Let his lungs rot

Hmmm,

My dear old dad once told me "be very wary of anyone who isn't nice to their waiter.
They're probably not a very nice person"

The same rule also seems to apply to peoples attitude towards prisoners, who for whatever unfortunate consequence of upbringinging or circumstance, leads them down the wrong path.

Anyway, I thought all you ouzzies were all of convict heritage

I thought you'd have more compassion

bb

Hay After they have served their sentence- I'll play it buy ear.

Whilst they are serving their sentence- that's a different story.

We all have choice despite what happens to us in life and the choice to go down the dark path is their choice.

Let me ask this tho

Would you perform for a group of Drug Dealers outside of prison in the local community hall
would you perform for a group of Pedophiles outside of prison
would you perform for a group of robbers outside of prison
and the list goes on-

The only difference between those who I have listed and those in prison are the ones in prison got caught otherwise they would still be doing it. and they will continue to do it once they get out.

If I may adjust this conversation for a moment. Every year I try and make at least a little time to do some community work (sometimes it's within my own state, often it’s not depending on what my tour schedule is like). But I try and give at least a little something back now and again through my artistic vocation.

While I understand that the prison system isn't for everybody I've rolled the idea of doing a show at one of them (I think spurned on by an article about prisoner’s reaction to seeing “Waiting For Godot”) for some time now.

So to anyone who’s worked as a performer for a prison before:
Did they contact you?
Did you contact them?
If you contacted them then who did you speak with?
Can you share your experiences with us a bit?

Thanks in advance to anyone that’s willing to answer the aforementioned questions.

Cheers,
-Matt (TK)

PS- Randy, I really enjoyed that story!

I have been thinking about magic tricks for prisons tho

Tatoo's are a big thing in prison

Perhaps an effect with tatoo's prediction card effect or that Blain thing where the name appears on your body - would go down well for those people.

As a an actor and drama worker first (mentalist second), prisons often haver vists from people in performing arts..not simply to entertain the prisoners but also to help express themselves thru' things like Art, Writting or Drama.

In my opinion, if prisoners were not being given the chance to express themselves creatively while "inside", I would deem that a form of 'creative torture'. Like solitary confidement for the creative side of the brain. I could on more about how Drama helps people connect with emotions and feelings that they have not necessarily experienced, and role-playing to help understand WHY people do certain things and act in certain ways....but I don't have time, and its not a drama board

Craig

Their not in prison on a holiday

Matt,

-Yes they contacted me
-A friend of mine works in a prison as a sport instructor.

I do not dress up in a suit or with a hat. I wear what I normally wear, baggy pants and a tshirt. I think this sort of made me blend into the group. What I found to out to be a really good ice-breaker is to shake everyone's hand and try to remember their names. Where I did my magic "youth detention"(12-18 yrs old), everyone was sort of loud, but really respectfull. I never felt uncomfortable or threathened.

Ice,

I totally respect your opinion.
And I see you points and they make sense.

I do not want to start a "pro" & "con" game. (pun intended)

Do you think people in prison have the right to:
-god's word
-a sport instructor
-a shrink
-a book (on magic?)

I sent one guy an old dai vernon book I had. After he gets out of prison, it might be hard to get a regular job. I sincerely hope he can make some money doing magic after he gets out. If that will take him from getting back to his old habits, it would be really cool.

all the very best,

Hay Mr Bungle

I don't talk about religion

but a sports instructer- I don't see why not. but I hope my tax dollars are not paying for it.
a shrink- yes it may help them or at least help us understand the why of crminal behaviour
A book on magic. sure.

Yes I would probably give all my dai vernon books away too and also the David Regal Book and Dan Harlen Impromptu Magic Videos. (actually I did give the regal book away but it wasn't to a prisoner)

I would hate to lose work because an ex crim was working for penuts and ruining the art.- but it happens anyway with amatures so I guess they just add to the pot.

I think that people who ruin other peoples lives should not receive benefits.
They should pay for their crimes. A drunk driver kills a pedestrian and gets 4 years- I life is in ruin and 4 years down the track this guy gets out after a prison sentence watching Magicians, getting taught how to play sport, I don't agree with this.

anyway I'm sick remembering so I'm not going to post on this topic again.

Thanks all

David Welzman

So you take a bunch of criminals who have commited a variety of offenses and lock them up. You take a bunch of murders, pedophiles, junkies, thieves, con men, pick pockets, burglars, muggers, members of the republican party, grafitti artists etc. and you lock them up.

Fair enough. They commited a crime, they should go to jail. Then what? A bunch of criminals locked up together. How do you control them? With a mix of rewards and punishment.

The ones who behave get little treats like magic shows, sports equipment, tv etc. The ones who don't behave get those things taken away. They are taught to be responsible for their actions.

You take a bunch of guys, tell them they are the scum of the earth and lock them away, they will not only stay the scum of the earth they will get worse. They'll serve their time, come out and do it again.

Of course, jails shouldn't be soft places but the occasional movie, magic show or 'treat' isn't spoiling the inmates. No matter how many treats they get, no prisoner wants to be in prison.

