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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Lights...camera...action! » » Advices for a Promo DVD (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Paolo Venturini
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Recently I contact a video production for shoot a 30 minutes DvD of my performance (with live audience) in restaurants, and I think they ask me a fair price ($ 1.000 for 2 camera, full scale).

Also they ask to retain exclusive duplication rights for the video, and a percentage for any sales of it to networks or general distribution.

Do you think it's a fair agreement or I should manage it better?

Thanks in advance.

Paolo Venturini
BryanDreyfus
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I can never understand how when you buy a service the company you pay for the service keeps the work. They should do it for free on spec then.

I stopped dealing with any photographer or vidographer that demand that they retain any rights to the finnished project or any proofs (in the case of photography).

It is just me but I tell them that I am paying for it so it belongs to me, take it or leave it with no residuals.

Bryan
Oh sure, I can spell "Antidisestablishmentarianism", but I can't type t-h-e.
Paolo Venturini
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Thank you Bryan for your opinion.

Any more advices?
Paolo Venturini
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No one?? C'mon!

Should I post it in a different topic?
ScottRSullivan
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Paolo,

Great topic to start! I'll try and help as best I can, however, take everything with the forewarning that I'm in the "biz" of video production and "might" be a little biased! *grin*

I understand your concerns (and Bryan's as well). Let me play devil's advocate for just a minute, though, just for the sake of discussion.

Many photographers (we'll use wedding photographers as an example) keep the negatives and the couple orders prints through the photographer's studio. In fact, even for high school pictures, the students are NOT allowed to make copies of the pictures.

This practice is in place because even though the subject paid for the service, the actual product is a creation of the photographer and thus the photographer owns all copyrights to that image. And from photos to theatrical films, the "leasing" of the images is common practice.

This isn't to say that everyone operates in this way. That's what makes capitalism so wonderful. If you feel this isn't what you personally want, then shop around a little until you find someone that fits what YOU want. You're lucky, your ID says you're from NYC. You'll be able to find plenty of other videographers in your area that will offer you a deal you feel is comfortable for both of you.

You also seem to have found a great price! That's very cheap for a 2 camera shoot!

Just to be fair, I'll offer a little of how I usually operate. I also retain many of the same rights. One reason I do this is because of what I offer in even my most basic videos. I specialize in high end post-production. I can take "shakey" footage and stabilize it, I can clean up and/or fix video footage (like removing an old assistant and replacing her with a new one), creating customized 3D animated graphics (for testimonial quotes that really stand out), and so on.

So I use this background to set the bar high enough that my clients don't have to worry about their competition.

But this service isn't for everybody. Do a google search and call a few other guys in your area and don't be afraid to ask those tough questions.

After all, you're the one that has final hiring authority! You can hire anyone you want.

Good luck and let us know how your video turns out!

Warm regards,
Scott Sullivan
Paolo Venturini
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Thank you Scott for answering me, I thought it was a good topic, especially for people like me at their first experience.

I live and perform in NYC, and I'm sure that I'll find lots of companies, but I think you're right, it is a good price. Also they will promote me and the DVD on networks (you never know...) and general distribution for a fair (I don't know yet) percentage; after that for another $500 they'll update and upgrade my web site with better graphic and adding 4 - 5 video clips from the DVD.

What do you think?

Paolo
ScottRSullivan
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One thing to be wary of is what will the footage look like? A lot of generic video guys focus on weddings and other events like this. They approach most gigs in a similar fashion, so your video might end up looking like a wedding.

You'll want to know what their footage looks like. If they are good, they'll be able to either give you a free demo DVD of their work or guide you to their website so you can watch online clips. If their video style doesn't match your performing style, your video might not fit with your existing promo material and/or character.

Magicians have certain parameters for video that are not found in other trades. Make sure we catch certain moments (surprised faces) at the right time (right after a double turnover). The videographer might not know what to look for when they shoot. They will also need to be aware of knowing what NOT to film. For example, they could be standing to your side as you load the cups and balls. From the table it will look fine, but from the camera's point of view, they just captured the load in plain site!

So will they have that knowledge and experience?

Also,30 minutes is a lot of time for a final DVD. Are they just shooting 30 minutes and transfering it over in "real time", just switching from camera A to camera B or are they editing it down to a 5 minute video. If they are just giving you a 30 minute video of 30 minutes of your performing, you WILL be disappointed with the results. No one is going to want to watch that. It will NEED to be cut down in time.

It sounds like there are a few hidden fees now. For $500 they'll do your web site and give you 5 clips from the DVD? How long are the clips? Do you get to choose which 5 minutes? Again, will these be 5 clips of the raw footage? What format? Windows Media Video? You just excluded those with Macs. Quicktime? So you can have more than one format of each clip or does each format count as a clip?

