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Bradacal Special user 591 Posts |
Lately I have heard more about magicians who telemarket their shows to the communities they tour to and perform in. Because the magician or magician's company can't be in every town to promote there show(s), I have heard of them doing this. How do they go about doing so? I notice it happens in Canada but maybe even in the states. I am interested in how this works and how magicians get involved with this. Is there any process?.... just curious ....
Any info is great. |
Dennis Michael Inner circle Southern, NJ 5821 Posts |
There are two main methods. Stan Kramien has a soup to nuts course on telemarketing. It's a "boiler room" operation and requires committment, and with today's laws, a good lawyer.
Basically, it calling people and asking for donations for a fund raising illusion show. The second method is similar but it isn't a "boiler room" operation. It is John Kaplan's program, and a sponsor does vaious "piggyback" mini fundraisers. It is a better system then the previosly mentioned one. You will spend several hundred dollars buying these marketing products. Jim Snack talks about doing ice cream socials as fund raisers. Before you jump into this field, do your homework, because there are laws regulating these type of operations.
Dennis Michael
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Tyler_Magician Special user 509 Posts |
I personally can't stand telemarketing. If you think it is a good idea, then do what you think is right. Just watch out, in our area, and I don't know if this is everywhere or not, but there is a do not call list hat you can get your number on If you get called by a telemarketer, they get fined.
-Tyler |
Brent McLeod Inner circle 1792 Posts |
The World Festival Of Magic that tours here each year with Chuck Jones in a 90 min show with all the Big Illusions is sold soley on telemarketing!
They target business on the pretext of helping lower income families to see a show supported by local Lions Club foundation etc The tour incorporates about 50-60 full shows in different cities in NZ & Australia-they get good crowds 1 problem is local stage performers trying to get gigs after these tours-very difficult as well as the absolute killing they make on the shows -I know for a fact they oversell every show by 2-3 times but the business that pay for the tickets never see them ,they get a nice certificate about there donations, hence why a 1000 seat theatre will have been sold out twice etc & only 1000 tickets are actually distrubuted for that particular show-So Lots of money is made on every show Telemarketing at times is so tough for local performers but it seems to work for certain events |
genemccarthy New user 82 Posts |
Hi Brent, I ran across this old thread searching for something unrelated. But felt I should address the telemarketing question.
Many performers feel it might be an answer for their shows. But like the talent presented on these tours, it entails years of training for an office manager to be responsible for a staff of sales personnel. The nuances and details of the telemarketing business, if done properly, are as delicate and intricate as those of a professional performer. We have had shows tour in 6 different countries and the taxes, laws, Immigration and customs in each are decidedly different. In Australia various government agencies dictate much of what we can and cannot do. Shows are not oversold although there are dates where sales for a particular show are low and more tickets than sold are given to indigent families who normally cannot attend. Businesses often retain the tickets for their staff but the charities offer the option of distributing the tickets to less fortunate in the business’ name. The charities, regardless of the sales figures, always retain a profit. Whereas my company loses monies annually on many dates. The reason for this is that the $6,000.00 netted by a Sponsor in a smaller city where our share is not enough to even cover the show costs, and the 3,000 people attending the shows, is as important to them in their communities eyes as the $100,000.00 netted by a Sponsor in a larger metropolitan area. This years Festival of Magic tour will play 162 shows in 101 days, on 2 continents and 4 islands. Between talent, stage staff, theatres, printing, data, offices, telephones, trucks, vehicles, air cargo, air fares, Visas, hotels and data, we might retain a 2% profit margin. We also Produce the Circus Quirkus, The Paul Royter Show and Razz-ma-Tazz. And most professionals will tell you that The World Festival of Magic is good for their business. The public, following one of our shows will more readily think of a magician for Johnny’s birthday party. I hope this cleared up some misconceptions regarding our business. And good luck. gene mccarthy http://www.worldfestivalofmagic.com |
jamesbond Loyal user 249 Posts |
My friend,
I have personally did this for about 3 years. 1. put it bluntly if you want to make some serious $$$ in this business you better have some serious backers behind you... Not every date will be profitable and you must be able to carry these loses. 2. Do you REALLY want to manage bunch of deadbeats in the phone room? Trust me that's the people who apply for these types of jobes... I KNOW, been there done that... They don't give a darn about anything... 3. Are you ready to work 16-18 hour days when on the road? Trust me it's EXTREMELY tiring... Unless you have a large crew and when you starting you usually won't - get ready to be tired BEFORE you actually step on the stage to do the show... 4. I know of a guy in Canada (Murray Hatfield) who has the best of both worlds - the telemarketing comp. pays him to produce the show, sells the tickets (sweeeet), furnishes the tour bus and also gives him budget to buy the illusions they gross approx. 1.5 - 2 mil. per year (approx. 