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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The workers » » Dai Vernon- Card trick that cannot be explained (2 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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greydonthemagician
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Hey,
I was wondering if anyone has ever used this effect on laymen? how are the reactions? how do you introduce this effect? ever been stumped?
greydon
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Logan
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Well, it's hard to explain...
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AVirgaA
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Lol Logan! I found this thread concerning Dai Vernon's trick that refers to the presentation... http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......;forum=2

How would the reactions be? I personally, haven't performed this trick, but I'm curious to how others reactions are.

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dan84
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I perform it when I usually know I can only be bothered to do one effect and the reactions are amazing. In my experience this is the case others may disagree/
Charlie Justice
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I perform this particular effect as if I am explaining it. No special patter, just a straightforward approach lulling the spectator into believing that I am demonstrating how an effect was done by a great magician named Dai Vernon without knowing myself how it is he did it. I react in sympathy with the spectator as if I too am just a witness to a card trick that cannot be explained.
JeffWampler
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I do this all the time...for magicians and laymen alike...it's a really nice exercise in thinking on your feet and bringing the trick to a successful conclusion.

Depending on speed of execution, this trick is an absolute mind blower.
greydonthemagician
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I was wondering if anyone uses the pass to put the card where you want it?
thanx
greydon
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Jonathan Townsend
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Um... why?
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Ben Train
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I hope not.

that is directed towards the topic question.

This is an excercise, not a performance piece. Since what you shuld be showing layman is polished, even in a informal setting, I never see a reason to do this for them. For magicians, its cool. If your proficent enough you can fry.

Another experiment is to take a shuffled deck and cut to any four of a kind WITHOUT culling.
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S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2005-06-13 15:54, greydonthemagician wrote:
I was wondering if anyone uses the pass to put the card where you want it?

Only if you intend to ruin the effect.

This effect only works when no sleight-of-hand is involved. None. Whatsoever. Period.

Quote:
On 2005-06-13 16:19, Nordatrax wrote:
This is an excercise, not a performance piece.

I do a cousin: Harry Lorayne's Calculated Risk. It is most definitely a performance piece.
greydonthemagician
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Hey,
Thanx everyone for your input I will work on this a bit more before I perform.
greydon
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Ben Train
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I don't understand any argument for doing this in a show. Unless you have a great way to produce or reveal a card from every part of the deck, without looking like your thinking, I don't see how its good enough to perform.

Your essentially jazzing while getting paid. very unproffesional.

Also, why not do a trick that's carefully thought out and use the same patter (assuming you have pattr for it. Or maybe you jazz that too... very unproffesional).

I guarantee Ill get better reactions, and look better, doing a trick I have perfected then jazzing on the spot.

Its an exercise.

As far as practicing it more my freind, your not ready. we can talk about it at CAM, but your not ready. And neither is about 95% of magicians who do it.
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10cardsdown
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If you are polished, nobody knows your are "jazzin". So, if nobody knows, then there's no argument here. They just think that is the trick. Only you as an insider knows the difference, yet your argument is how the trick is perceived by the audience. Smile
Ben Train
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No.

you cant be polished while jazzing.

you might look good, they might not even know your jazzing, but if your good enough to do that youde do even better with a routine.

Im sorry, there is no sane argument for doing this trick in a paid performance.

Unless, and this is important, you have worked out a method that's impressive for EVERY CARD AT EVERY POSTITION. If you find the card and then try to figure out what to do with it, Ide be gald to follow you in a performance.

Now, I DO like mike closes the trick that CAN be explained, which is similar but much, much stronger.

This test your ability to think on the spot, estimate, rewards you for your knowledge of card magic, but is much better then vernons.
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Logan
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Personally, when I read the text on it, I was like, "Does this really work?"

I mean, how much can you rely on chance, probability and showmanship to pull you thru an effect?

I guess since I've never tried it I wouldn't know.

One thing's for sure though, it would DEFINITELY be an exercise and a test of showmanship and wits everytime one executes it.

I would like to hear though people's experience with this effect. What's the BEST and WORST you've ever gotten out of this effect?
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10cardsdown
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Maybe you "can't be polished" when jazzin', but I and many others can. Don't underestimate others just because it's not your cup of tea. Smile
Nik_Mikas
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It's technically impossible to be consistantly polished while jazzing as jazz magic is making stuff up as you go along. Perhaps after jazzing for a certain amount of time you will start to develope routines that stick, and you only change small parts each time you do it (such as the control involved, or something to that effect). But then you aren't really jazzing, as you know what you are doing.

It is possible to look like you know what you are doing some of the time (maybe even most of the time), but even then, it's still better to know what you are doing ahead of time. Making stuff up as you go along is doing a diservice to your audiences, who have probably paid you to show them your best rehersed magic routines.

Once again, I see nothing wrong with jazzing very small parts of your routines, as you are still on a set road that has been proven to bring good results. But making stuff up is a no no, especially when something as important as the climax is at stake.
Paul Sherman
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No less a master than Rene Levand said in "Magic of the Soul"

Quote:
The next series of routines appear to be improvisational. They in fact are not, as I never improvise due to the great respect I have for the audience...


I'm inclined to agree with Nordatrax. The reason magicians like Vernon's "Trick That Cannot Be Explained" is because magicians are hung up on method and there is no "method" for Vernon's trick. That's why, as an impossible location, it fools them. We expect tricks to work the same way every time. For a layperson, it's just an impossible location. They don't realize that there's "no method".

I do, however, think that Martin Nash's version of the Hofzinser Ace Problem which uses a "trick that cannot be explained" methodology to locate 3 of the aces is very strong and commercial. That's only because it's woven into a broader routine than your usual "pick a card" trick.

Even in jazz people don't, to my knowledge, improvise entire songs on the spot. They have a song they set out to play and improvise portions of it. I wouldn't expect an entirely improvised song to be very good, so I wouldn't think any better of an entirely improvised magic trick.
"The finished card expert considers nothing too trivial that in any way contributes to his success..." Erdnase



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mattisdx
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I've used the idea a couple of times to produce a totally impossible any card at any number effect from a shuffled deck that I never touched and about crapped my pants when it actually worked Smile
Ben Train
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Quote:
On 2005-06-13 22:07, 10cardsdown wrote:
Maybe you "can't be polished" when jazzin', but I and many others can. Don't underestimate others just because it's not your cup of tea. Smile


I don't believe it.

You and me obviously have a very diffrent deffinition of polised. For me, polished is: "having worked out of aspect of a trick, both presentationally and techiniqually, and having done it to the point where its second nature. Nothing is left to chance in the performance becasue youve prepared for every situation." your definition is?

because if its the same as mine then YOU CAN NEVER BE POLISHED WHILE DOING THE TRICK THAT CANNOT BE EXPLAINED.

Again, Ill mention mike closes version, which is wonderfull.

I mean no disrespect, and I am hounestly intregued with this topic, as its a "trick" I spen a long time working on.
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