The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All tied up! » » How to open a lock ? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
Helloooo people.

I'd like to know more about spirit locks (and "pickable" locks), I'd like to play with locks, try things ... But I'm stucked at a very early stage ... How can I open the lock in order to get to the rotor and pins ??? Is there an "easy" way ? easier locks to work with ?

Thanks a lot.
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
I found re-keyable master locks, this might be the thing I'm looking for isn't it ?

Can those be found in europe ?
Kondini
View Profile
Inner circle
3612 Posts

Profile of Kondini
Just use it`s key!!!

Ken
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
... I think you misunderstood what I tried to say : By opening a lock I mean gut it, remove the rotor, access the pins do whatever I'v got to do and gut all this back in working order.
james_unlimited
View Profile
Loyal user
UK
222 Posts

Profile of james_unlimited
Removing the cylinder to gimmick the lock? so it opens with anything?
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
Yup remove the cylinder, do what I have to do to the pins (removing, gimmicking, trying things) and put it back inside
Chance
View Profile
Inner circle
1385 Posts

Profile of Chance
What Antoine means, is that he asked me the same question yesterday as we were sitting together and I refused to give him the answer. It was a judgement call on my part, but I figured a guy with only a few weeks' experience with escapes had better things to worry about than picking and gaffing locks.

I even offered to teach him how to build a spirit lock step-by-step, so long as he was willing to wait a few more months. I guess I just got my answer.

I'm not saying you shouldn't help Antoine out people, but he seems to be going for only the sexiest and most secretive tidbits out of pure curiosity.

Why is it no one wants to work hard and dedicate years to a craft any more? Why do people expect to get every single question answered immediately, no matter how detailed, dangerous or secretive?
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
Chance, I need a spirit lock to do what I intend to do.

I'm not going to just buy a fish, I want to learn how to fish.

for the moment my progression in the escape art is stopped by my physical condition (and the fact I cant get my hands tied in my back to the front all the time), this will take time no matter what I do, so why is this I can't try to train my brains WHILE training my body, what's wrong with it ?
YES it IS curiosity, what else could it be ??!! Curiosity to learn new things, to understand how stuff works, I don't just want to know how it's done and not do it, I want to know how to open a lock and then through trials and error find how it works, how I could gimmick the ***ed lock, ALL BY MYSELF.
Wolflock
View Profile
Inner circle
South Africa
2257 Posts

Profile of Wolflock
Hmmm. Tough one. Xargos - I can see why you would want to better yourself in every aspect of Escapes, but I must agree with Chance on this one. Perfect the Escape you are on at the moment before moving on to the next step. Chance is not trying to hold you back. He is just trying to teach you to master something first before moving on. I know how irritating and boring it can be doing the same **** over and over again, but it is VERY important. You want to look professional when doing your performance, not like some kid who just ordered a pack of trick cards and wants to show you a "trick". My advice - have a little bit of patience and bare with Chance. You will go a long way if you listen to what he is telling you.

Regards
Wolflock

P.S. Kondini - "Use the Key", that was classical. LOL. I loved that one.
Wolflock
Pro Magician & Escapologist
Member of JMC (Johannesburg Magic Circle)
South Africa
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
I'll find it myself then Smile even if it take month, this will be even more rewarding.
Wolflock
View Profile
Inner circle
South Africa
2257 Posts

Profile of Wolflock
:o)LOL

Chance, you have to admit. He is very tanatious (sp) [not my strong point].

Best advice I can give is try to get hold of Pastor Clyde Mighells {anyone seen him lately?) He sells a gimmicked lock called the Jericho Lock. That unfortunately is all that I can offer. I use standard locks, not gimmicks.

(Wolflock wanders off thinking about where Pastor Clyde disappeared to...)

Regards
Wolflock
Wolflock
Pro Magician & Escapologist
Member of JMC (Johannesburg Magic Circle)
South Africa
Kondini
View Profile
Inner circle
3612 Posts

Profile of Kondini
Use the key was for real. I remember going around the houses with a complicated lock stunt, the brains were addled with no method to hand. I posed the question to David Deval,,,his reply was the solution,,,use the key, plant it in and do the job the easy way which is nearly always the best way. An important lesson in escapology for we often seem to be fooling ourselves with complicated methods which are quite redundant if we use the key!

Ken.
Xargos
View Profile
Loyal user
Brussels
268 Posts

Profile of Xargos
Yes using the key would be a solution to my problem, but still I want to play with the inside of those locks Smile
Ian McColl
View Profile
Inner circle
1485 Posts

Profile of Ian McColl
Hi Xargos, If I understand you correctly, you wish to pull a lock apart to see the inside of it ( then think up your own methods etc)

To start with the basics, purchase and lock cylinder, there should be some sort of circlip, screw cap and other method of holding the rotor within the stator ( plug within the housing) once this is removed, insert the key to the cylinder, turn in 90 degrees and pull it out. All the internal parts will come out for you to examine. The fun is in getting them back in again.
hope this helps. if you require further and wish to learn more, drop me an email at imccoll@sympac.com.au

good to see someone enthusiastic about the art.

Ian
nucinud
View Profile
Inner circle
New York, New York
1297 Posts

Profile of nucinud
I was a Locksmith 30 years ago.

Padlocks come in three basic styles, Pin tumbler, Disc wafer and Warded.
Each has its own method of opening.
The Warded is the easiest to open, next is the Disc wafer. The Pin tumbler is the hardest to open.

Door lock cylinders are mostly Pin Tumbler. You would need special tools to take it apart and put back together. Locksmith supply shops sell them, but most places require you to have a Locksmith license to make such a purchase.
"We are what we pretend to be" Kurt Vonnegut, jr.



