This is problem number 5 in a series. To read problem number 1 and to understand the guidelines for posting, please read this thread:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......tart=0#3

ETHICS PROBLEM #5

Situation: Charlie is a magician with several decades of experience. At his local magic club, he has become a mentor to several younger magic aficionados. Charlie will only share his knowledge with those he considers to be serious students. He regularly teaches sleights, moves, and methodologies for any effect his proteges ask him to.

Question: Is he acting ethically?

Discuss.

Yes.
I believe older magicians should pass it on to those sincere in their quest for magic knowledge.

I hope Charlie is also citing the sources for the material and encouraging them to find things in the books where the stuff came from. Ethical... I believe so.

Mentorship is in some ways a better process than the current autodidact thing we have today. Some guys got to learn from Slydini. Others got to learn from Fred Kaps, Tommy Wonder or Peter Kane. Hofzinser had students. John Ramsay had at least one student. Thanks to them we have some of the material in books now.

I agree.

And of course there might be some magic that Charlie has learned that he shouldn't teach to others unless he gets permission to do so from the creator/owner. These would include, but aren't limited to, marketed tricks that spring from original owned ideas, as opposed to recreations of old unowned material that was published by long deceased magicians.

If the material is old enough, it is in the public domain. There is nothing ethically or legally wrong with that. See the guidelines Phaedrus posted earlier for cutoff times. More modern material might be problematic. The mentoring programs that our magic clubs have generally use examples from the public domain.

Mentoring programs generally give the students a "taste" of magic. Also, in the case of the people that I personally mentor, I work with material they have already purchased and show them how to make it more effective.

Now that is an ethic I can share!

Cheers,

Tom

Yes. No problems here.

These are all really easy, Phaedrus! Are you going to give us something remotely borderline?

What about a guy who buys material, sells it on like old Thrifty did, deletes his copies, but makes copious notes in his own words copies the illustrations with his own sketches, and continues to perform the effects. I'm not suggesting this is discussed here, as you are doing the biz, but it could be worth #6 or whatever.

Go ahead and take the next step. The guy then publishes his re-write...

BlackShadow:

To be honest, I expected MUCH more dissension than we have currently seen. Sharing of information is an extremely sensitive issue here on the Magic Café, and I have seen people argue vociferously against the kinds of situations I have given here. I thought people would come out of the woodwork to take issue with the actions I posited here, but maybe they were all busy this weekend.

For the record, I think it's a good idea to push the parameters of the situation I've given, so feel free to ask anything that furthers the issue. How about it, everyone? What about the situation BlackShadow gives: do the ethics of the situation change if the person selling the material has made notes and sketches for his own use?

IMHO if they are using the data from the book, recoded into their notes or not, then they are using (what is in) the book.

These questions are getting harder for me. Seems OK so long as he has permission from the inventors etc . I would prefer him to restrict his teaching to one, a sorcerers apprentice so to speak. That seems extreme but I like the idea of having a few magician who have many secrets than many magician who have few secrets.
Not sure he should be teaching all they ask but maybe he should only teach what he believes they deserve.

Tommy:

What exactly do you mean by permission from the inventors?