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Marshall Thornside
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"But Fu Manchu"
you will remember my name

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RandyStewart
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I've read here fantastic examples of how to deal with Marshall's encounter. Bill, Whit, and Margarette have shared some stories that may have made us laugh and rally to the support of those who've met ignorance and bigotry face to face.

The stories remind me, despite casting of unfair judgement, that these encounters can serve as an opportunity! The way Bill Cosby handled the lady when asked how much he charged for lawn service or Whit's lady at the music store show us the response of not only intelligent people, but proves beyond a shadow of a doubt, their brilliance and being, without question, the opposite of what the moronic observer has labled them. Thank you all for the stories and reminders. Actually great life lessons!

So let some "discriminate" away while others quietly and tastefully see to it they are handed the biggest of all price tags. Neat-O....This could turn into a hobby.

Whit, my blood still runs cold with that story of the starlet to be....Oh man what a bad, bad place to be.


Quote:
On 2006-05-02 20:09, Whit Haydn wrote:

"I have never seen you take this kind of crap from anyone, Mark. Why don't you tell her where to get off?"

"I don't need to. I am enjoying this."

"Why is that, Mark?"

"She will not get the part when I tell him what a horror she is...and the cool thing is this: she won't get the part and she will never know why, so she won't even learn anything from this experience."



God I wish I could of been there.
Whit Haydn
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On a rainy country road, a man had a flat tire. While fixing the flat--a pain in the mud and rain--he accidentally kicked the hub cap onto which he had carefully placed the wheel nuts, losing them all in the thick mud.

Cursing, he finally gave up trying to find them and just stood stupidly staring at the spare wheel loose on the hub.

From behind him came a grunt. It was a man standing bareheaded in the rain behind a huge wrought iron gate.

"Mister, just take one nut off each the other wheels. Three ought to get you home, anyways."

Looking up at the gate, he noticed the sign, Covington Sanitarium. It was a mental hospital.

"That is a brilliant idea. Do you work here?"

"No. I am a patient."

"Well, you sure seem pretty intelligent to me."

"I may be crazy, mister...But I'm not stupid."
Bill Palmer
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Reminds me of the story of the fellow who was rolling a wheelbarrow full of manure down the road. As he passed the recreation yard of the mental hospital, one of the patients called out, "What do you have in the wheelbarrow, mister?"

"Manure."

"What are you going to do with it?"

"I'm going to put it on my strawberries."

"They say we're crazy, and we put sugar and cream on ours!"
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

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revlovejoy
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I have appreciated these stories of quick witted folks and their ways of dealing with the presumptuous.

As a Christian white male, I'm not exactly the recipient of bigotry. But being pretty fat, people often assume me to be stupid. Being a pastor, people assume me to be puritanical and judgmental. I love it when I'm in the record shop talking to my good friend the owner, when some teenager looks at me wondering if I'm there to close the place down, and Patrick tells him: no he's here for the latest Tool album.

Living where I live, I am just about the only man without a pickup truck. I don't hunt or fish. I have nothing against either, it's just not my thing. So one day as I am dropping off my daughter at her daycare/preschool, the owner asks me "do you hunt pastor?" Nope. "How do you fit in here in Snyder County?"

All I could say was "who ever told you I fit in here?"

I especially enjoyed the music shop story. I jam with older guys monthly. Some of them carry themselves with an appearance of joe dirt. But don't ever mess with their Martin guitars. And imply they can't afford one: there's plenty of other shops within a 100 mile drive, and it will be worth it to them to avoid the jerk.
Marshall Thornside
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When dad was around 15 and in the Blackstone
show he was arrested and thrown into jail
because in Keokuk, Iowa a policeman thought
he was a Japanese spy...

Broken English, and hiding because he was scared.

Luckily, Blackstone was like celebrity status.
He got dad out of jail...

Always gotta appreciate Uncle Harry on that...
:)
you will remember my name

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LobowolfXXX
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Quote:

As a Christian white male, I'm not exactly the recipient of bigotry.



Must be nice! As a straight white male law student, I'm going up to my eyeballs in debt, while every week I get E-mail from my school's administrative office outlining the availability of programs, law associations and journals, and even scholarships available only to "diversity-enhancing" groups (let me clarify; free money that I'm ineligible for solely because of my race). I wonder how far I'd get if I established a scholarship fund for the most qualified Caucasian student... I'd bet my tuition that the school wouldn't even send out an E-mail making students aware of it.



Oops! I managed to cut off the quotation's attribution: RevLoveJoy, obviously.


Posted: May 5, 2006 2:19pm
-------------------------------------------------
Quote:
On 2006-05-05 09:54, RandyStewart wrote:

Whit, my blood still runs cold with that story of the starlet to be....Oh man what a bad, bad place to be.


Quote:
On 2006-05-02 20:09, Whit Haydn wrote:

"I have never seen you take this kind of crap from anyone, Mark. Why don't you tell her where to get off?"

"I don't need to. I am enjoying this."

"Why is that, Mark?"

