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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
...But Lo! many of the likes of us so called "Bizarrists" are actually the least bound to the confines of superstitions and the like...
Outsiders are all too fast to proclaim, "He worships that skull, that idol..." whence in reality we see such objects as tools, symbols containing within them the occult secrets from ages gone by... Further, the so called Bizarrist often sees the Perennial Unity in the many mystic, (or religious for this matter)paths...the One is seen in the ALL, and the ALL is seen within the One. Such a noble perception rewards us with an opened mind, allowing for our inspiration and utilizations to come from many angles, many cultures, many Spirits...S/he does not seek to separate, to divide, but rather to include pieces of the whole into a wonderous, enlightening work... We hold the Oldest Key to Magic(k)...Storytellers are indeed of the strongest Shaman, Healer...we are, like them, able to reach perhaps previously unknown depths of being within both our selves, and others, with our approach to the craft. Bizarre magic, with its many symbols, and ideals, is the perfect medium to impart greater Wisdom, greater Understanding to others. Whether it is used to pull out the deepest of fears in another...or whether it is used to strengthen one's desire to uncover the mysteries of Self, it is and always has been a powerful tool to open the paths of the would be witnesses. ...I am not saying that its our job, but its our chance... Ah, other than that...Viva Bizar! |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
Taking the first part a bit further, I'm sure that not only do some bizarrists merely look upon the tools of the trade as mere props, but even have the opportunity to treat them with an ironic minimum of respect; where many folks might run screaming from the sight of an ouija board, a bizarre magician manipulates it with a twinkle in his eye and an M5 on his knee.. not saying it's disrespectful to do so, but merely illustrating that fact that it's often used as a prop and nothing more. Worship indeed. hah !
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
Excellent point oh doer of all things apparently evil!
I was just in NYC and went to Chinatown...I was amazed to see in one shop a HUGE Buddha...the Lord of ALL renuciation....people would walk up to him and throw coins and bills at the image, in hopes of a blessing...oh, the irony... |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
The Way of the Buddha is The Middle Way, the path between extremes. Giving coins and bills to an image of the Buddha is a form of sacrifice, and one hopes the money goes to a good cause and not to line the pockets of the shop owner!
Baba said: "Further, the so called Bizarrist often sees the Perennial Unity in the many mystic, (or religious for this matter)paths...the One is seen in the ALL, and the ALL is seen within the One. Such a noble perception rewards us with an opened mind, allowing for our inspiration and utilizations to come from many angles, many cultures, many Spirits...S/he does not seek to separate, to divide, but rather to include pieces of the whole into a wonderous, enlightening work..." All mystical paths lead to the same goal. Some may be shorter, others longer, some are straight and difficult, others are winding and more comfortable, but at the end they join. Even the Path That Is No Path will get you there! I perform to set people on their own path, to make them question consensual reality, to understand that all is Maya, illusion. The Goddess Maya may then herself lead people to Nirvana. My "props," at least those that should be accorded respect, I treat with the reverence they deserve. One should not revel in superstition, however. Tools are tools; they may be used to reach higher realms, but the power resides in oneself.
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
Indeed, the Middle way is the way of no way...and youre right it is the very act of sacrifice that gives solace, comfort to the seeker...but many do this for desirious ends...to gain materially etc...
in Voudou and many, many other paths from anciency, they would sacrifice their most prized goat, sheep et al in hopes of appeasing the Gods for something or other...it is supposed to show that one is willing to give their most prized possession to the Chosen Deity in an effort of respect, and awe... its still ironic, however, that one would throw money at an image of one who left all the riches in world to live as a beggar...but like you said, its the very element of sacrifice itself that has within it the ability to produce the real magic within one's Self... ...then again the preacher drives a Caddy to his sunday job... and I admit,its not the material, but the desire for them that will bind one to the wheel of suffering... there is a story about another beggar, a King in his own right who willingly gave his own body upon a wooden cross, so that others may find their own way within them selves...he seemed to show that giving up the material body is the highest sacrifice that could be made for collective humanity... and yes, even superstition will bring one Home eventually...I was initiated into the school of Vodou and Yoga in hopes of power and the like...eventually I found these to be more desires hidden in the form of worship...and now I am Awakened! our goal, if any is to become THAT which we honor, worship, adore, respect, seek for salvation... OM... |
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T-RAY Inner circle 1539 Posts |
Gede, isn't it funny how everything reveals itself? These insights when used properly can definitely raise our art and our ability to reveal to others.
