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pipes5780
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Chicago
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In my process of learning magic I've gone through a lot of books and come across a lot of tricks and sleights that upon reading seem to be a very simple concept and thinking about them I was wondering if these basic sleights are viewed by an average spectator and figured out. Are there any things that you expirienced magicians shy away from doing? Or is this just my view from seeing how they are done in print and not looking at a magician preforming it in front of me?
thumbslinger
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This is a good number:
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You'll probably get a few responses on this one, but here's my take. As you suggested, many times a book or video can be focused on the workings rather than the showing. I use those words instead of the "How" since presentation as well as handling can be considered 'how' more so than workings.

Meaning that the way and timing in which you actually 'do' something will be what normally, if ever, give away the workings of a sleight. No matter the difficultly.

If you're looking at your hands intently when executing a move, so will the spectators. And if the move is actually simple in its working, then possibly someone will see and understand. But the concern will often give away more.

Plus, there are always going to be some people, magician or not, that just catch something or pick-up on something where others will not.

The trick is to just learn the handlings well enough so that you can perform the sequence of moves in any given effect without even thinking about them or looking at your hands.

Then you start to build a good presentation around that and work on the framing and such and pretty soon your presenting a small 'event' rather than a trick and the entertainment value will keep the spectator engaged so that maybe, just maybe, he/she will go along for the ride instead of making a pitstop to figure it out.
Chet Atkins, Jerry Reed and Tommy Emmanuel are all you need to study to learn to play guitar.
BlackShadow
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The basic false take is in the Ladybird book of magic and in Christmas crackers etc. Most kids have tried it when they were young in some form. If you shy away because of that, then all the myriads of hand to hand transfers would be ruled out of use. The retention vanishes, the pinches and the like would be useless.

But the fact is these sleights are not used in isolation or they shouldn't be. You're going to be doing something else immediately afterwards. Maybe you make the object appear somewhere else while you dump the dirty hand. You're so focussed on your empty hand that they'll be distracted for a vital second from where the object actually is. And the precise manner of the transfer is executed with the most convincing attention to detail that even someone who is aware of the idea will be fooled for long enough for the next segment or appearance to take over.

If you watch such a basic sleight well executed and properly routined with misdirection it will look like the object vanished and appeared somewhere else by pure magic even to a magician watching.
jolyonjenkins
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United Kingdom
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The French Drop is in my small daughter's magic book (where it is called "Voodoo Vanish") It is supposedly a stand alone routine - without any instructions about what to do with the dirty hand.

As a result, my chidren are extremely familiar with this move; but within a routine it is still possible to fool them with it.
Jolyon Jenkins
MattWayne
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Normal magic books in public libraries are accessible by the public- most of these contain simplistic tricks (self working), and touch on the basis of technique (sleights.) Such as a french drop, false transfer, or a basic color change of a card; mostly what I've seen in library books tends to be theres a deck, just a wave over, and the top card changes. Basics. They don't focus mainly on timing, presentation, etc. They tell you what to say by giving basic patter lines, but the average "Magic Joe" isn't going to expand on the material. They also never give clean up methods. Ok so you do this one trick, but where is the transition into another effect. The tricks in these books tend to cover a vast majority of tricks pertaining to cards, coins, rings, etc. They aren't designed to flow together. Or at least I haven't seen a book on the subject in a public library.

But anyway- in answer to the question. I believe it's all presentation. I taught a class at a local college one evening on magic. I did some verrry basic moves. Just stood up, and did them. Then I taught them how it was done. BUT THEN I incorporated patter, and came up with a presentation. They were so amazed. Why? Presentation. They knew how the sleights were accomplished, but yet still amazed. The timing, persona, and presentation were apparent. Hope this helps someone. Keep in touch!

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zur
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California
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Quote:
On 2005-02-02 10:00, pipes5780 wrote:
Are there any things that you expirienced magicians shy away from doing?


A lot of magicians tend to avoid the pass.
Carlos Lacuna
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Quote:
On 2005-02-05 02:18, zur wrote:
Quote:
On 2005-02-02 10:00, pipes5780 wrote:
Are there any things that you expirienced magicians shy away from doing?


A lot of magicians tend to avoid the pass.


Some avoid palming like the plague...
silapmata
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I am still execute my french drop, palming, basic transposition if the tricks required that, cos for me the total routine performance is more important than the single sleight.
BlackShadow
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Quote:
A lot of magicians tend to avoid the pass


You don't need the pass anyway. There are many alternatives.
onezero1
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[/quote]

A lot of magicians tend to avoid the pass.
[/quote]

and the palm!
(i love the pass, and worry about the palm late at night)
'though it stands to reason that a samurai should be mindful of the Way...it would seem that we are all negligent.
ClouDsss
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Sleights have been exposed not only in books but occasionally in tv shows, etc. Hence, IMO I think that sleights are magical due to the way and timing they are being performed. For example, there are many different types of DLs and ways of executing the pass (Hermmann, riffle, classic). There are also many ways to force a card too.

IMO even if the books are readily available in the lib, I think most laymen cant be bothered to search them up. Unless they have seen a magic trick and then want to learn more about the topic. However, as with TV shows on exposure, these get forgotten after some time.

In addition, it can work to our advantage. When laymen learn of a move, we can do another sleight to achieve the effect and this can create a stronger effect then if they knew nothing (at least IMO).

For me, the more a sleight is exposed, the more I will utilise it but under the correct timing and misdirection. It not only gives me a sense of satisfaction at having fooled them with something they know. but also allows me to learn the timing required to escape notice.

Furthermore, it happened many times when I perform for magicians with a sleight that they know and then after I told them what I did, they were surprised that I did that move. It is kinda like a reverse psychology thing. The more you feel a sleight is exposed, the more they feel you wont use it for fear of being detected

PS: Spectators usually cant figure out how a magic trick is done. They might be able to figure the starting few parts but as the routine continues, they will lose the ability to construct the trick. (Well, at least for routines that are 'sleightly' longer - 'punt intended' Smile)

cheerios
Think outside the box, cos people are all thinking inside now!! - ClouDsss
GeorgeSantos
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San Diego, CA
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I think laymen don't notice it. They just pay attention to what you are doing because they don't know what happens next.
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