It seems everytime I make a post on a mentalist board and they see my avatar I'm begged to drop my character, as bizzarists are always out of work (there opinion). Just for the record I am definately content with working a part time job and doing what I consider to be an art, than to become a cookie cutter mentalist just to fatten my check book. So I was just curious if there are bizzarists who do make a decent income and what your opinion to all this is?

It seems odd, when I was a magician everyone would tell me how important a character is. Now I'm a mentalist everyone tells me to drop my character! I'm very confused....

Ignore everyone and do what you know works for you.

Yeah thanks spellbinder, that what I figured and have been doing. Im still curious though how good of a living bizzarists make?

Hate to say it, but it sounds a bit like stereotypical discrimation, or snobbery, for lack of a softer term, to me.
"Out of work" ? Says whom ? More so than any other genre of magician ?
Perhaps instead it lends credence to the stereotype of mentalists being all about prestige, which is unfortunate.
Either way, it bodes less well for them than it does bizarrists, you do what you want to, Reiks.
That bugs me. I thought we could consider the mentalists to perhaps be among our closest cousins, but some of them feel that bizarrists need be pitied for some reason.
I'll give them the benefit of the doubt though, and rather than stereotype them as some of them have done bizarrists, I'll take the position that a select few mentalists have this mindset, not the representative majority of them.
I know of a few who have posted here and they were good folks; we seemed to have found a lot in common, actually.

However, to answer the question, I don't do magic for a living. I couldn't even make a decent living playing music, and that's my primary artistic skill/ability. Not many get to perform their chosen art for a living, I'm okay with the day job just so long as a I have enough personal time to persue my personal interests.
Performing for a living is tough, always has been, always will be.

Do not give up Reiks

You have one of the very most important things to help you progress in ANY genre of magic (apart from sing some Black Artefacts effects that is), you have a character.

This comes through in the presentation of our website.

I should think that the same percentage of 'Bizarre' magicians earn their living from magic as that of any other genre of magic - very few make a full time living. In the entertainment world most performers are 'semi-pro'. Nothing wrong with this at all.

Keep at it.

Keith Hart

(apart from sing some Black Artefacts effects that is)

That should of course read USING Black Artefacts effects. At the moment we do not set them to music

Keith Hart

Don't worry, you can make a good living with bizarre magic.
But, as any other art form, you must be atop. I was a sport teacher before I decided to do magic 24 hours a day. I never regret the switch.

I don't know.... Max Maven doesn't look like he's starving (and brother he's more bizarre than all of us put together - lol).

Tony Andruzzi did ok in his time here on this blue/green marble.

Tony "Doc" Sheils didn't do too bad.

Tony Raven, Larry White, Charles Camron, and many others did and are doing well.

Be yourself. It's an original idea way ahead of it's time. ;0)

Bizarre=not working? Gee, tell that to Chriss Angel, Jeff McBride and even me! Chirss Angel's off Broadway show brought in over a quarter of a million dollars in less than six months. If that's "not working," then, by all means, throw me in THAT briar patch!

There are plenty of places where a non-traditional look will sell. Let's face it - Max Maven has hardly what anyone could call a "mainstream" look, nor does Eugene Burger or even Franz Harrary. However, the last time I looked, they were all working pretty steadily and for some pretty respectable money, too.

Remember, they said the same thing about the Beatles and the Rolling Stones and their look. All they did was pioneer a fashion revolution as well as a musical one, so what do "they" know?

Lee Darrow, C.H.

I agree with what everyone is saying. I'm in the music business and I remember when Marilyn Manson came out and called himself the anti-christ. He has made tens of millions through his character. In everything, it takes real passion and genius. If you want to make David Copperfield money doing Bizarre magic, IT IS POSSIBLE. Remember, what separated him from the rest of the Magic pack was his presentation and storytelling. These elements mixed with his skills and backing made him HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS! Theere has not been a multi-millionaire bizarrist yet, but you could be the first......or the second(if I get there first):)

We're in good company, it seems...Melville ended his days as a clerk, Van Gogh as an ear-deprived lunatic, Poe died of drink or hydrophobia in a Baltimore gutter, Hemingway of a...shooting mishap, O'Keefe achieved fame largely post-humously (yeah, that was her preference, but it kinda fit the theme I've got going here), and few people can even pronounce the name of Mt. Rushmore's sculptor. Except the Natives, who revile him as a despoiler of nature.

I've never really been comfortable with the whole 'starving/suffering/sacrificing for one's Art' routine. Personally, I think the Kincade model is more my style, and any questions about the "value of my contribution to the Art for the ages yet to come " I leave to the ages themselves. They're on their own.

Leland

T-Ray:
In reference to the talentless Manson making million$ from his act, I think Lisa Simpson speaks best for me:
"Pandering to teen angst -- like shooting fish in a barrel."

Granted, I'm only a part time performer, and most of my magic income comes from busking. . . you can make a pretty decent living doing private parties and renting out the (cheap) back rooms in pubs and the like to put on small shows. Bizarre is best with a small audience anyway. I do a seance a couple times a year in my basement for 12 people at a time, charging $13 a piece. It's not a huge amount, but it works.

NightBringer, I've been reading your interactions on the new forum. I know you're taking a beating and feeling it, but don't take it too personally. They are, for the most part, funda-mentalists (though they have a lot of good information you can learn, asking them about being a bizarrist is a bit out of their area). I've been reading your contributions around here for a while now, and I think you've got some great ideas going. Keep on keepin' on, man.

Mark

Leland, exactly! Whose to say this doesn't work for magic, especially when every show on the disney channel is a witch or psychic show (angry kids wishing that they had REAL magical powers)! There are a lot of gothic teenagers and plenty of Hot Topics stores in every mall. The psychological subtleties of how to tap into these demographics is where the genius part comes in........

Reiks, You know from past conversations that I like your look and your site and I will offer you advice which I havent heard yet.

Don't change your look change your location.
You may want to consider a more urban area like N.Y. or Chicago.

Best,
Sebastian Black

Hey everyone thanks for the great replies. Sebastian, great advice, yes I plan on moving to california as soon as I can. Though I may have somewhat of a chance here in the meantime, they just opened a hot topic in our local mall and EVERYONE suddenly thinks they're goth, quite funny to see someone with a green john deer baseball cap wearing bondage pants.Thanks for the encouragement lastnitesfun, yeah I never asked there opinion on anything relating to my image or character but they always give me one anyway hehe.

Hey T-ray, I'll race ya .


On a separate note Leland Stone, that's your opinion manson is talentless, I happen to like his music very much because I've never heard anything like it, well, Alice Cooper or PM5K comes the closest. I respect your opinion though.