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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Polly wants a cracker... » » Dove Apparatuses (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

TommyTheTremendous
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I have had my 2 doves for a year now and still haven't been able to afford good-quality stuff for them. Does anyone know of the best deals on dove pockets and dove holder bags?
- Tommy Magic
damien666
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canada
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You can always try to make them yourself. Or if you are able to sew or if you know someone with a sewing machine, it is a cheaper way to go. Plus, that way you can make holders and pockets in a customized way that will fit into your specific act. Besides, not all holders fit all birds, so if you can customize, it would be best for the comfort of your birds.
Good luck,
Damien
Dave Scribner
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Lake Hopatcong, NJ
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Tommy, scattered throughout this forum are multiple topics about bags and holders. You migh want to search or just look around for them. I've contributed to most of them but there is a lot of good info from other members who are into dove magic. You'll find that the price of most bags, holders and such are about the same and it's really all a matter of preference. Some holders, like Shimada's are great for small birds while holders from Gen Grant are adjustable. The pockets need to be right. Satin material of the correct size and weight are essential for dove productions. Tony Clark has a good product in this regard as well as Gen Grant.
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Magic Blinds
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Shimada's bags are costly. Tony Clarks are a good price but you best bet would probably be visiting http://www.extremedovemagic.com, Dan Sperry sells bags and pockets. Just buy a set and then make your own.

A problem that you will have is the placement of the dove pockets. Tony Clarks "Behind the Sems" cover this. But in my experience the pocket placement depends and changes with body types, fabric material, and jacket.

The most expensive investment is the jacket.
Christopher Moro
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I agree - the jacket is key. However, Tommy, getting the other elements is important, too. For years I made my own. Do you have the Marian Chavez Encyclopedia of Dove Magic book? For a while all I had was that and an old Shimada Dove video in Japanese. I drew up my own "apparatuses" and had a good friend sew them for me. I stil make I.H. but I've recently become a fan of Andy Amyx's D.B. Check out the other topics!
Magic Blinds
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You can get a good deal on a used tux tails tuxedo. Some tuxedo rental places have clearance sales. Just get a jacket that is 4 sizes larger than your current jacket and the shoulder should extend about 2 inches on both sides. That is if you have a thin frame if you are heavier set the dimensions might be bigger.

In the shoulder make some custom shoulder pads, use ¼ inch sponge, for the stiffener try 3-4 layers of denim material. Denim is strong yet flexible. A good tailor will be able to make the changes to the jacket.

I do recommend getting Tony Clarks Doves 101, Greg Frewin also has
advice on the jacket I am not sure which volume though.

I recommend a gusset in the jackets armpit area and for the tails pocket use plastic to keep it open.
Christopher Moro
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All good advice. Tony Clark goes into nice depth on his last video (Behind Seams). In my experience, however, 2 sizes larger on a tux is more than enough (off the rack).
Magic Blinds
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4 sizes larger will allow you to put the dove bags deeper in the jacket which in turn will decrease the chest area. Then you can eliminate having to wear a tacky ruffle shirt.
Dave Scribner
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Tony Clarks video's are Unmasked, Unmasked 2 and Behind the seams. All of which are great. Christopher is correct in that the Behind the seams is best for designing the jacket. Andy Amyx has Doves 101 which is also a good source.

When picking out a jacket, I always take a few holders with socks in them and loosely place them in position while trying it on. Then you can get a good idea of how large to get it. I've tried 3 and 4 sizes too large and found them to be too bulky, even with the proper shoulder pads and stiffening material. For me, 2 sizes is just about right and fits my style.

As magicblinds stated, your frame dictates a lot about the size of the jacket. I never wear ruffled shirts so that isn't a concern for me but my body build is.
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Christopher Moro
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Just my additional opinion - although the chest bulge decreases with deeper placement, I have found that in turn, it creates an unnatural bulge at the rib cage (sides) that is evident when you're turned head on to the audience. To each his own as everyone is different.
Dave Scribner
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Christopher, you're absolutely right. Not only that, but placing the pocket farther back means more travel time because of the longer line attached to the bird which may cause problems.
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Magic Blinds
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David,

That informaion might be true but it all depends on your body type, your physical height. If you are short I would line up the pockets near the edge. I can get away with pockets further in. 4 sizes larger allow plenty of room for a production of a dove a few inches deeper. I am also over 6 feet tall with a 44 long chest and plenty of room if I wanted to loaded even parrots.

Peter White once mentioned 4 sizes but the actual sizes bigger depends on your needs. I would listen to the advice of the socks but place the socks in dove pockets and try on diffrent size jackets, 2 sizes, 3 sizes, 4 sizes bigger.
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