The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » Magician/ illusionist? The media doesn't know and doesn't give a rats butt! (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
daffydoug
View Profile
Eternal Order
Look mom! I've got
14062 Posts

Profile of daffydoug
I find it intriguing that we, as conjurers, are careful to differentiate between an illusionist and a magician, and a mentalist...we use the correct title for the appropriate designation. (At least most of us do)

But I noticed that the media does no such thing. Today, as I was listening to the National news, the commentator was heard to say "Illusionist David Blaine..."
Funny, David has never performed a grand illusion in his life to my knowledge. And we reserve the title "illusionist" for the likes of Copperfield, or Franz Harrary (sp?)

Blaine, from the very beginning emphasized his disdain of smoke and mirrors...no tigers from boxes, no sawing in half, etc. Only cards, coins, bills, and close up stuff. That disqualifies him as an illusionist, if we stick to the strict definition, (someone who performs GRAND illusions)..he is a magician. (good or bad is beside the point here.)

I wonder if the media are equally as politically incorrect when they refer to mentalist vs magician?

The point I am driving at is that, like it or not, they lump us all into the same boat folks, and all our preferences for being called by the proper term mean precious little to them.

Perhaps it's really no big deal..but it is something to think about. I am interested in your thoughts on the subject.
The difficult must become easy, the easy beautiful and the beautiful magical.
JackScratch
View Profile
Inner circle
2151 Posts

Profile of JackScratch
While I myself am careful to use the terms properly. It has been my experience that 9 out of 10 magicans do not.
Dave V
View Profile
Inner circle
Las Vegas, NV
4825 Posts

Profile of Dave V
Jack, define "magician"

Oops, never mind. Wrong thread.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
Moyle with Parkinsons
View Profile
Loyal user
Australia
281 Posts

Profile of Moyle with Parkinsons
I don't think that is all that bad. I think that performers should definitely know and use the correct terminology because it is our business to know. I think I would begin to get a little worried if the general public began differentiating these different types of performers as this would suggest that the general public would be showing more interest in magic and therefore learning more about it which would mean your average performer would have to become more and more crafty to stay that step above the general public. Which isn't necessarily a bad thing but I think the lack of interest from the general public in learning magic means that when you are performing magic they will be more interested in seeing it because after all isn't that the lore of magic? The unknown?

Also going back to the its our business to know thing, I think that you have to expect ignorance from the general public on most things i.e. expect them to know a little bit about everything and a lot about nothing. For an example I will use tennis now tennis is played on different surfaces, under different rules and conditions. I know these are different but that doesn't matter to me I enjoy watching tennis regardless. Do you see what I am getting at, I think that it is respectful for other performers to know the difference but I do not expect the spectators to know because to them they are just seeing magic and our goal is for them to enjoy it regardless. Correct?

Moyle
"Signatures cause far too much trouble!" an original quote by Moyle With Parkinsons.
Whit Haydn
View Profile
V.I.P.
5449 Posts

Profile of Whit Haydn
All of these terms were originally just descriptive technical terms, not meant for the public. Illusionist was short for "Grand Illusionist." Grand Illusions involved an animal bigger than a dog or a person as the subject. Stage Magic included apparatus magic, magic with livestock, talking comedy magic, and sleight of hand with larger objects. Manipulation was sleight of hand on stage with smaller objects.

After Doug Henning successfully re-invigorated the art of magic with his talk of "creating illusion" and the way that played in the minds of the public, many performers began using the term "Illusionist" to describe themselves rather than magician. They felt it had fewer bad connotations than "magician".
The One
View Profile
Veteran user
326 Posts

Profile of The One
Illusionist sounds better.
I didn't come here to tell you how this is going to end...
I came here...
To tell you how this is going to begin.
LobowolfXXX
View Profile
Inner circle
La Famiglia
1192 Posts

Profile of LobowolfXXX
If the public DOESN'T, in fact, know, is it a relevant difference? If you go the magic castle on a given night, you may see cards & coins in the Close-Up Gallery, large-scale illusions in the Palace, and mentalism in the Parlor. I've brought numerous first-timers there over the last year, and to 95% them, they're all magicians.
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
Dave V
View Profile
Inner circle
Las Vegas, NV
4825 Posts

Profile of Dave V
RE: Tennis,

Until my stepson started stringing rackets, I never knew there was more than one type, let alone TWENTY OR MORE! And those are just the strings! Then there's grip size, grip type, head balance, overall weight and so on. And I just thought the strings that came with the racket were all you'd ever need. Boy, was I wrong.
No trees were killed in the making of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.
Moyle with Parkinsons
View Profile
Loyal user
Australia
281 Posts

Profile of Moyle with Parkinsons
Amen Dave. This is what I was saying we as the general public know nothing about things that we are not actively interested in. However this is not a bad thing it just means we always have something that we can enjoy.

