious to the spectator.

I again recommend a simple fake knot, that looks like a real knot, can be displayed openly, but made to come free of the ring (even in the specs fist).

John

Not sure if this meets the criteria....the ring is ted with a double overhand knot


https://youtu.be/QYrXYP0rFeo

vinny