"She will not get the part when I tell him what a horror she is...and the cool thing is this: she won't get the part and she will never know why, so she won't even learn anything from this experience."

...instant karma's gonna getcha...
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Payne
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Quote:
On 2006-05-04 02:56, Whit Haydn wrote:
To make assumptions about a stranger based on appearance and prejudicial notions is rude and bigoted and stupid in and of itself--and can lead to all sorts of serious and harmful misjudgements. The stories on this page demonstrate that very well.

Sadly though it's human nature. We all make assumptions on people based on their appearance. This is why we wear clothes. To identify and express ourselves. A century ago every trade had it's "uniform" a set of clothes that would instantly identify you as a Butcher, Baker or Candlestick Maker. Today, especially with business casual being all the rage, it is far more difficult to determine ones social standing purely by dress. Around here your just as likely to see folk attending the opera dressed in T-shirt and jeans sitting nest to people adorned in Tiara's and fur coats. The guy in the T-shirt is more likely twice as wealthy as the fur coat clad person sitting next to him.
I get around this by being rude and obnoxious to everyone. It's not that I treat you badly it's if I treat someone else better. Smile
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
LobowolfXXX
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I think there is validity, in general, to quite a few stereotypes; that's how they get to be stereotypes. To some extent, I think it can be helpful with respect to choice of material, whether or not to include certain innuendoes, etc. I've gone to Metallica concerts, and I've owned a bridge club; the fact of the matter, based on a ton of my own empirical firsthand experience, is that jokes that will generally go over great with the 20-something male Metallica fan don't do so well at bridge clubs, where the average person is 60+ and (slightly more than half of the time) female. One group is astronomically harder to offend than the other, and that's a judgment that should be intuitively obvious, based on, honestly, appearance, demographics, and yes, prejudicial notions.

The real problem, in my opinion, is the unwillingness to realize and accept that while generalizations may be GENERALLY true, they're very often not true for the individual. One doesn't have to disavow any belief in stereotypes; one has to recognize that if a stereotype is right 80% of the time, you're still going to be wrong about 20 people in 100.

In the context of my examples, an off-color joke that uses profanity, and may be QUITE funny, is exponentially more likely to offend more bridge players per capita than Metallica fans per capita. However, any given Metallica fan may be offended, and many bridge players will tell you jokes that would make Satan turn even redder. You don't have to entirely reject the general; you have to be willing to accept the specific alternative cases. Of course, it's also a stereotype that bridge players aren't Metallica fans. And as a general rule, it's probably a good stereotype. Of course, if you adhere blindly to it, you'd miss out on a certain tattooed Metallica fan who is also a silver life master and has taught privately and in clubs...

Having said ALL of that, please don't misinterpret me to be suggesting that you should bring out off-color material for groups that you suspect are more amenable to it. That's one way to do it; by far the safest way is, if you think your material might be offensive, get by without it. Although some outstanding comics, magicians, and other entertainers have done extremely well doing just the opposite.

Mostly, I wanted to point out that it's more important to be willing to accept the exception than to ignore certain generalities that may in fact be quite true, over broad groups of people. Hey, your average northern European white guy is taller than your average Asian; you can look it up. But guess who can dunk, Yao Ming or me?!
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
the levitator
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I received my largest commission ever thanks to the bigotry of my fellow salespeople when I was a salesperson at a family owned electronics/furniture store. I live in a city of only 70,000 in Wisconsin which is surrounded by dozens of towns under 5,000. I grew up in one of those towns which had less tan 2,800. so not only did I grow up with farmers, but I grew up working on dairy and ag farms.

I was the youngest salesperson at that store, by at least 15 years. The other salespeople always seemed to be a bit uppity to me, maybe due in part to the fact that the store was considered a bit more high end in merchandise than your average Best Buy. Maybe it was also the fact that they made fun of customers after they would leave the store if they didn't meet their standards.

Anyways, a farmer came in one day, obviously fresh off chores, perhaps even cleaning calf pens. I was with another customer at the time and I noticed him wandering around and none of the others helping him. I went over to where the other 3 salespeople were watching TV and asked if anyone had helped him yet. Their reaction was, "go for it, he smells like cow!@&#, and is probably just kicking tires.

So I finished up with my customer and took care of this guy the only way I know how. It turned out that he had just built a new home on his existing farm and wanted new everything. I spent more than 3 hours with him that day looking at furniture, electronics, appliances, etc. He thanked me for my time and told me he'd be back next week. The sales guys all laughed at me for wasting my time with the "smelly redneck."

So I come into work a week later and one of the sales guys is just glaring at me. I asked him what was wrong. He told me to go talk to Ray, the owner of the store. Apparently, the farmer (his name is Larry) came in on my day off and purchased almost $16,000 worth of merchandise (and this was 15 years ago!). Larry made a strong point to make sure I got credit for the sale because I was the only one who went out of my way to treat him right. He also told the owner that the other salespeople need to work on their whispering skills because he was aware of their attitude towards him.