So these are just a few items that come to mind after reading your last post. Please don't take this to mean not to use these guys. They could be the best thing for you. Just make sure they are the ones for you by asking these questions above.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out!

Warm regards,
Scott
Paolo Venturini
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Hi Scott,

They gave me a demo video of their work, looks profressional to me. The site is http://www.abacusvideo.com; they told me they never made a DVD for a magi but they accept the "challenge". In case I hire them, I'll show them some clips of street magic, so they'll know what are we talking about, and I could show them my "movements" around a table.

Looks that they'll shoot me in 4 - 5 restaurants (in one night), make a shooting of 2 or 3 hours and editing a final DvD of 30 minutes. The 30 min. go for sale to tourists, another short DVD will go for promo and some clips on my web site.

About choosing a format, I really don't know, I'll suppose Window Media... or there is another way to be available for all PCs?

Scott, I really appreciate your help, you know about this business and this is my first DVD experience.

Thank you again,

Paolo
Frank Simpson
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Scott-

Your advice could not be more on-the-money. Hiring a videographer is a lot like hiring a florist. there are good ones and bad ones, but they'll all claim to be "professionals".

(Just as an FYI, we Mac users are no longer unable to view wmv files. I can pretty much watch any video file I come across.)

Paolo, I would take everything Scott says to heart... he clearly knows whereof he speaks!

One thing I might suggest is taking time to perform your entire repertoire that you will be perfroming at the restaurants for the camera operators. If they are aware of the plot points of all of your effects they will have a better understanding of what shots to get. Even at that I would go over with them the "must-have" moments to make sure you have coverage when and where you need it.

Good luck to you!
Paolo Venturini
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Thank you Scott and Frank for your advices. Another thing: when approching the table, the guests are gonna see cameras, cables, lights... what is best to say to them... "Hello, we are shooting a dvd, please act normally, or smile a lot"?

Any advices for the "back stage" preparation?

Paolo
Eric Redman
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Paolo~

Ask the restaurant to let everyone know in advance what you are doing this way they will know what is going on. Another good idea is to ask the restaurant if they can advertise this before hand. They will be able to pull in extra people and you will have a bigger turn out for the tape.

Just a side note I have a Promo DVD and it is 15min. I am not sure what you are planning to do with the DVD but I noticed that talent agencies and some other talent companies don't want long Promo DVD's I am now in the process of getting a new Promo DVD and have it only be 1-2 minutes of fast Highlights. Good Luck


Eric Redman
Paolo Venturini
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Thank you Eric:

The 30 min. DVD will be make for resale to tourists and networks.

The promo will be 15 min. and from these 4 or 5 clips of 1 min. for my web site.

Anybody more advices?
Caveat Lector
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In general most promo's should be around 8 to 10 minutes in length. I think putting up a 30 second montage of clips in the beginning is a good idea if you like that type of openeing. I myself would never let a company keep the rights to my footage, I think that is just a bad idea. You hire them and pay them to tape your act and then edit it together the way that you want. After they have their money then the end product is yours to do with as you want. You can buy a DVD copier for very little money and make your own at home and keep the profits, why should you give anything to them once their job is done and they have been paid. They are looking to make more money off you on the backend. I think that you are getting the short end of the stick on that deal, but that is just my opinion and you can take it for what you want. But I have no intention in giving money to someone who has already been paid. Get the master copy and duplicate them yourself, you will be much happier in the end. I also live in NY and if I were you I would around a little bit more before making a final decision.
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Paolo Venturini
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Thanks for the replay.

This morning I told to the company that I wouldn't let them own the the rights of the DVD and they promise to get back to me at the end of the week.

I'll tell you how will be.

Thank you.
NeoMagic
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Presumably you will have full editorial control whilst the DVD is being produced? If not, make sure you do so you end up with something you want and like.
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Paolo Venturini
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Everything is postponed in about three months, if God permit it!
James Adamson
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Good Luck on finding a company or someone who will give you the master or give up the copyrights of the production. Yes, you are paying for the demo, pictures, etc., but the CREATIVE end behind the camera and the post-production is consider to be ART which belongs to them. Thus that ART is what distinguishing the Amateur from the Professional.

Having done some photography work at an earlier age it was made well known thru the photographic community that this should never be done. A Professional would never give up those rights and would very easily turn down you offer for his/her services.

The decision is in their hands not yours.

I may not always agree with those terms but it is the world of business.

James Adamson
Be remembered for performing what looks like MAGIC, not skill.
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