Now U C It Now U Don't

Harry Mandel

www.mandelmagic.com
Mick Hanzlik
View Profile
Special user
Mick Hanzlik
588 Posts

Profile of Mick Hanzlik
Let me suggest a Master Pro-Series padlock, These come apart for locksmiths to re-key them or key them alike. I don't think any secrets will be spilled if you get one of these, take it to bits, see how it works, and do your own thing with it.

If you mess it up, just buy another. You'll soon learn!

They are available in Europe (I sell them in my lock shop), so if you'd like one, pm me and I'll try to help.

Mick
EsnRedshirt
View Profile
Special user
Newark, CA
893 Posts

Profile of EsnRedshirt
Quote:
On 2006-05-08 08:01, Kondini wrote:
Use the key was for real. I remember going around the houses with a complicated lock stunt, the brains were addled with no method to hand. I posed the question to David Deval,,,his reply was the solution,,,use the key, plant it in and do the job the easy way which is nearly always the best way. An important lesson in escapology for we often seem to be fooling ourselves with complicated methods which are quite redundant if we use the key!

Ken.

You remind me of when I showed off my shackle escape to my dad the first time. I stuck my hands in a pillowcase to hide the gimmick, and after the trick he said, "Well, you just had a spare key in the pillowcase."

In retrospect, the spare key method would have been a lot cheaper than paying out the cash for the trick shackles. And there's tons of better places to hide a key than inside a pillowcase, once you know how.
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.

* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt.
kris attard
View Profile
Elite user
Malta
431 Posts

Profile of kris attard
I agree with Chance and others about learning things thoroughly. That's certainly good sound pro advice there. But I also see a lot of merit in Xargos' wish to learn, (yes, and the tenacity which is a big asset in the process of invention).

After all, he is not just asking some shortcut question like "where can I get this or that", the most common question heard from LIARs (Learners In A Rush!). He is asking how to DO something in a very hands-on way, namely open a lock to learn its working or rekey it. I am a hobbyist lockpicker not an escapologist, but IMO is this not a healthy part of the learning process rather than a shortcut? To me, a shortcut would be to send off for a spirit lock yesterday without even bothering to know how or why it works, what could happen to go wrong, etc. Opening locks is still the best way to learn how they work, and even if this is not used as a MO it still teaches a respect for locks.

Chance, I too come from the old school of learning magic, but it seems that whether we like it or not, the world has become faster and as double-edged a sword as it may be, so has the pace and process of learning.

Xargos, there are cutaway locks available at locksmith suppliers which are good to learn on. I learnt volumes from my cutaway five pin tumbler. But frankly... you have a superb and rare opportunity if you can learn to make a spirit lock step by step with Chance. Very few people can actually teach you that, let alone take you through it. I suggest you take it, even if it means waiting! Smile
needledoc
View Profile
New user
19 Posts

Profile of needledoc
For those of us who are willing to take time and learn this stuff thoroughly, where can we go to learn it? I learned strait jacket escapes through Todd Robbins in the Coney Island sideshow school, and I love excaping and want to learn everything, I just don't know how or where to begin. Thanks
Roslyn
View Profile
Inner circle
UK
3404 Posts

Profile of Roslyn
Hi,

I hope some of the following waffle helps Smile

You need to ask yourself why you want to learn escapes first off.

This may seem odd, but when I got in to escapes not too many years ago it was the most important question that I ended up asking myself and since then I've progressed quite nicely.

Basically, ea's can be put in to two groups. Professionals that make their living from doing escapes and hobbiests that do escapes purely for the fun of it.

Depending on which of these two groups you place yourself will depend on what escapes you will want, or need, to learn.

The first group needs escapes that are going to first and foremost be entertaining to a paying audience, the second group need only do escapes that are entertaining to themselves.

So as a hobbiest you can spend an hour or so picking your way out of a pair of Hiatt HSS9s, where as a working pro would have had his audience walk out and demand their money back after 10 minutes.

Once this has been answered then you can start looking at what you want to be able to do. What fits your requirements.

Take the sj for example. You could learn to escape from just one type of sj, OR you could work on learning how to escape from as many different jackets as possible.

I personally love using the straitjacket, and I chose to work on learning how to get out of a number of different jackets from a Humane Restraint jacket with no crotch strap to a posey sj complete with crotch strap and front and side loops.

As to where to go and learn, I used good old fashioned trial and error along with obtaining every book, dvd, magazine or scrap of paper that had something about escapes in it.

Most of them just showed me stuff that I don't want to learn. Things that really didn't fit in with what I do.

However, there were some escapes that I really did like the look of and have learnt and use regularly.

I would recommend finding an escape that you'd like to be able to do. Take the 75' rope escape as an example, and then go and find everything you could possible find on that escape. Learn it and then give it a go.

There are a few books that seem to be standards and you are assumed to own.

Burling Hull's 33 Rope Ties and Chain Releases
The John Novack Books (there's about 8 of them in total)
Dick Norman's Handcuff Secrets for Magicians

All contain loads of info and should get you on your way nicely.

If it's classes you want, Harley Newman is running some during the summer.

He teaches escapes as well as sideshow stunts like the sword ladder etc.

You can contact him through the Café, there's also a thread in the sideshow section of the Café too.

I hope this has been of some use to you.

Good luck,

Ros
The Magic Cafe account of The Conwy Jester, Erwyd le Fol formerly known as Roslyn Walker.
My home online
Join me on Facebook
Follow me on twitter
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » All tied up! » » How to open a lock ? (0 Likes)
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.17 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL