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kermitthefrog Regular user France 128 Posts |
Can anyone who has worked with both the three shell game and three card monte offer comparative thoughts on their entertainment value?
Thanks! Kermit |
PaulGreen Inner circle 1133 Posts |
Both are excellent items. The only problem with both (or any street game) routines is the ending. For the 3 card Monte--bent corner. For the shells--finger on the glass over the shell.
Research is the key. A feeling for your audience (not to make them feel like they have been hustled). Good luck in making a decision. Regards, Paul PS for the shells--if you can find Giaovanni Livera's routine or Steve Spill's notes, you might find a theatrical ending that fits your purpose. |
Larry Davidson Inner circle Boynton Beach, FL 5270 Posts |
I agree that both can be excellent. The attraction of the shells IMO opinion is variety...not another coin or card effect. The attraction of 3-Card Monte is that depending on the version it can be done in the hands.
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ploter New user france 43 Posts |
i choose 3 shell game,so you are showing your ability (if you perform this with cards,the spectator think you are cheating peoples)
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espmagic Special user 978 Posts |
Concerns - both "games" are played for one person, with a limited amount of people watching. Cards are more easily seen by the masses, but the shells have more notoriety, both in NA as well as in Europe...and the shells principle can be adapted to more objects (like bottle caps, etc.). As well, the shells (seem to) imply that this is all you can do, whereas the monte shows that you have skills with cards, and should be able to do "other" stuff with a deck...
My 2 cents, having played both in real time. |
sleightly Elite user New Hampshire 500 Posts |
I have featured the shell game in my own work for years before releasing La Maggiore.
The three shell game holds a special allure to spectators that, in my opinion, eclipses three card monte. When you place the shells on the table, audiences immediately lean forward and watch closer. Most have never seen it done, but almost everyone has heard of it. Couple a deceptive routine with an entertaining presentation and you can't lose. The problem with monte is that audiences know that cards can be manipulated. The pea, on the other hand, is an unknown. Monte, even when presented metaphorically, still comes across as a con game. The shell game, while indeed a con, appears to be magic. Finally, if you are a magician, there is better card magic to be performed. Why dilute the card magic you perform by including a con using cards, when you can compell an audiences' interest just by setting out the shells? Of course, I'm biased. Andrew J. Pinard |
Ronnie Ramin Loyal user 233 Posts |
Andrew what type of ending do you use?
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vinsmagic Eternal Order sleeping with the fishes... 10957 Posts |
In a resturant or walk around I would have to say the three card monty.
In the streets of NYC where this is a gambling game to close to call. and you could also throw in the "endless chain" vinny |
Colonel Mustard New user 24 Posts |
Speaking as a spectator of the two routines but not as a performer of them, I always have thought shells seemed a bit classier than the bent cards. (Of course there are other, non-bent forms of monte such as Skinner's gaffed version, but I assume the comparison is supposed to be to old-fashioned monte.) On the other hand, the cards in monte can be examined, but probably not the shells and pea (at least together).
One concern is that the shell game rests on a simple principle that is known to everyone who has spent even two minutes studying it. If a spectator understands this principle (the real reason he's always wrong about where the pea is), the routine would seem to be pretty well spoiled, would it not? In monte I don't think there's quite that same potential for ruination. Everyone understands it's partly a question of deceptively throwing the cards. By the same token, if you are really throwing monte it is possible, in principle, for the spectator to win, though in practice it of course depends how you are using monte -- as a magic routine or just as an entertainment device. (Or heaven forbid as a gambling device.) But it is not possible for the spectator to win the shell game. I do not know, and would be interested to hear conjecture about, the percentage of lay spectators who grasp the basic principle of how the shell game really works. I assume that most have no idea, and on that assumption would favor it a bit over monte. Best, Mustard. |
sleightly Elite user New Hampshire 500 Posts |
Mars: My finish makes use of the notion that the pea is never where you think it is... (I hate to give it up, been serving me well for years, and I am writing a book on the subject and would like to save my routine for that)...
As to simplicity, the shells are a bit more flexible in methodology, as there are many ways of accomplishing your goal, including dodges and acquitments. This gives the operator more options in performance, and this allows you to focus more on the audience. That being said, monte relies in essence on one move that requires that the performer be right on technically. Of course, it is a matter of personal opinion. Someone who presents a show of card artifice would want to perform monte, a strolling performer might want to present it to keep from carrying extra props and worrying about surfaces, etc. As to audience awareness... In my experience, few know how the shells are accomplished, but if they do, that can be used to the performer's advantage. I find the shells fascinating because you have the option to show them right *or* wrong (something you can't do with monte) depending on your desire. Every performance then becomes a lesson in audience psychology, giving the observant performer a glimpse into the heads our audiences and the thought process that goes into perceiving a piece of magic (or gambling). This knowledge can be further used to exploit the divide and strengthen the impact of future material... Andrew J. Pinard |
bielke New user Germany 57 Posts |
i make a gamblers presentation for my audience first 3 card monte and then 3 Shell Game. i show them how easy it is for a gambler to get their money.
pierre |
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