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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricks & Effects » » Review Request: InTact by Jesse Feinberg (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Marvello
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If an inventor of effects is "too lazy" to do all of the steps involved in putting together an effect for a demo video, and must fudge the effect for video sake, then I can only assume that the prep must be too difficult for the average person to do. Afterall, if the creator of the effect can't even be bothered to spend the time to perform it properly on the demo video then it most certainly is not going to be easy for me to do!
Never criticize someone else until you have walked a mile in their shoes. Then, when you do criticize them, you will be a mile away from them and you will have their shoes.
magicmanr
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Quote:
On 2006-05-11 17:41, Marvello wrote:
If an inventor of effects is "too lazy" to do all of the steps involved in putting together an effect for a demo video, and must fudge the effect for video sake, then I can only assume that the prep must be too difficult for the average person to do. Afterall, if the creator of the effect can't even be bothered to spend the time to perform it properly on the demo video then it most certainly is not going to be easy for me to do!


Not exactly.......The camera is a lot harder to fool than the human eye....You can do a perfect take in real life, but if you're on camera, being watched over and over...the camera WILL catch you....I think this whole discussion is insane and WELL blown out of proportion......I agree holeheartedly with Ron Jaxon's opinion, in saying that the effect that is seen in the spectators eyes is what really matters...I guess all demos should have a disclaimer stating as such, to make everyone happy....That, or everyone should just resort to their local brick and mortar shop for a demo from now on......
Jon Allen
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For those who say it is okay for an online video demo to show what the audience sees in their mind how does this sound:

John Kennedy has a card freely chosen and signed. He loses the card int he deck and puts the deck down. He points to a little box on the table. The person who signed the cards takes the lid off and inside is a folded up playing card. Very cleanly, John actually takes the card out of the box and shows that is the only card in it. He cleanly unfolds to show it is the signed card.

You have just viewed the cleanest card to box you have ever seen and rush to buy it. Only when you get it do you realise it's not quite as the video showed.

Do you think it's okay to put up a video of his Mystery Box like that? After all, that's what the audience sees in their mind.

(I'd like to point out that John's video does not show the trick done as I described but performs a real life version.)
Paragon 3D - the most incredible Card to Clear Box you will ever own. Be fooled here: http://youtu.be/GQxRZ1OGkUo
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Watch the brilliant effect, Rule of Three: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9CytuXsCbL0 and order it from www.onlinemagicshop.co.uk
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Marvello
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Quote:
On 2006-05-11 18:21, magicmanr wrote:

Not exactly.......The camera is a lot harder to fool than the human eye....You can do a perfect take in real life, but if you're on camera, being watched over and over...the camera WILL catch you....I think this whole discussion is insane and WELL blown out of proportion......I agree holeheartedly with Ron Jaxon's opinion, in saying that the effect that is seen in the spectators eyes is what really matters...I guess all demos should have a disclaimer stating as such, to make everyone happy....That, or everyone should just resort to their local brick and mortar shop for a demo from now on......
I agree it is hard to fool the camera, but that is NOT an excuse to portray a demo as being an actual demo. I thought that the lesson would have been learned with Pen Through Arm, but apparently it needs to be relearned again.

Wannabe Magic Inventor: "here is a demo of a cool new trick I invented!"

Every Magician in the World: "Dude, I bought the trick, and I can't do it like in the video. What's the secret? Also- the secret is the same as another effect I bought recently. I bought your effect because I knew I couldn't do that effect with the trick that has the same secret - it's impossible! What gives?"

Wannabe Magic Inventor: "I know - but do you think I am gonna sit there and M fold a card just so I can make an honest video? Dude- I am too busy inventing more cool tricks to actually perform the actual tricks. As you remember, I was in a hurry to finish the video so I could sell a ton of these to other unsuspecting magicians. You should realize that the video is a 're-creation of the effect'"

Every Magician in the World: "I feel ripped off"
Never criticize someone else until you have walked a mile in their shoes. Then, when you do criticize them, you will be a mile away from them and you will have their shoes.
magicmanr
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All replies noted and not argued with.....again, I defer everyone to their brick and mortar shops for a demo....The endless bandwidth wasted on 50 or so replies about a 'demo' is worthless and doesn't add anything to a review of an effect....Although I LOVE seeing a demo of an effect, it's such a tricky touchy item to show on the internet....I think most inventors would be better NOT offering a demo video, as the tricks are torn apart, studied, watched and REwatched..and subsequently ripped off.....

PS Last year, I bought PTA after watching Jesse's demo, as well....and noted the descrepancy in the video....Did I feel ripped off? Maybe a little....but it's still a great effect when I show it to someone...
johnnymystic
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It's just too bad theres all this ****te over the demo...the trick really looks good no matter what.

And once again I agree, PTA gets great reactions whenever I perform it...it's a good thing I like smoked oysters!

johnny
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truthteller
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I have an item here in my collection. Here is the effect as seen by the audience:

The magician is reading a Newsweek magazine. Visible it doubles in size, then without warning it quadruples in size. Finally, in a flash, it expands to 16 times its normal size. If that were not enough, the magician whips aside the magazine to reveal, in the middle of the room, his lovely assistant.

Now, I could create a video with cuts and effects that would convey the intended effect to the audience that would sell hundreds of these.

However, the Newsweek trick (and I am sorry I cannot lay my hand on it) is perhaps the most undeceptive piece of trip every offered to the magic community. But, my video, showing the "effect" is accurate in so far as it is what the creator intends.

So, where is the line?

The line is: magicians should respect original thoughts. If they see an ad or video for a trick, and they like it, they should buy it. Not reconstruct it, not make it on their own. They should pay the man who had the idea. Then, no one would need to fool the camera. They would offer an honest representation of their product and people would pay for a good idea.

Brad
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To the vrey fre people who oddly defend the idea of a deceptive video I ask you why? I mean forget this particular effect or creator, just in general what possible advantage is there to encouraging deceptive and misleading videos... it's just lunacy.

I hear things like "It's tricky" to create clear, honest videos. Well, simply put, NO IT IS NOT. In fact making a straight forward and honest video is the absolute easiest possible video to make. No cuts, no effects, very little actual work... it's EASY.

Heck, Magicmanr who is defending the video even admits that he felt "A little ripped off" after buying Pen Thru Arm. Would you not have prefered to see an HONEST video and then not feel ripped off at all? You see this is not about if the effect is good or bad, it is about how easy it is to sell deceptions and lies and how we should NEVER stand for that. One day you will not feel a little ripped off, you will feel TOTALLY ripped off because you had been lied to in a video.

The idea of simply not making demo videos is fine, but people will sell MANY fewer products with no demo. Rather I think a simple and honest demo will allow a trick to stand on it's own true merits... what happens from there depends on how good the effect is.
johnnymystic
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If and when I decide to put forth my own effects onto the open market I promIse this, ALL demos will be accurate...to the Tee.

Matter of fact they may just be live performnce!

Card in Picture Frame
Cards In Bottle
Staple in Arm (blood is optional)
My handling of PTA
Triple Koin Bypass (as performed on the learned pig and at about.com magic and illusion)

However, It would be nice to hear of others who have actually performed 'Intact' live and to hear what they have to say.

Can we forget about the demo now?

johnny
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magicday
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For me I don't recommend it unless you have very good sleight in card magic especial the MF* Another disappointment with Jesse Feinberg's product.
Cameron Francis
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Magicday, did you think the trick was self working? I don't care how bad the demo was, Jesse never said no sleights required.
Drs_Res
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Quote:
On 2006-05-12 10:13, cfrancis wrote:
Magicday, did you think the trick was self working? I don't care how bad the demo was, Jesse never said no sleights required.


Ad copy from Hank Lee's site:

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A signed, selected card visually appears inside a Tic Tac mint box.
Have a regular playing card freely selected, signed and returned to the deck.
Take a real Tic Tac box out of your pocket with your empty hand.
Only a couple of mints can be seen inside as you shake the box around.
Give the box one more, emphatic shake, and a card appears inside the box! Immediately open the Tic Tac box, remove and unfold the card and reveal the signed selection!
Everything is examinable.
Bonus effects and handling are described in detail. InTact is perfect for close-up magicians at any skill level. It is very easy to learn and perform. No tricky moves. No setup. No forces of any kind.
It looks so good, you will even fool yourself!

Thanks to Jesse Feinberg for giving us the exclusive on this fine item, which means you will find it here at Hank Lee's and nowhere else.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
End Ad Copy


Now the wording "NO TRICKY MOVES", "VERY EASY TO LEARN", and "ANY SKILL LEVEL" could be used to describe the appearance, but to do the effect with a signed card as the ad copy implies, and add the demo video to that and take it as a whole makes it seem that the signed card effect will be easy for anyone at any skill level, but that may not be the case. This is the crux of the problem.

Also add to this, Hank has the exclusive on this means you can't get a demo in your local shop (if you even have a local shop) so there goes that argument.

Now, I do think that Jesse is getting a lot of the pent up feelings from everyone that has been decieved in the past by bad/deceptive descriptions and or demo videos.

But cutting corners to get an effect across is not the way to go about things, especially after what happened with the first video and the PTA demo.

People just want to see a real representation of the effect. I don't think that is really asking too much.
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No Tricky Moves - To me means the handling looks natural.

Very Easy to Learn - There aren't any nonstandard slights. From a review of the demo video it's pretty clear that you need a pass or similar control (in the real world if not in the demo) as a mercury card fold (same parenthetical). In fairness, there is one straight forward move that you do need to figure out and learn.

Any Skill Level - Implies a skill level, greater than zero, exists.

I don't know if this has been mentioned before but, from the instructions, it doesn't appear that Jesse has actually used this a lot. I draw that inference from the instructions that suggest a number of variations but don't present a specific use. I am aware of the probable response; that it was described in this way to provide us, his customers, the most flexibility. That said, I still believe my conclusion. Still, this is a very clever prop and I plan on trying to incorporation it into a usable presentation.

Bob Tobias

P.S. Please preface all the above w/ IMHO.
sabitu
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I have performed this several times for different people and it gets good reactions everytime. As far as skill level goes, I think the hardest part of the trick is the dump of the card from the tic tac box, which really isn't that hard. A little practice is all that is needed. Apart from that you will have to do a control and an M-fold like mgshn mentioned, but there are other ways of accomplishing the fold that Jesse mentions in the instructions. I would say that a basic level of card skills is necessary and a beginner could easily do this with practice. Also, an important aspect of the performance that should be practiced is the patter. I have found that if I work in a reason for bringing out a tic tac box in a way that makes sense I get much better reactions. If I just bring out the tic tac box without justifying this action the reactions are weaker.
Ragman
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So let me get this straight you are talking about the skill level of this mint box and how outraged you are that the ad/demo video was misleading. I find it odd that no one even seems to care that this idea may belong to another person. As good as the effect is I would like to know who really came up with it. If indeed it was inspired by another trick on the market that uses a lighter it seems a rip off to me. Just because you do your matrix with red cards instead of blue does not make it a new concept, nor would it be right to market it as such.
So who does the idea really belong to, that way I give my money to the proper person?
Cameron Francis
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The other effect is Bill Burner. However, Bill Burner is an effect where the object vanishes after being wrapped and secured with a rubber band around a clear lighter. Different effect.

Although the effects are different, the gimmick is similar. Not sure that this makes In Tact a rip off. From what I understand, the gimmick itself has a longer history than either of these two effects.
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Intact was created independently last year by me... the gaff has similarities to bill burner, but different in MANY ways. Intact is in no way a rip off of anything... Intact is very unique in both its function, and handlings... Everything about Intact has been designed specific. Also, the way its made, many other things are possible with the gaff... not just one specific thing. But that takes your creativity, and you can go to my forum to share too!

Intact is fresh, original, and limitless... No other marketed/published effect will teach you what intact can do... you can PM me if you have specific/sensitive questions about this... thanks for your attention guys! -Jesse
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Just so no one is confused this principle did not start with ron jaxon. He did not create it and claiming that the meathod belongs to some one is like claiming that somthing like black art "BELONGS" to some one. If your making the jump that Ron Jaxons trick with the lighter that vanishes the bill is the same as jesses trick with making a card appear in a mind box then that like calling the raven and melting point the same deal. The principal is very simmilar but the results are not.

My 2 cents to rub together.

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truthteller
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Quote:
On 2006-05-19 13:14, Jessiah wrote:

Intact is fresh, original, and limitless... No other marketed/published effect will teach you what intact can do... -Jesse




Again, I refer you to Charlie Miller's Magicana for the published use of this idea. Also, Ammar has spoken about this principle, and I believe he has made references to it in lectures. I mention this only in the interest of keeping the historical record accurate.

Best,

Brad
Review King
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Quote:
On 2006-05-31 19:07, truthteller wrote:
Quote:
On 2006-05-19 13:14, Jessiah wrote:

Intact is fresh, original, and limitless... No other marketed/published effect will teach you what intact can do... -Jesse




Again, I refer you to Charlie Miller's Magicana for the published use of this idea. Also, Ammar has spoken about this principle, and I believe he has made references to it in lectures. I mention this only in the interest of keeping the historical record accurate.

Best,

Brad


This is the value of having wise historians. Very cool Brad!!!
"Of all words of tongue and pen,
the saddest are, "It might have been"

..........John Greenleaf Whittier
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