This question is for those who load baseballs, oranges, or anything of that size in a cups and balls routine.

Do all of you load from a pouch?

Have you ever used back pockets? How does it work?

Thanks a lot guys.

I load all of my baseballs from a pouch, the melon I leave in a servante in front of my table.



Never used the back pockets. though to be fair I have never tried, I tend to move a lot when I perform and stuff in the back tends to be much more noticeable.




lift cup. show empty. misdirection. load cup. replace. sorry I couldn't ressit

"lift cup. show empty. misdirection. load cup. replace."

I saw that comming a mile away, lol.


Anyone else?

With my riser Jumbo cups, I used 3 pieces of fruit, and a baseball as the 4th load. It was held via a billiard ball clip under the back of my jacket. Or a similar clip can probably be made from a wire coat hanger.

How about a double pouch hung on each back pocket. Take the first load as you eliminate one ball, and place the pouch into your pocket as you take the second.

Disadvantages:
Need set up (hang on the pouches), need controlled space (can't turn my back)

Advantages:
I'm not in a jacket, don't need a special table, "clean" afterwards, located near pocket - so natural (quick) to take, can turn afterwards (like a retrospective convincer)

I'm confused. Why have a pocket on a pocket? I like that you're thinking (you'd be surprised how many magicians don't ), but it sounds like you're overcomplicating things a bit. Michael Ammar solved this problem by simply using extra large back pockets. Once the loads were gone, everything looked normal again with no added gadgetry to deal with.

Dave, he doesn't do this anymore, as it looks funny, I think.
Anyone else?

Dave VanVranken

All my performances so far have been in casual dress. Jeans and no jacket.

My jeans would look odd if "I" doctored them

I wanted the largest loads my cups would take which are clumsy in the pockets, especially when you're trying to put ball in there too. However I want the loads near my pockets.

My first solution was a washer in the load and a strip magnet in my pocket. The modification of the load was noticable (plus I actually preffer fruit / veg' - which are not very "washerable")

Anyway - this is where I am now. The pre-prepared bags / pockets are quick to hook on too. Any suggestion for improvement greatfully recieved.

I used to use a small photo gadget bag.

NOW, that I know SIZE DOES NOT MATTER... I just use my sport jacket pockets or trouser pockets. I just DO NOT go for BIG BIG LOADS... Not needed in close up.

On the street? Use a pouch.

I know too, but I feel like if I do get cups that can load a baseball, I should. The suprise of a different ball is the important thing, not the size of the actual ball. I I load a golfball in a baseball size cup, one can easily think that I have false bottome etc... I hate situations like that. IMO

MagicMaven, You can't argue with Pete on this - search for his column on Ken Brooks, in which Ken empirically proved size didn't matter... however, this does not mean larger is worse either.

I'm with you on avoiding such suspicion. My cups are in the Johnson style, and I not only like to sit the loads on the cups but also make a play of the cups being larger inside than out (al-la DV), and large loads assist me in this mystery.

I like to hand out my props (after tightening the cups to "disarm" them) and the mystery must work, because someone always tests to see if the loads do actually fit inside the cups

This is not meant to be a size debate, I'm sure they exist elsewhere. The only thing I'm sure of is that you can't be prescriptive. C&B is too flexible, all performers are different, and all routines develop their own mysteries.

There are many places to get loads from, Michael Ammar has a section on his second DVD. My posts above cover my solution to my exact situation (standing in casual wear, indoors, able to do a little setup as I duck under the table to produce some props).

I've been wondering about investing in a Topit to go into my dinner jacket. I don't exactly know what the Topit is or if it will produce as well as vanish. A dinner jacket is not too sus', even thought about a wizards cape style garbe to give me more options - any opinions ?

If the statement "size does not matter" is truly valid (...and I believe it is. Listen to Pete Biro... he speaks volumes with few words.), perhaps this could also apply to the cups themselves. This being the case, the ratio between cup and load could be pushed closer to even, if smaller cups were used. Just because big cups are the trend, doesn't mean that smaller cups have nearly the drawback that is highlighted by the manufacturers of big cups. This is part of their pitch. (I don't have a problem with that. If I were selling cups, I'd probably say it, too!)

If someone is to load baseballs, or oranges, or even chickens, then the size does matter. The cups must ultimately conceal the load in normal play.

I'm not convinced that baseball size cups are required for the audience to see them. I've seen Paul Daniels use a normal size chop cup on a stage in front of nearly 2000 people. I was very near the back, and trust me, I could see what was going on. I use older-style Morrissey minis for one routine, and they barely hold a racquetball. I've used them in rooms with a few hundred people, and I'm sure that would be sufficient for many other venues, including street work.

In favor of large cups and large loads, I have heard spectators comment to me that they don't know how the trick was done, because they know it is impossible to conceal a baseball in your hand (In my case, it was for a chop cup load). In that regard, there is a payoff using larger loads. Also in fairness to big cups, I will mention that I use very large cups for another routine, but this is to semi-duplicate the look of the street workers from several hundred years ago. But, this is just a personal preference, as I'm sure nobody in the audience would draw the same analogy on their own. In regard to pre-concealment of those loads, I use a shallow, bag-like servante at the back edge of my table. I can wear whatever I want during rehearsal or real play.

Don't forget to think outside the box.

~michael

I completely agree! I want to load tennisballs. And therefore I prefer regular cups, but I am looking at all types of cups, just seeing what's out there, and what people think.

I wear a duster. There are special pockets on each side. There is a pocket with an opening that faces directly up and underneath that is another pocket with the opening towards the back. I load from that second pocket. They see me going in the top to get things, etc. They never suspect that I can get something out of them without going in the top.

Besides, the duster, being an overcoat, is loose enough that I think I could hide a small auto in the pockets and not change the hang of the coat.

More on Baseballs
http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......6&54
Mario

Sorry maybe a stupid question but what is a pouch ?

A pouch is a pretty much a bag which you strap around your waist so the bag is a your front. It is also know as a gibiciere(sp?). Many street magicians who perform the cups and balls use it to hold their cups and the final loads.

I'd use one, but this is for a formal situation, and a pouch doesn't fit my character in any way.

For a cool loading sequence, check out John Schryock's routine on his DVD. He uses Limes, but you should be able to do it with baseballs too.