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Carlos the Great Inner circle California 1234 Posts 
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On 2006-10-17 16:57, Banester wrote: I'm sorry, I must have missed that. Where was it said that somebody is innocent is they don't know they are breaking the law? Any time I use the term "innocent" I mean no law is being broken (hence, an "innocent" action that knowingly helps a criminal act is "conspiracy" and is not innocent). At no point did I say, or imply, that ingnorance is a valid reason for breaking the law. Quote:
If you do something truly innocent, then, in my opinion, you are fine. You have done all you can do, provided your "innocent" act was actually legal. -Carlos
Cognite tute
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GaryW Veteran user HSMagic 317 Posts
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Karma has a way of payback. Someday this guy might own a business that gets robbed, or his home may be intruded upon. Just as Earl.
Engaging him in conversation is pointless and only leads to unnecessary frustration. |
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glatner Loyal user 245 Posts
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On 2006-10-09 06:24, plasticdestiny wrote: I believe there was (or maybe still is) a group of magicians taking legal recourse against "exposure" I read about here actually... |
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Carlos the Great Inner circle California 1234 Posts
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On 2006-10-17 18:31, GaryW wrote: Hey GaryW, I hope you don't take this personally but I disagree with just about every word you wrote, lol. In my OPINION, not that it matters (but since you made your statement, I'll make mine), karma is merely how people interpret the interplay between statistics and the natural responses of others to unpleasant people. By that I mean that while there may be a slightly higher chance of his business or home being robbed, it is merely a reflection of a natural reaction to his (or anyone's) unpleasantness. However, more importantly, I generally think communication is a good thing. You are correct is stating that odds are that this person would react as they did. Of course, statistically, you would expect that, once in a while, somebody would actually have learned something and stop what they are doing. Please, please, PLEASE keep in mind these are just my opinions. But I really do think we should ENCOURAGE communication. -Carlos
Cognite tute
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27300 Posts
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Whether you think of Karma as statistical, unconscious or supernatural, it seems to be a part of the Indo-European world view.
And it can't hurt to consider one's actions and use the golden rule when acting knowingly. :)
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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Carlos the Great Inner circle California 1234 Posts
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On 2006-10-17 22:56, Jonathan Townsend wrote: As usual, you are right on on this one. I agree 100%. -Carlos
Cognite tute
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Joey Stalin Inner circle Canada 1072 Posts
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I just don't look for magic on youtube, metacafe, google video anymore. It just makes me angry. Like all the very very very very poorly done Sinful videos out there. Makes me angry. Makes me sad. See no evil I guess.
-A single death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic.
-It is easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them. -The secret impresses no one. The trick you use it for is everything. See you space cowboy... |
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Cameron Francis V.I.P. 7025 Posts
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I certainly don't encourage exposure but at the same time I do realize that the majority of the population doesn't watch magic on YouTube so it doesn't keep me up at night.
MOMENT'S NOTICE LIVE 3 - Six impromptu card tricks! Out now! http://cameronfrancismagic.com/moments-notice-live-3.html
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Fornby New user 66 Posts
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If the DC exposure on YouTube is part of a Russian TVshow as Ricker said; isn't it copyrighted?
If so this could be pointed out to YouTube and they will delete it. (I hope) (As I have a slow connection, I'm avoiding videos and such so I haven't seen the videos in question) Regards, Gene PS. When did the terms "hacker" and "cracker" become equal or can anyone tell me the difference as of today? I've been regarding myself a "hacker" for nearly half of my 57-years life but I've never "cracked" anything. In my book, a "hacker" is someone writing a short and efficient computer program (opposite: "bloatware") and a "cracker" is someone using programs (maybe a good "hack") to do illegal things - for example "cracking" a database. Since bloatware became the norm, true "hackers" are an endangered species. Just my personal thoughts... Z80 in loving memory... 
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Diavo Veteran user The District 357 Posts
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On 2006-10-17 16:36, Carlos the Great wrote: Carlos, that's one of the main problems with the world today -- no one takes responsibility for their actions! Have you read The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy series? In one of the books there's a "crazy" who only went crazy when he saw instrucions for use... on a toothpick box! "WTF?!" right? That's where the world is headed. Remember the hot coffee incident 10+ years ago at McDonalds? The lady sues & wins because there wasn't a warning on coffee to let her know it was hot & could burn her. STUPID IDIOT! And what you were mentioning about using Google to find secrets, this is a good primer for anyone looking into it: http://johnny.ihackstuff.com Fornby, your definitions of hacker -vs- cracker are succienctly sufficient. I think exposure boils down to lack of Respect. Obviously exposers don't Respect magic, magicians, or the entertainment. And some actually think they're do Good by making the information available to people! :-/
I'm not just a magician, I'm an interpreter of Reality.
