In you coin workers opinions what did you guys find was the hardest and easiest coin sleight to achive? And around how long did it take to perfect?

At first I thought the Muscle Pass was hardest, but once I figured it out, it's pretty easy. I can't seem to get the Himber vanish 100%. The coin is supposed to fall and land on the pinky. I can do that about 80% of the time, but it's still pretty knacky. For the hardest....I'd have to go with either backpalming 40 coins and producing them one by one, and musclepassing a jumbo coin.

The himber vanish as a click pass is pretty difficult took me a while to perfect.

The way we know to perform it today is I believe an adaptation of Bobby Bernard but it was such a minimal change he chose not to take credit...when I showed my attempt to Bobby he ripped me to shreds on it and proceeded to show me how it should be done....3 coins vanished at once!

I haven't had much joy with Backplam but I put that down to not finding the correct size coin for my hands.

As far as the easiest sleight I would have to go with the Universal Drop or the Floor Vanish (Coin falls rolls under the furniture, vanishes!)

I'm not sure if I would class any coin sleight as easy, it took me years to perfect the French Drop, not becasue the mechanics are difficult but because making things look natural takes a lot of work.

Sol Stones tripple spellbound change in Coinmagic (not the C/S version)is fairly difficult as it is difficult on angles.

Folks find the Sylvester Pitch pretty difficult many times. It's a great sleight that opens the door to a myriad of vanishes, changes, and productions. In his hands it's magic, but clearly not one of the easiest sleights to command in the hands of others. It's a real beauty of a move though, one of the very best I've seen.

****....

Jonathan Townsends edge grip to edge grip change is one of the hardest moves to execute flawlessly. The problem with the move isn't the actually mechanics, it's getting the move to look natural. My fingers show adjustment as the technique takes place. I try to cover the move by turning inward at the wrist to cover the finger movement, as I bring the coin to my mouth to blow on it. I just can't get the *** timing down....

To connect with ones audience is perhaps the one that took and is taking the longest.

My one handed version of Howard Schwarzman 2 coin switch, took me the longest.
The coin goes up silver and comes down as a copper.

Last month I got a chance to talk with him several times. It was one of the highlights of going to the Boston Convention for the Society of American Magician's. It was great watching him share the 2 handed version.

I hear there are a couple(perhaps more) of others doing this.(one handed) It looks very pretty.

Harris "Palms of Aluminum Foil" Deutsch
For the lighter side of coin magic

And arguably the most important component of any magic.

In Tarbell 7, David Roth released a vanish that's got a moment of sheer terror in it, especially for anyone who finds the Himber vanish risky. You'll have to look it up to get the specifics, but it's fair to say that the coin takes a 6"- 8" free fall into the Himber vanish position. Miss the catch for any reason, and the coin hits the floor.

But for sheer "No way I'm learning that" thrills, you can't beat the understated work of the old masters. In "More Magic" Hoffman describes a vanish in which you smack the coin onto your left palm, only to cause it to bounce back invisbly, where it's caught in right hand classic palm position. No fair using your fingers to palm the coin, that ruins the illusion. Your palm just grabs the coin out of the air. Yikes.

Oops, Curtis posted before I had a chance to edit my posting.

Wanna talk about sleights that are not only difficult but strange? Believe it or not, I developed a Han Ping Chein from armpit. When the angles are right, it's invisible and incredibly effective. The problem is that the angles aren't right unless the audience consists of one-eyed blind people, and even then, total darkness wouldn't hurt.

One of the most difficult coin "moves" (not really a sleight) for me was the four coin roll down. I don't know why it took me so long, but my fingers couldn't figure it out until I practiced it for months.

Interesting....but is a sleight difficult because it's difficult to you, or because it is truly a difficult sleight to master? I mean, some people on the forum have mentioned how hard it is for them to develop a good classic palm, does that make it a "difficult" sleight? I don't think so, but I think there are sleights that are truly very difficult, possibly to learn and or to do effectively.

Well I'm looking on individuals opinions for some the same sleight might not be difficult for others.

Larry I feel your pain on the coin roll down man. I didn't get the coin roll down until I started practicing a much harder display, the downs coin star with 5 coins. I couldn't get that *** thing to work for months, then I tried working on the star and everything fell into place.....

For me, putting a difficult sleight in context of a larger action or routine helps me in developing not only the mechanics of the move, but the timing and rationale of why the move is deceptive.

Eric, said like a true worker.

Eric, as Larry said, very well said my friend!

I found the muscle pass and coin roll easy. The hardest move that I have ever tried to master is having a silver coin resting on the palm and a copper in tenkai pinch. Now toss the copper coin up while moving the silver coin into pinch position, and catch the copper coin. Do all this with the rythmn and ease of casually tossing a silver coin in the air, to achieve a very visual transformation to copper. Can't remember the name of the move, but my first exposure to it was in Mendoza's "Book of John"

Some of Shoot's stuff is hard. He has a super clean one handed coin vanish via the back of the hand that I'd love to be able to do.

IMNSHO - The Classic Palm...

I have seen more "expert coinmen" with tells than I can count. Classic palming a coin/coins without tells is very difficult. Since the Classic Palm is so useful, and so often used, it is the most "difficult, to me...

Best, PSC

P.S. After that, I would second Curtis' Hoffmann reference, along with the Downs "Eureka Coin Pass", the vanish and reproduction of multiple coins, or the passing of five coins thru the body from/to the "Coin Star" position...

Maybe its just me, but the deep back clip has given me the fits.

Paul Chosse has an excellent comment! When we talk about "achieve" what do we mean? Satisfactory to ourselves (meaningless really)? To CP reasonably is a few weeks/months work; to execute like a master - half a lifetime. That can also probably said for many other sleights too.

Hi Paul, in your opinion do the "expert coinmen" you mentioned have tells for laymen or for other magicians?