60 cities across Canada). But keep in mind the promotion company is a huge publicly traded company... The sponsor usually gets about 10% of the gross... 5. Bottom line you better have some serious backers... or have your folks get you going with at least 100K to start... (the show, offices, long distance, predictive dialers, constant stream of deadbeats to fill in the phones and be ready that even when you sell the tickets only about 50% of the people who said yes will actually shell out the money... sad but true... 6. Ungreatful sponsors. Yup. My friend after all your hard work and your measly marginal profit MANY of the sponsors feel like you should be giving them half of the money. they don't see the blood sweat and tears you put into selling those darn tickets. many of them instead of being greatul for making them some $$$ look at you more like a bloodsucker that is taking advantage of them... Sad but very very true. 7.Competition. Since the times of Stan Kramien who did this in the 70's and 80's the competion exploded in this field thanks to low long distance rates and predictive dialers. Most people in this day and age are VERY sick of getting hussled. I even spoke to Jay Owenhouse (about 4-5 years ago) about this and he told me that he is planning to get out of this business... 8. You better be an excellent business man my friend and be ready not to have any social life if you plan to do this by yourself as a "one man operation".... 9. If you do you will discover that by the time you add up all the time you put into it the "regular gigs" will look REALLY good a once. You will discover that there is an amazing amount of freedom in the fact that you can finish a show, close the case, get your cheque from a corporate clent and drive off with your peace of mind... Sorry if I am sounding negative, but honestly THINK ABOUT THIS how many SUCCESSFUL (AND STILL HAPPY AND BALANCED!!!) PERFORMERS DO YOU ACTUALLY KNOW DOING THIS??? the failiure rate is VERY VERY high. And there is lots of time and $$$ that you need to put out to even get in the game... Just wanna help felow magi... Bond...James Bond... |
TheDean Inner circle Reno, Nevada 2164 Posts |
James sure seams to knows what he's talking about here!
I am at your service and In HIS Service, Dean "Been There, Done That Touring business" Hankey <>< PS CAN it work... yes! Is what James outlined true... YES!
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success! "Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…" (*Marketing Doctor) |
Murray Hatfield Regular user Canada 150 Posts |
Hi Bond, James Bond,
Yes the telemarketing biz is a tough one and getting tougher all the time. What with new laws and (in Canada) huge bonds and/or government guarantees it can be almost impossible. My situation is good although not quite what you had written. I am hired to produce the show for our annual Canadian tour and yes the telemarketing company sells the tickets, arranges the sponsors and books the venues. I am responsible for every other aspect of the show from hiring the acts, dancers, drivers and technicians to the airlines, the bus,the 5 ton truck, and everything in between. The bus and truck are not provided by the company but rather come directly out of my pocket. I am fully responsible for all transportation for the tour and when situations arise, such as weather related problems or breakdowns, it is entirely up to me to fix it (and pay for it). Also, it is my obligation to provide an ENTIRELY different show every year. As this includes the illusions that I perform - this is a MAJOR expense and also comes directly out of my own pocket. There is no "illusion budget". While I am able to recirculate some of the illusions in my arsenal - nothing is repeated on the tour in under 5 years. In the 18 years that I've been headling the show I have featured 50 - 60 major illusions. Add to this new costumes every year and the occasional backdrop, video projector or special effect and it adds up. As a result of our work and the fact that the show is entirely new every year we have a return rate of over 50 percent in most markets and as high as 78 percent in some cities. We have a loyal fan base, many of whom have been coming to the show for as long as I've been doing it. Add to that that millions of dollars that have gone to the many charitable organizations involved and it's a great and worthwhile project. And don't kid yourself - many of the sponsoring organizations have contracts that guarantee much more than 10 percent of the gross. As to the negative aspects of the telemarketing game - yes there are some and, quite frankly, I don't think I'd be doing this if I had to do the other side as well. It's a tough game and definitely not for the faint of heart. Besides - it's enough work to put the show together, hire all the staff, arrange the logistics, build the props, edit the music, rehearse and then do over 80 shows in 30 cities in 6 weeks.... I'll stick with my side of it. Still Happy and Balanced after 18 years(mho) Murray Hatfield |
magic icebreakers New user 34 Posts |
Rick Allen has an excellent teleseminar on CD on specifically cold calling and telemarketing. I would highly recommend checking it out...
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Christopher Starr Inner circle Heart of America 1850 Posts |
Murray,
I had no idea that you had been doing this for 18 years! Congratulations! All I have ever been able to see are your promo videos, and they look top notch. And thanks for providing your insight into the discussion. |
jamesbond Loyal user 249 Posts |
Hi Murray,
Thanks for clearing some things up... When I mentioned 'balanced' people I had in mind performers that perform AND sell the tickets too - not too many of those! LOL Thanks for chipping in in this discussion! Bond... James Bond |
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