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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Pasteboard Frolics » » XCM going a litle too far? » » TOPIC IS LOCKED (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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weapon
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Ok..i respect all xcm artists trying to make a name for themselves and trying to seperate themselves from the art of magic and all...but umm I just seen some videos of guys trying to do riffle shuffles with there feet....and controling the deck with a fork and knife...and to top it of making it even more "odd" another guy was using a spatula to open a sealed deck, then he started flipping it like a hamburger or somthing... ok in my opinion that's a lil ridiculous..i think theres a thin line between showing skill and just plain old being retarded..whats your opinion I'd like to know =o)
p.s I hope they don't use the same utensils to eat with.
Eternity by Emran Riaz (Gimmicks + Download) An IMPOSSIBLE prediction of ANY number, ANY word, literally ENGRAVED in a medallion they've been holding THE ENTIRE TIME.
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/12181
Jonas
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I agree with you totally weapon.

Those challenges... Well, I don't think it would impress laymen to see that stuff done at all...

Feet shuffles are alright IMO, a cool party stunt or such, but just like you said, fork and knife,hamburger flipper thing.

Not to put any of them down, but De'vo gave them the concept to play with, to manipulate a deck of cards with the help of a knife and fork, and then he says that his members are über creative and goes like "Who would ever think of that, manipulating a deck of cards with silverware?" but well... Jeez, it's HIMSELF that made the concept and them just exploring it, and none of the moves were too original IMO, to ribbon spread a deck of cards on a table with a fork is... Neither impressive or original.

I think In the hands manipulation looks the best, the rest just looks retarded, like you said.
http://www.youtube.com/jonashaglund < Card flourishes and some other stuff.
rkzad
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Well they didn't win, did they? Smile
- richard
weapon
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Lol..i showed my girl the clip...and she was totaly grossed out
Eternity by Emran Riaz (Gimmicks + Download) An IMPOSSIBLE prediction of ANY number, ANY word, literally ENGRAVED in a medallion they've been holding THE ENTIRE TIME.
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/12181
kxxcheng
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Yeah Jerry doesn't have particularly attractive feet. Done with some better feet though, it would be a cool parlour trick to be able to shuffle with feet.

When I first got into XCM, watching videos and such, I skipped all the challenge videos after I had seen one or two (ie no thumbs, hands off cards) because I thought they didn't look a fraction as cool as without the handicap. But I don't really think they're going "too far" with the cards. Later I watched some of the winning videos and I thought some of them were cute. While that kind of stuff isn't exactly impressive, it's still something new and different to watch, rather than the same old thing.
Karen
yahu
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First, the challenges are not made to produce great videos. They are meant to stimulate creativity and thus advance XCM as an art form. Next, I believe the fork and knife video you are refering to was Gresk's video for the no hands challenge, which in my opinion was just terrific. I thought it was a great looking vid, and enjoyed watching it tremendously, to the point of watching it at least a dozen times in that last three months.
I am away and will be so until late July. I will have a chance to read the forums, but I will be pressed for time, and unable to read every thread. If you feel a thread requires my attention, please PM me with a link. Thanks, and have a great summer. :
4Jacks
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WTH?? I must of missed something?? Feet, Forks? WHAT???

Where can I get these vids... ?? I'm assuming the HL challenge forums, but someone throw up link to the ones your talking about.
cheats
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Challenges are very entertaining and inspire creativity and help with new ideas. I would rather watch 1000 of these than 10 sybil cut videos. They are not for audiences, they are for being creative. XCMers are all about being artistic.
This shows how large of a vision XCM has. They always explore new realms.

What you were asking about is the "hands off challenge"
Here is what is says under that challenge

Manipulate the cards without using your hands. Members had to manipulate objects to manipulate the cards! This taught members how to think "inside the box", and how to be truly creative. The only way to be truly creative, is to do something that hasn't even been close to being done before. This is what we at Handlordz strive to teach, and love to watch.

Fork and knife was good but look at Ciappi with this crazyhands off video
http://www.handlordzstore.com/battlez/ch2_ciappi.wmv

Here is fork and knife
http://www.handlordzstore.com/battlez/ch2_gresk.wmv

Here are all of them on Superhandz.com
http://www.superhandz.com/battlez.html
4Jacks
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Thanks Cheats...

Dude, I seriously can't beilive I'm trying to DL this on my home computer... what a POS.. . Say's I have over an hour to go...

I seriously gotta save up for a new computer, does anyone here know a lot about computers.. I'm thinking about doing this http://www.tigerdirect.com put it together yourself thing.. it's boat loads cheaper... but I don't know..

Anyhoo... Didn't Devo give out stuff for the people who won these challenges???? I mean seriously... if he's giving out free stuff it's all good, I'd spin some cards on my kneecaps running down the street in my PJ's for free stuff.. Ok.. I'd do that for a dollar... but the point is that it's really cool for De'vo to be giving out free junk for the people making the vids... I'm really appreciative towards all the people on HL and on Here that make the card videos.. and I'm not going to trash talk any of them, even if it is a BAD video it's still a free card video, and the very least, I can say.. "I can do that better than him =ţ"

Yeah 16%
cheats
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Yes devo gave out many "free stuff" and their picture and name on the website. I think it is great what devo did and I think it was fun for the people making the videos and some did inspire like ciappis video did for me. he is great. watching these videos to me is inspiring.

xcm is artists with cards.
4Jacks
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*One Hour and 4 minutes Later*

DUDE !!!! Friggin A Right!!! Ciappi's Video was cool as junk... I really hope he got free junk for that!! That was awesome. If any video deserves free junk, that is the one.