Lobowolf, once again I'm sure your first timers although not knowing the difference between they different types of magic they saw enjoyed themselves. I'd love to go to the Magic Castle that would be awesome! One day I will get some money up and go.

Moyle
"Signatures cause far too much trouble!" an original quote by Moyle With Parkinsons.
kregg
View Profile
Inner circle
1958 Posts

Profile of kregg
That's odd I regard the media as delusio -ist.
POOF!
RandyStewart
View Profile
Inner circle
Texas (USA)
1989 Posts

Profile of RandyStewart
I'm OK with the terms as they differentiate the performers on a technical level. They tell us what you do. But yes, leave it to the public to mislable them.

I've been called a "mashishun" and even a "musician" when I can't play a note to save my life.
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24275 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
My favorite is Mugician. Sometimes, when my wife tells people that I am a magician, they ask, "What instrument do you play?"

I tell them that it's easier for me to list the ones I don't play. But I am a MAGICIAN.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Jonathan Townsend
View Profile
Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
27140 Posts

Profile of Jonathan Townsend
Student of Magic here.
Much to learn and lots of topics to explore.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
toomuchmagic
View Profile
Special user
534 Posts

Profile of toomuchmagic
In the real world:

magician = illusionist

plain and simple.

the definition of illusion is an erroneous perception of reality. This definition should cover any type of magic trick...grand or otherwise.
Michael Baker
View Profile
Eternal Order
Near a river in the Midwest
11159 Posts

Profile of Michael Baker
I really don't care what they call me... as long as they do.

~michael
~michael baker
The Magic Company
JackScratch
View Profile
Inner circle
2151 Posts

Profile of JackScratch
I apologies. I should have mentioned that I use the term conjoureer for the general practitioner, and illusionist for the larger, stage stuff, with animals, etc etc etc. I in now way resent other uses of any of these by anyone. I'm not a stickler.
Bill Palmer
View Profile
Eternal Order
Only Jonathan Townsend has more than
24275 Posts

Profile of Bill Palmer
Too YEERS ago I cutn even spel conjoureer an naw I are wun.

CONJURER.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Whit Haydn
View Profile
V.I.P.
5449 Posts

Profile of Whit Haydn
Also, CONJUROR.
Vater Araignee
View Profile
Regular user
MI
172 Posts

Profile of Vater Araignee
Main Entry: trick
Pronunciation: 'trik
Function: noun
1 a : a crafty procedure or practice meant to deceive or defraud b : a mischievous act : PRANK c : an indiscreet or childish action d : a deceptive, dexterous, or ingenious feat; especially : one designed to puzzle or amuse

Main Entry: il·lu·sion
Pronunciation: i-'lü-zh&n
Function: noun
1 a : the action of deceiving b (1) : the state or fact of being intellectually deceived or misled : MISAPPREHENSION (2) : an instance of such deception
2 a (1) : a misleading image presented to the vision (2) : something that deceives or misleads intellectually b (1) : perception of something objectively existing in such a way as to cause misinterpretation of its actual nature (2) : HALLUCINATION 1 (3) : a pattern capable of reversible perspective

So in conclusion:
Trick = Illusion = Trick

Main Entry: ma·gi·cian
Pronunciation: m&-'ji-sh&n
Function: noun
1 : one skilled in magic; especially : SORCERER
2 : one who performs tricks of illusion and sleight of hand

Main Entry: il·lu·sion·ist
Pronunciation: i-'lüzh-nist, -'lü-zh&-
Function: noun
: one who produces illusory effects: as a : one (as an artist) whose work is marked by illusionism b : a sleight-of-hand performer or a magician

Main Entry: con·jur·er
Variant(s): or con·ju·ror /'kän-j&r-&r, 'k&n-/
Function: noun
1 : one that practices magic arts : WIZARD
2 : one that performs feats of sleight of hand and illusion :

So in conclusion:
Magician = Illusionist = Conjurer = Magician

Main Entry: men·tal·ist
Pronunciation: 'men-t&l-ist
Function: noun
: MIND READER

Now considering a Mentalist in out craft is not reading minds but tricking or giving the illusion that he is doing so then that would make him....
Anybody?

Anybody?

Remember this "A lot of the words we use are our ARGOT and you can't expect the general public to understand it and you cant expect all of us to adhere to it either."
Well you can expect all of us to use it but your just going to cause yourself unnecessary stress.
"Good enough never is." - Vater Araignee
kregg
View Profile
Inner circle
1958 Posts

Profile of kregg
Then again, take notice how many magicians can't seem to get it when you read; "Topic Moved."
POOF!
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Food for thought » » Magician/ illusionist? The media doesn't know and doesn't give a rats butt! (0 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2021 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.16 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL