Why does everyone love these guys. sure they revolutionised magic and invention of loads of principles but the bottom line is that there were not very entertaining. do we forget that our critics should be lay people not other magi. what do you all think?

Without Vernon and Marlo a lot of cardthemes/effects, and here I'm talking from a specs point of view, would never have existed

I agree. Whenever you see a spec's face after performing twisting the aces or triump (or any variation to it), think again. You'll realise how much Vernon did for magic. Same for oil and water, only I think it was Marlo who made that up.

I think that you should learn to respect those 2 pioneers...without them you wouldn't be able to use the name "sleightking" and feel right. Magicians were laypeople at one time and we are a "brotherhood" which in the dictionary is defined as "an association of men united for common purposes" a fellowship. I am proud to have been inspired by those 2 men. Entertainment is in the "Eye of the beholder". I'm sure many will agree.

:bikes:

<<<KRaZy4kardz>>>

Marlo was not a man who worked only for magicians !
He used to perform in the bars of Chicago and worked for a time in a magic shop.
How on earth do you get the idea that he wasn't entertaining.
Sure he didn't drop his trousers or empty ashtrys in peoples laps but that doesn't mean that he wasn't fun to be with. Made them laugh .

And who says that lay-people should decide who are great magicians.

BLAINE IS BEST !!

I can't believe what I am reading! Marlo and Vernon are the inventors of the most famous magical routines we currently use, almost each card effect makes use of one of their tecniques, ideas, inspirations, ect. Today's best magicians and entertainers (Ammar, Daryl,Malone) have been all fellows students of Marlo and Vernon. How can you say that they are overrated?

I don't know what to say...

Anybody calling himself for a *sleight king* might/should reconsider not only his 'name' but probably also a lot of other things, and all this before telling us how important, or rather in his terms, "unimportant" Dai Vernon and Ed Marlo where!

Sorry!, no slagging of ppl having other thoughts, I just wonder re *who* does make this judgement.....

(Oh well, I presume, all these flawless sleight he does, he has 'invented' himself...)
Good luck re your career in entertaining any audience...

There are performers, creators, historians, technicians, teachers, authors and much more in the world of Magic.
You only respect entertainers?

I respect people in every category who left us their great work.

Dai Vernon and Edward Marlo left us the basement of today's card magic.

Hideo Kato

Hello people I did start off by saying that marlo and vernon where technically and inventively brilliant. Granted. but would a lay person know from what they were doing that they where so well looked at in the magic community. tell you what some of the vernon revelations videos are the most boring to watch tapes I own. Oh I am not winding anyone up I am expressing my opinion and I wish other people would

As my wife always says, "what ever".

Tom Wolf

Perhaps you might get better comments from those who knew those guys.

Overrated? By who? Both loved magic and both loved the cleverness that makes magic. Both wanted to improve the condition of magic by finding and discovering the best possible methods of making magic happen.

There are stories about the guys as performers and as people told by those who knew them. I only met Vernon once and did not get to meet Marlo, and so don't have much to offer in that department.

HOWEVER, there are café members who spent time around those guys.

Thank you for your wifes opinion. let me ask you who would your prefer at your function, vernon or tommy wonder for example to entertain the guests. sure I can appreciate that tommy wonders routines probable have connection with marlo or vernon creations but who would the spectators most enjoy?

Why do you compare the one mainly a creator and the one mainly a performer?

Hideo Kato

It has been my blessing to have had Eddie Marlo as my friend and mentor.

I have seen him working with non magicians and please let me tell you that they loved his "magic".

He had a warm personality and a twinkle in his eye when performing for non-magicians.

We all owe a lot to him and Vernon.

We do have magicians that have a warmer personality and ability to entertain.

I am grateful to the above for the wealth of knowledge that they shared with us.

Go Forth and amaze with what you have learned in our wonderful craft.

Tom Wolf

Thanks for the replies. What I am saying is that sure they are top of the tree for invention but why all over the forums and my personal view is that performance out ways the effect by a long way. So shouldnt the proffessor really have been a great performer not a great inventor. Anyone heard a Marlo or Vernon one-liner?

[quote]On 2005-04-21 05:03, sleight king wrote:
"sure they revolutionised magic and invention of loads of principles"

The statement is self-defeating. Revolutionizing magic in itself negates any chance of being overrated.

Onward,
Fatts

Your statment is slightly too crtical!

I perform a lot of vernon and Marlo effects and am doing well with magic.
To say they are over rated, is like saying Jim Steinmeyer is over rated. Just becuase he doesn't perform illusions does mean he doesn't deserve his place in magic history.

So no, none of the above are over rated IMHO.

In Magic
Steve Dela

I don't know re about the revelation video's, but I have almost all others of the series from Hans Zahn/Videonics re Dai Vernon...and they are not boring at all, in fact they are highly interesting and entertaining, just to hear him telling stories..
Even laymen would appreciate to hear him telling his stories, nobody else (speaking of 'magicians') could tell stories like him...

Well, good grief, the man was nearly 90 years old when those were made! What would you expect? Most folks don't even live that long, much less in an "entertaining" fashion.

Both Marlo and Vernon were excellent performers in their day. You speak of what you do not know. Might as well say George Washington is overrated, Albert Einstein, Thomas Edison, Henry Ford, Martin Luther King, Muhammed Ali, Michael Jordan, Babe Ruth, Jim Brown, Pele... all overrated. I think not!

Marlo overated? Venon overated? Yeah, and boring people too, and bad magicians also. Indeed, who were Marlo and Vernon?

On the other hand, I have bought the last ultra cool dvd from elluzionestiz and hamlorzdsz, and am able to do the ultra-snake-pass. Cool, isn´t it?

(Ironic, of course).

All the best magic,

Pablo Tejero