I think that video was pretty enlighting for me also.. I kinda always shrug and laugh when you guys talk about being an "Artist" cause to me that is just a term that snobby people use to put themselves on a pedestal. And to get technical and REALLY be an artist, it means you have to create something. And Practicing a Card move until you get it right and can perform it, does not in the very least way make you an artist. A true artist creates a new piece of artwork everytime he practices. But everything in Ciappi's Video was fantastic and original (least I haven't seen it before) He definitely created a few moves there... Hat's off to Ciappi

I'll have to DL the rest later, now I'm kinda looking forward to the feet and forks... well maybe the forks
cheats
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Quote:
On 2005-05-18 21:42, 4Jacks wrote:
*One Hour and 4 minutes Later*

A true artist creates a new piece of artwork everytime he practices. But everything in Ciappi's Video was fantastic and original (least I haven't seen it before) He definitely created a few moves there... Hat's off to Ciappi

I'll have to DL the rest later, now I'm kinda looking forward to the feet and forks... well maybe the forks


ciappi has been to ulmen and trained with De'vo and Marius Jr. I hope I can go next year. ciappi is superhandz next featured artist. watch all the jason soll/harwin/kevin virtuoso videos you want to and they all the same to me after watching videos like that one.
yahu
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Yeah, no offense to anyone here, but no matter how fast you can execute a sybil cut, I'd rather watch CIAPPI do XCM.
I am away and will be so until late July. I will have a chance to read the forums, but I will be pressed for time, and unable to read every thread. If you feel a thread requires my attention, please PM me with a link. Thanks, and have a great summer. :
Seif
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Yeah, I was a winner of Challenge #4....honestly now, I didn't put that video up for the entertainment of laymen, but to expand my creative mind. Trust me, doing stuff like that really works. You wouldn't believe some of the cool moves you can make up when exploring new concepts.

Seif
cheats
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I found it on the net. was not to hard when you know the right names for it all. The names devo uses on superhandz and handlordz is not the same names that the germans and austrians use. I think devo knows this. Smile and is why he changes the real names of the events so magic people do not go and flood then copy them

Laymen are impressed with a Charlier cut.

You do not want to compare numbers with superhandz they have millions of downloads and millions of hits. They are always getting commercials, television and movie deals. Superhandz videos are posted on 10s of thousands of websites across the world. not 10.

I was talking about is watching videos. It is true that there is a surplus of videos that all look the same by you kid magic flourishers. All your videos is boring after seeing the same things over and over. Show your laymen all of your videos, jasons, and the rest of you and they will yawn like we all do.

It is refreshing to see new concepts and ideas for those of us that do this every day. Creating is what artists do and that is what the hl challenges are for.
weapon
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Again.. forks and cards don't mix.... spatulas and cards don't mix...FEET and cards don't mix...lol in the ulmen challenge your in a old castle with guys in cloaks surrounding you holding torches while you do card manipulations...sounds like a tournament ot of a bad Jean Claude Van Damme flic ..but instead of kicking and punching...you do cuts and shuffles ..no offense.. but I love the free will of giving my opinion.
Eternity by Emran Riaz (Gimmicks + Download) An IMPOSSIBLE prediction of ANY number, ANY word, literally ENGRAVED in a medallion they've been holding THE ENTIRE TIME.
http://www.penguinmagic.com/p/12181
Seif
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Weapon comes straight out and says some pretty rude crap right off the bat by saying we are going "a little too far". Now personally I have seen some magicians do some pretty weird and sometimes stupid stuff in their acts if you ask me, so I don't see how we in any way are going overboard.

You "non-XCM'ers" have only explored one section of the art...cuts. The reason we do these experiments with different ideas and concepts is to expand. Well respected magicians expand their art every day by creating new ideas. Then people go out and change the idea up and call it their own. It's the same in both arts. Marius teaches the Impossible Stack (which I have seen and it's beautiful) and now there's 235782345 variations of a sybil.

In other words what I'm trying to say is...we don't tell you how to do your magic, don't tell us how to do OUR art. We are the ones how have tried, tested, and approved material beyond anything you guys have dreamed of, yet you act like you know everything and we should be bowing down to you. DON'T act like we don't know what we're doing..that's all I ask.
Fiddling-Steve
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I say xcm is going to far because they are in a magic forum in a flourishing board. Why do we even discuss this... I have no idea.

as far as originality is concerned, I'm still waiting to see an original XCM move by someone other than De'vo.

As for flourishing, people create new concepts all the time. We don't try to always have something new, we try to take what we know and apply it to something new. Look at Dan and Dave, noting like there stuff had every been seen before.

To address people saying we don't know xcm, I have a lot of xcm stuff, I know a lot of great flourishers do to. We have all the knowledge you have of xcm, I mean, without magicians you guys would be no where. You should be thanking the people like Marlo and Erdnase, because without them you be doing those "really stupid" sybils that everyone I know loves to see. (unlike the cobra cut)
Stick to the classics,

Stephen
artwo
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Ok first off. Cards cannot be underground. It is not hardcore. Nor is it extreme. A move can be unreleased, but it cannot be underground.

Also, I thought XCMers were supposed to be creative? Perhaps Steve was, god forbid, not doing a move he had read about, but was merely putting two one handed fans together. You can't tell him how to do his flourishes.

Also, I am pretty sure that cards were used for playing games with way before anyone did XCM and added Z's to words where they weren't needed.
Seif
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I was trying to HELP him make a better looking fan in order to show all indices, which looks a heck of a lot better than half indices/half blank...(once again telling me I don't know what I"m doing).

Another thing is...cards were used in games of manipulation BEFORE they were used with denominations on them. Cards were originally derived from Tarot in which the denominations had no game value until later changed.

The first real popular game was known as Deckel flipping and originated in Europe. THAT is where card games began.
Seif
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