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Andy the cardician Inner circle A street named after my dad 3362 Posts |
Frankly, I do not judge a trick by the beauty or difficulty of the sleight, but based on its effect on the audience.
There are some rocking good effects out there - for instance, John Bannon introduced a couple of them in Dear Mister Fantasy. Worth checking it out . . . So both categories of tricks are part of my arsenal. Andy
Cards never lie
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the fritz Special user 647 Posts |
I just purchased a copy of Card College Light and having just read routine one (there are three tricks per routine), I am even further convinced that self-working tricks are just as good as nonself-working tricks. Roberto Giobbi does such a nice job of explaining just about everything he can with each effect and you can tell that in a good performers hands, these tricks would be at least as good, if not better, than some of the best sleight-heavy tricks. This book is impressive.
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rhucko1 Regular user Hawaii 126 Posts |
Whether there's sleights in a trick or not, it should not matter. It is how direct the effect is (sometimes adding certain sleights in a trick can enhance a formerly self-working trick by making it more direct). There are some very clever self-working principles that are subtle such as the Hamilton/Finnel free cut principle, the use of key cards, Hummer's principle, the Marlo/Joseph automatic placement, Gilbreath principle, and etc.
Thanks, Rich
"Card experts agree that the colour change, or transformation, is one of the most magical effects possible with a pack of cards."
- Dai Vernon's Tribute to Nate Leipzig by Lewis Ganson & Dai Vernon |
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warren Inner circle uk 4138 Posts |
As already said it's the effect that matters more than the method. I'm all for using the easiest method but if a slight can or will enhance the effect then I use the sleight.
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David Bond Regular user Maple Valley, WA 107 Posts |
There was a thread in here last year about what is and is not self working. It focused on whether sleights were used or not. Of course a self working trick may be enhanced by adding sleights. For example, if a reversed card is needed at the bottom of the deck, it may be there at the beginning of the trick or it may be turned over during the trick by using sleight of hand. The advantage of using sleight of hand would be that the deck could be shown to initially have no cards turned over. False shuffles dispel the notion that the cards have been stacked. But so would a no-sleight deck switch.
One thing that I didn't see discussed was whether the need for misdirection would preclude a trick from being self-working. For example, the trick begins with a card reversed on the bottom. At some point the deck must be turned over for the return of a card, and then turned over again for the reveal. Without misdirection or cover of some kind the secret to this trick would be revealed. For a more subtle example, I glimpse the bottom card of a deck for use as a key card during a moment of misdirection. Use of misdirection is a skill just as use of sleight of hand is. It requires mental dexterity instead of physical dexterity (let's avoid discussing the fact that sleight of hand also requires the use of misdirection techniques). If a trick requires no sleights but does require a moment of misdirection is it classified as self-working? I am leaning toward yes, but I could be pursuaded otherwise. |
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DStachowiak Inner circle Baltimore, MD 2158 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-01-23 10:17, David Bond wrote: Misdirection is also much more than getting a spectator to look "over there" while we "fiddle something over here" Misdirection in a broader sense consists of directing the spectator to interpret what he witnesses in a way that causes him to reach the conclusion we want him to. By this definition, all magic is accomplished by misdirection. It doesn't happen in our hands, it happens in their heads (and in our own!)
Woke up.
Fell out of bed. Dragged a comb across m' head. |
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David Bond Regular user Maple Valley, WA 107 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-01-25 19:11, DStachowiak wrote: Exactly! So how much misdirection (read spectator control) is necessary before we leave the realm of "self-working"? You can turn over a bottom card without being noticed while a helper is showing his or her card around, for example. Would that action be acceptable in a self-working card trick? What about more subtle or sophisticated forms of audience control? Or doesn't it matter? |
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Koolmagic114 Veteran user 319 Posts |
Gonna throw my 2 1/2 cents in here...
I got me a set of Steve Beams books.. Semi-Automatic Card Tricks.. Love them! For me.. I love doing the sleight of hands stuff.. But a nice self working card trick thrown in the mix.. for me.. is a nice break from finger flicking. So I am doing some effects which require "work" on my part..Folks are starting to burn my hands a bit more, watching a bit more closely.. BAM! Throw in a self worker or 2.. Nothing for them to see..get them looking a little less.Nothing for them to see or find. .Before I go back to "work" with the sleights. Ties in nicely. And lets me relax a little bit too and take aq breath.
Eddy
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Co-Creator of "TAGZ" / "Iced Over" / " TelePad" / "Penigma" www.magicianslair.com |
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shek Loyal user Los Angeles, CA 244 Posts |
I would agree that a lot of magicians overlook self-working card tricks. I myself stayed away from them for a while when I began magic because I was under the mistaken presumption that all self-working tricks were easy to see through (after all, the tricks I learned as a beginner were all self-working). I'm all for self-working tricks now, and I am actually trying to get my hands on Card College Light now
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jquackc Loyal user JC - Denver 218 Posts |
I fool more magicians with self workers than I do with tricks that require sleight. Self-Workers are great for laymen also because they disarm the audience who may be looking for "the move". When it isn't there, it must be magic. This is ideal anyways. I don't think there should be much emphasis on whether a trick is self-working or not... first because I don't feel there really are any tricks that are self-working, and also because I think we should define tricks by effect, impact, and entertainment value. There are many possibilites with sel-workers and room for engaging the audience. Also, sel-workers contain incredible principles that if mixed with sleights and good staging, make for some *** miracles... I just stayed up until 4:30 last night working out a trick based on a prinicple from a trick out of Card College Light. I don't think one should overlook sel-workers because they're not necessarily easy.
JC
www.jquackc.com myspace.com/jquackc It's coming...QUACK... a new ebook from the fallible mind of JC... April 2048... groundbreaking material... limited edition... only 200 will be sold. Starting at $47... Preorder your copy toda |
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jquackc Loyal user JC - Denver 218 Posts |
I meant "self-workers"
JC
www.jquackc.com myspace.com/jquackc It's coming...QUACK... a new ebook from the fallible mind of JC... April 2048... groundbreaking material... limited edition... only 200 will be sold. Starting at $47... Preorder your copy toda |
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John Nesbit Inner circle United States 1421 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-10-02 19:04, jquackc wrote: That's ok, you just forgot your-"self". (From staying up until 4:30 a.m.) |
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trickytrav Veteran user 391 Posts |
I am by no means a finger flinger I use basic to intermediate sleights but I seem to get great reactions to some of the better self-workers than to some effects using slights.I think that it is all in the trick and the presentation rather than the skill level of the trick that matters.
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