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
"and yes, even superstition will bring one Home eventually...I was initiated into the school of Vodou and Yoga in hopes of power and the like...eventually I found these to be more desires hidden in the form of worship...and now I am Awakened!"
Yes, even the desire for liberation can be a chain around one's neck. "there is a story about another beggar, a King in his own right who willingly gave his own body upon a wooden cross, so that others may find their own way within them selves...he seemed to show that giving up the material body is the highest sacrifice that could be made for collective humanity..." Yes, Baba, all these Great Ones teach the same message, spoken in the language of Their listeners. Once one has seen the moon, what need is there for the pointing finger?
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
Well, I might want to point out a particular crater ..
:) That's the astronomy hobbyist in me talking tho
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
Beautiful, Master Bill...
and among the many "fingers," duly and verily the notion of superstition is one of the phalanges indeed... it was the advent of death, among other reasons that religion was born...the early ones began to think that a "Something" "Somewhere" had to be responsible...soon the very dead was revered, worshipped in hopes of gaining understanding of the living's inevitable destiny...the ancestors, they thought, must have the answers... if one didn't fear death, than s/he would most likely not bother with religion and all its empty promises (my opine) of the hereafter...tis better that we find the meaning of the Here, the Now, for that is the only "thing" Eternal, everlasting...the past is history, the future a mystery, but the Now is here, eternally, Granny used to say... and, youre right, the same that free is the same that binds, ad infintum... I will hitherto argue, from the posts ive read already, that of all the branches of magic(K), Bizarre magic has within it the possiblity to actually ENLIGHTEN the would be mage... |
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Leland Stone Inner circle 1204 Posts |
Hm. It seems to me that not all teach the same message, since the messages "all is illusion" and "I am the way, the truth, and the life" are irreconcilably opposed. The one message is self-stultifying; for if all is illusion, then so is the statement itself and there cannot be knowledge. Even the knowledge that there is no knowledge is knowledge, and thus it's an illusion, and so on. The cycle infinitely repeats, so that there is ultimately no knowledge, no enlightenment, no meaning and therefore nihilism. By contrast, the other message says that truth exists and can be known.
In order to affirm that all great teachers reveal the same message regardless of their faith, one must abandon rationality, a leap that even the Dalai Lama will not make. Despite his work towards unity, His Holiness has proclaimed that Christianity and Buddhism are incompatible, a view that is shared by Christianity's founder. |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
Going back (me, that is) to the profoundness, while the seeking and the desire are chains of suffering, they are also perhaps the very things that bring meaning to life.
What could you possibly do if you knew everything and had everything, everything = nothing ? The ultimate contentment ? There's a fine line between contentment and complacency. We'd be bored out of our gourds. Without desire, there is no ambition, no drive, no exploration, no point to living, frankly. That is what defines us. Doesn't' matter if we really get everything we want or not, as is usually experienced every Christmas morning - the real fun is in the expectation and the anticipation. The actual receipt of such things is often anti-climatic.
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
We will not spend the remainder of the thread on Christianity, but...
when "he" said I AM the way, the Key words are IAM, this is a principle, a metaphysical one at that...the IAM is the SELF, and the SELF is the only thing REAL... Christ is a consciousness...why cant we just admit that...no one else will save you...your Christ within is your only hope for salvation...Christ means "Annointed," "enlightened,"...it is a state of (no) mind where duality is married into ONE Self... ...that said, I love and welcome your thoughts master Leland...... |
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Leland Stone Inner circle 1204 Posts |
<<<<mook, not a master
You've made a claim of knowledge, Gede, and therefore it's an illusion. Unreal, untrue, unsubstantive, non-existent...even the electrons used to convey the adjectives describing these thoughts are less than dreams. Who is this Leland of whom you speak? Why do you believe it possible to communicate, where no two minds exist to commune? Sorry, but on that side of The Looking Glass, it's impossible to continue. |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
Ultimately, it is a marriage of the apparently TWO: real/illusion, good/bad...it is trancendent of our vain explanations indeed..i have no choice but to (apparently) contradict myself, for I see the unity in the Paradox...I see the sacred in the profane...on and on...
