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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Right or Wrong? » » Using similar music and illusions. (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

Bill Nuvo
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http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......7&13

In this link above to another thread, I have questioned another magician about using the same song for a similar illusion by a prominent magician.

He states that David Copperfield hasn't used it for 13 years, but I really don't know how to think on this. To me it seems wrong and pretty much like copying.

What do you think?
rossmacrae
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The only way I might even try such a thing is if I thought that, within a very few performances, I could tweak it thoroughly into something that was entirely my own - if I loved the way the original presentation played SO DARNED MUCH that I would "run it up the flagpole" and see what ideas of my own, for a thorough re-make with a similar feel, that I could get from a trial performance or two. And whether anyone else felt like I was ethical or not in so doing, I certainly wouldn't be fooling myself, making "he's not using it anymore" excuses. The end-product would have to be really truly my own, albeit arrived at in a somewhat shady manner, or I'd feel as cheesy as a rock-&-roll "tribute band."
Josh the Superfluous
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I work in advertising and have become numb to blatant rip-offs. Those who think it's alright, probably always will. If it's any consolation, most of the greats were originals and I've never heard of Ricker. Keep striving for greatness and originality, and you will earn respect from those in the know. And even those who don't know wont be left with the feeling that they've seen it before.
What do you want in a site? "Honesty, integrity and decency." -Mike Doogan
"I hate it, I hate my ironic lovechild. I didn't even have anything to do with it" Josh #2
Skip Way
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Once again...we all learn through emulation. The novice guitarist learns to play popular songs from Fake books. The novice cartoonist learns by copying popular characters. The novice comedian learns by copying another performers style. Eventually, these novices either begin to convert what they've copied into original works or they go on to be nobody cover bands always playing someone else's work.

I would wager that every person on this forum started by learning the moves and patter straight from a mentor, Tarbell, a common magic kit or some other source based on someone else's work. Don't fault them for following the same path. Sit back and watch. Observe whether they remain a cheap carbon copy or move beyond the emulation stage to a level of orignality. If he's serious, eventually his stage routine will begin to develop qualities that are closer to his own than the model. If not ... more business for us.

No stones to cast here.
Skip
How you leave others feeling after an Experience with you becomes your Trademark.

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Scott Compton
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Hello all,

I am not taking exception with any of the views expressed here, because I don't have the answer myself.

Doesn't Rick Thomas use Chubby Checker's "Twist" when he does twister? I think that Greg Frewin used the same music. What I'm getting at, is, do you reach a level of achievement to where it IS accepted?

I know that we don't want to copy DC, or any others for that matter, but just because he uses a song for an illusion, does that mean that we all now must avoid using the song, even if we were using it before DC did it on TV? Not everyone can afford a TV special. So just when does it become "someone else's"....in other words, what if DC wasn't the first, but has become known with it? Does DC check to make sure that no one else has used the song before? And the others that were, do they look for other music because it is now DC's?

I don't want to be just like anybody else, but the lines just seem to cross each other here.

BTW, Terry Evanswood uses "Twist & Shout" when he performs Twister...

That being said, if I see another magician do the floating rose to "In Your Eyes" again I think I will spew.....But how many illusions are performed to "Do You Believe in Magic", "Grand Illusion", or "It's Magic", etc? Countless.....

I have used "Do You Believe in Magic" for years as background to "In the News". It is background music as I speak, and I have timed checkpoints to make the routine coincided with the song. Is anyone else doing this?

Scott
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Josh the Superfluous
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Skip, I taught myself to play guitar and only play originals. And in my art, even as a child, have never once tried to emulate anyone. So stand back I'm throwin'. (I do agree with your basic stance though, where it applies to others. I just take exception with "we all...".)
What do you want in a site? "Honesty, integrity and decency." -Mike Doogan
"I hate it, I hate my ironic lovechild. I didn't even have anything to do with it" Josh #2
Bill Nuvo
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In Ricker's defense, this was not meant as an attack on him personally. He has asked me about writing music for him. He sees it as a chance of being more unique.

Like Skip said, we all learn by copying at first. But as Compton brought up, at what point is it no longer learning and has become blatant copying? For some of us just a gentle reminder from others let's us know when we have crossed the line and we change, for others it is not so easy.

Using songs with the word Twist for the Twister Illusion seems like the logical thing to do. It is a fun quirky illusion and needs a similarly quirky fun song. One can't really deny that. But if you look at the way some performers (Hans Klok) you see they have a different way of presenting the illusion which includes different dance moves and lighting. This might be enough to set yourself apart from another doing something similar.

So with sitting back and seeing if they change, how long do we give them before they are a copyist?
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