In the words of Krusty the Clown channeling Johnny Cash at Springfield Prison

"I slugged some jerk in Tahoe
They gave me one to three
My high-priced lawyer sprung me on a technicality
I'm just visiting Springfield Prison
I get to sleep at home tonight"

Thanks for the info mrbungle.

Cheers,
-Matt (TK)

Unfortunately the only thing that comes out of a prison most of the time is a better criminal. What else do they have to do with there time? Maybe if they are exsposed to hobbies other than those that are criminal, some of them might make the change for the better. I have worked in the penal system and not everyone in there is a saint by any strectch of the imagination. But, there are a few who are doing ther time and repaying there debt. I don't think it is a bad thing if you chose to offer your skills to entertain these people, who knows it might be something that you do that provents them from doing more harm to society when they are released. As far as doing shows for criminals already in society, how do you know that you haven't? Do you know what all drug dealers, pedophiles, etc. look like? I live in NYC and there are 10 million people here, I don't know for sure who is a criminal. The people responible for the Enron escapade wore nice expensive suits and drove nice cars and they ruined peoples lives. And, I'm sure you have broken a law or two in your lifetime, weather it be minor or not we all have, so you might want to get off that mountain before you get a nose bleed. You need to embrace your fellow man not dispose of them. "The mind is like a parachute, for it only functions when open." Good words to live by....

"it is nice to see that there is so many of you here tonight"
Just old line came in to my mind.

Hm. I've never been accused of being terribly open-minded, but then again...I'm not sure that a flapping cranium is indicative of a properly functioning brain. And, as the thread's token Republican, Nicholas' comments inspired me to weigh in supporting Ice.

If there can be circumstances under which an individual MUST behave illegally, then it logically follows that humans do NOT have free will and rationality. In order to maintain this view you must believe that humans are mechanisms who function in response to stimuli; prisoners are simply unfortunates caught by their own instincts. Ring that bell, Mr. Pavlov, it's dinner time.

I for one choose to believe that human beings are capable of making choices; that despite the lack of wings, we can devise aircraft and so ascend the skies. We may defy the elements by building dwellings, hunger by developing agriculture, and unlike the rest of the animal kingdom, our response to disease is not mere mortality -- but medicine.

A thinking human who can decide, or an automaton who cannot. I know the type I'd rather entertain.

Leland

I would say that I'm sorry that you are not terribly opened minded, but then you are happy that way. I do however feel for your audiences, if magicians were not open minded then how would we be able to think outside the box to create. I think you are more open minded then you think, or at least that is what I hope. Mr. Ice is the real prisoner here, for he has locked himself in a prison of his mind holding on to something terrible that has happened to him. It is time to build a bridge and get over it and stop holding on to negativity. It cannot be helpful to either you, your friends, family or your show. I'm not Republican nor Democrat nor anyother of the listed groups, I don't like nor trust anything they say. But that really has nothing to do with this. People do have free will and that is what makes us great. If you choose to do a crime then you should be punished according to the laws of your society. But, as we all know there are some who are punished even though they have done nothing wrong, but they are few and far between. If you choose not to entertain people that you do not feel are worthy then that is your choice and you don't have to defend it. But to take the stance that someone is wrong for doing so then you are trying to make them feel bad about their decission and therefore you are trying to affect their free will.

Well someone seems bitter.

I'll have you know that not EVERYONE in jail is a SOB!

I once got sent to jail in Georgia for driving on a suspended liscence for a parking ticket that I knew nothing about! THREE WEEKS and a $1600.00 (yes one thousand six hundred dollar) fine. It seems since I had been convicted of the same thing 9 years earlier, I was a "habitual offender" by Georgia law. So...jail - big fine. Does this make me a bad person?

By your way of thinking I'm no better than a child rapest.

THINK before you make "everyone" statements.

Azrael

Oh, and as for the performing while I was in jail - yep. Did every darn card trick I knew and could come up with.

Nice.....

Azrael,

At least you got in a lot of practice, right?

Cheers,
-Matt (TK)

PS- I think that you're right on with the point that you're making!

Azrael's experience with the Georgia penal system does seem to rebut any categorical statement about "everyone" in prison. It may be that some persons in prison have received overly-harsh judgments, and it's always theoretically possible that an innocent person languishes in some benighted corner of the uncaring system.

But it is also true that virtually every person in prison believes themselves to be either innocent or subject to mitigating circumstances. It is this sociopathic stubbornness about affirming their own contribution to their own detention that makes certain prisoners candidates for the attitude expressed by Ice. It is one thing to be in prison because of a snafu of some sort; it's quite another to be there because the other guy wouldn't hand over his money and had to be shot.

Are there innocent people in prison? Yeah, maybe. I hear there are amicably divorced couples, riches in multi-level marketing, and sometimes you really can grow new hair on a bald head -- so I suppose innocent prisoners are possible. But those aren't the ones being discussed. The ones who need to be incarcerated, the ones who can rot, are those who believe the only crime they committed was getting caught.

Leland

Yep (perfected a couple of passes and and a few other moves). The most BORING 3 weeks of my life.

Azrael