the reality of the Illusion, my good mook , is the fact that even if "THIS" is a "dream," it is still REAL to itself as a DREAM/illusion... so it the balance that we seek, the unity that we seek o'er again... and, one cannot be saved without the Guru/Master, but Lo! the Guru cannot save a single one... |
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Mystician Inner circle Wallachia 3485 Posts |
Look out for flying grey matter, my head's gonna explode ..
hehe
Just hanging out with the rest of my fellow dregs.
http:// www . phrets . com Visit http://www.bizarremagic.net |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Quote:
On 2005-11-03 15:20, Leland Stone wrote: Leland, although this is not he proper place for a religious discussion, and I see where you are coming from, I must disagree. The message is not "all is illusion" in any sense. This idea derives from the background in which Buddhism arose. Again, the message is certainly not "all is illusion," but that one can seek inward to reach a place of Truth and Holiness, bliss and peace, whether you call it Nirvana, Christ-consciousness, the Brahman, the Overself, conversation with one's Holy Guardian Angel, or whatever. I is the ancient "TAT TVAM ASI" -- "Thou Art That." "I AM THAT I AM" in the Bible. "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life" obviously to me, if not to you, reflects this same idea. Arguing that "all is illusion" is self-stultifying, is pure sophistry, a twist of the meaning, and a misunderstanding of what is being expressed. The point is that it is our own ignorance of who and what we really are that brings on the illusion that we are separate from the rest of creation. We suffer because of this ignorance. The illusion is that we are something different, something apart from the divine, that we are apart from "the great chain of being." As a practicing Buddhist, I can assure you that His Holiness the Dalai Lama did not mean Christianity and Buddhism are incompatible on a deeper level. Superficially, AS PRACTICED, they are incompatible. At their core, they are not. After all, we have Christian groups that teach hatred (check out godhatesfags.com, as an example), Christians have had the Inquisition, witch burnings and Crusades. I am not saying that Christianity is black and Buddhism is white, (Buddhism is not entirely free of such nastiness), but that we can look at both faiths on a deep level or a superficial one, and they are not very different once we get down to the basic messages that they offer.
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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Gede Nibo Inner circle 2447 Posts |
And this is the truth...All Masters from many a path have come to teach the same Perennial Truth...the Self alone is real..and this is NOT religious talk at its core; but a fact of life...
as far as Buddhist not being unblemished as it were, take a look here: http://www.mg.co.za/articlepage.aspx?are......d=236623 don't mean to digress, but it all goes together, as this article is a bout superstitious turtles... |
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Parson Smith Inner circle 1937 Posts |
Bill,
I would argue that the people behind godhatesfags.com are not christian. Just because I call myself the King of England or an icecream cone does not make it so. Lincoln once asked,"Imagine that a dog has an extra leg. How many legs does the dog have?" The answer, of course, is that our imaginings do not necessaily make it so. Then again, this could lead into a great discussion of visualization. Peace, Parson
Here kitty, kitty,kitty.
+++a posse ad esse+++ |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Parson Gary, I could not agree more. They teach a perversion of Christianity and fail to relate to their own savior. They mouth the words, but their hearts have no understanding. This, to me, is true evil. Please understand that I have only admiration for those who truly follow in Jesus' footsteps.
Ah, yes, visualization! This is a practice found in the East as well as the West. Yes, this would be an interesting thread to follow.
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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Bill Ligon Inner circle A sure sign of a misspent youth: 6437 Posts |
Baba, thanks for that link! The incident is sad and funny at the same time. It reminds me of the showing of "holy relics" during the middle ages. Everybody, watch out for those superstitious turtles!
Author of THE HOLY ART: Bizarre Magick From Naljorpa's Cave. NOW IN HARDCOVER! VIEW: <BR>www.lulu.com/content/1399405 ORDER: http://stores.lulu.com/naljorpa
<BR>A TASSEL ON THE LUNATIC FRINGE |
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