Not only did I get the biggest commission of my life, but Larry gave me a separate check for $100 for being such a big help and giving him so much of my time. As a return favor, I wired Larry's new home theater system for him for free as a way of saying thanks. I remember thinking at the time that it was weird that people were making such a big deal that I treated the guy like a normal person. I didn't know I was supposed to treat someone differently because of their attire, career or social status. If that's naivety, then I am grateful to be naive.
"It's all in your head...."



James Anthony
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Bill Palmer
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A friend of mine who is a stand-up comic once said, "We should not judge the actions of any particular group of people based upon the actions of a single member of that group...the magic number is three."

Needless to say, he did not win the diversity award that year.
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

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Marshall Thornside
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Three is also a lucky number.
you will remember my name

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Bill Palmer
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In Medieval philosphy, three was the number of perfection.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
kregg
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I saw a car with two bumper sticker's:

'End Racism' on the left side of the bumper, the right side read: 'Proud to be Irish'
POOF!
Marshall Thornside
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The label/collective I co-run is to help
promote artists of half-asian ethinicity.
my business partner and I thought it would
be nice to get artists who are half-asian
and proud of it out to the world.

we get a ton of people asking us to listen
to their music via myspace. when we tell them
our mission statement they think we are playing
a really bad joke on the them.

I had one artists call us being racist.

So I wrote back saying its really hard to
be considered a racists when you are more than
one race.
you will remember my name

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NJJ
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Race in the genetic sense is itself a myth. I.e. there is no gene for specific races, just the features that we, as a society, collect into a groups.

Since you are excluding people based on a predetermined genetic make up it is exactly the same as saying a label is for asian people or white people or black people. From a genetic stand point, the label of racist could be apt.

However, as a cultural grouping, I would imagine that a collective of 'half asian' artists would have some joint social experiences that would make for some great art.
RandyStewart
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I was about to discriminate in this particular case and simply didn't allow myself to do so. You'll see why I'm glad I didn't lie to the fellow and claim I couldn't help him.

I stopped off at a studio for editing of my new act. This has been a (I'll try to watch my language) an unpleasant and tempering week for me. (With best Andy Rooney voice) Ever notice how the smallest details in life turn into a National Crisis for one when you least expect it?....

Anyway, I was running a little late (more things totally beyond my control - really!) and rushed past a man on a cell phone outside the studio entrance. He stopped me and asked if I had jumper cables. My first thought was I could care less about his car as I had far more important things to do.

As much as I hated the moment, I had one of those little angels on the shoulder scream "You will do as he says and now!". I was still flustered and said I'd actually have to pull the backseat out of the car and all that craziness. He said he'd help me. I told him to give me a second as I had to notify someone in the studio that I was late.

Turns out it wasn't his car but his assistant's car. No idea why the battery was dead but I chose and forced myself to keep a smile and pleasant tone while doing my good deed for the day. Once done there I ran back in and we got to work.

During the editing, the same guy came in and was watching! I figured he worked there. The editor introduced me to him as host of a late night talk show on Mexico's Televisa Broadcasting. He said he had fun watching the act and wanted to air it on his show along with a few interview minutes with a total of 12 TV minutes. I told him I'm bilingual and would be honored. He then flattered me when he said "I like that magic stuff you did and even if you were mute, it would speak for itself". Is this a great way to start a Monday morning or what!? This is the strangest way I ever got TV promo time as the customary approach certainly does not call for jumper cables.

He turned to the editor who was working on his audio recordings and said "Tim, we got the car started and gotta run".

Tim: "Great! how'd ya get it started?"

TV guy looking at me: "It's magic Jim...It's magic!"...
Marshall Thornside
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I'm going to be writing a letter and making
copies of the my journal entry and sending
it to two newspapers, the fire department,
the local chamber of commerce and the city
hall.

Each letter personalized. the journal entry
is dated with comments posted by people and
and will document the date.

I think enough time has passed where its
not so much in anger as it is what should
be done right.

Not that I'm not angry or upset but it's not
as new as it was when the incident first
happened.
you will remember my name

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Bill Palmer
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There are many different kinds of discrimination. Some of them are really funny. When I was working at Comedy Tonight in McAllen, I went over the border and bought a couple of really decent looking Rolex Presidential knockoffs. A real Rolex owner would have spotted that they were fakes, because the second hand jumped, but to people who didn't know, they looked pretty good.

One day when I was working in Austin, I went out for my morning walk. I was wearing sweats (and my fake Rolex), and I stopped in at one of the big music stores in Austin to look at banjos. This salesman saw my sweats, and that didn't bother him, because he spotted the ROLEX! You could see the dollar signs in his eyes. He herded me around the shop like a mother hen. "Would you like some coffee? A sweet roll? Anything?"

It was very funny!
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Marshall Thornside
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It had to happen in Austin no less!
The city of a million musicians!
you will remember my name

World's Youngest Illusionista
7th greatest pianist in the world
Go Red For Women and Stroke Ambassador
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