Underground, above ground, whatever. I don't need a label, thanks. |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27300 Posts
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Last I heard... A "hack" is going into a program to change the way it works. Sort of a large "zap" if you recall those. Cracks are ways to fake out authentication - password/serial number requests built into software.
From there... issues of trespass seem to have muddied the waters as software is not owned but leased and can therefore be considered like real estate/property and any alterations as criminal trespass. Peace.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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bnadworn Regular user Western New York 131 Posts
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There is now a video "response" to one of the exposure type videos on youtube. I thought it was very well done. It is a tongue-in-cheek response on exposing how to play a guitar. It can be found here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX5lPAhTYbY&NR
I have been asking kids in the audience why they call out how a magician does something but never call out when they are watching a musician or a dancer. I know how they do it! It is just moving their feet around! I can do that! One little girl, who had just called out, told me she did it because she did NOT know how it was done. I thanked her for her honesty. Maybe the message will be spread one person at a time. - Brian Nadworny
"They say the hand is quicker than the eye but I won't believe it until I see it."
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21263 Posts
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If you guys want to tilt at windmills, buy a donkey.
Really these guys are quite possibly after attention. They get it from US for god sake. I think originally the "hacker mentality" spoke of was the idea that the "urban legend" of hackers is they do it just to do it. As I said URBAN LEGEND, not fact.
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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Jerrine Special user Busking is work. 629 Posts
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I'm no fan of exposure.
I'm beginning to re-think the harm of it though by these bored teenagers. Performed CMH for a customer, drove him crazy. (I wait tables 3 hours a day to supplement Magical income) Next time fellow was in he told me he went online to find out how I did it. Didn't say where but saw a video of some kid explaining how it was done. Told me that the explanation he saw couldn't be how I accomplished it. Too many strange movements, etc. I've viewed an explanation of Jennings Open Travellers that was way way off. I'm no fan of exposure, but misinformation can be as effective as deliberate direction. (my phrase for misdirection) |
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Jonathan Townsend Eternal Order Ossining, NY 27300 Posts
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On 2006-11-29 01:47, Jerrine wrote:... Do you mean for us to infer that exposure is okay as long as the video offering the exposure is hosted by an incompetent performer and teacher?
...to all the coins I've dropped here
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Jerrine Special user Busking is work. 629 Posts
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I'm hopefully clearly stating that the fellow who viewed a false explanation for an effect was pushed farther away from the actual method, now has no interest in seeking out easy explanations online, and appreciated the real deal even more.
By stating twice that I am no fan of exposure I mean that exposure is bad bad bad. In this one instance, even though it is bad bad bad, the kid posting the vid did some good for Magic, for the fellow who sought out the exposure. I'd prefer that there were no exposure online, but because there is, I'd like it to be as false as possible. Someone looking for what's not there, to me, seems like a good thing for me. It could be argued that because it is false exposure that it is not exposure at all. Perhaps I mislabeled the whole idea. Thanks for stirring up my grey matter Jonathan.
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Tom Bartlett Special user Our southern border could use 763 Posts
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Live by the sword, die by the sword is true and some group gave it the name Karma. Statistics would show that if you are a thief you will associate with other thieves thereby opening you up to being more likely being stolen from, birds of a feather stick together, If you are involved in criminal activities you are more likely to be a victim of criminals.
If you will steal reams paper of paper from your employer, you will steel other things from others. If you steal, you are more likely to lie also and vice-a-versa. If you gossip about others to me, you will gossip to others about me. If it is OK for you to take something because it was not locked up good enough, does that mean, if I leave my lawn mover out, wile go inside to get a drink of water it is not stealing if you take it. Locks just keep honest people honest, and a thief is a thief and a liar. Which are you? The nature of man is now and always will be worse than the most corrupt, demented, vial and distorted mind can conceive. Much of this dissection is about solving an unsolvable problem. The ones of use that believe that stealing and exposure are wrong, will still believe it and the ones that think they have the right to steal and expose will keep doing it. It is terrible but true; If you share your secret, it no longer a secret. If you share an idea of any value, with anyone it will be shared with the wrong people. If you preform a trick, you think you were the first one to ever do, some one will figure it out and claim it as their own. Most importantly if you dwell on all this injustice you will become angry, bitter and worse.
Our friends don't have to agree with me about everything and some that I hold very dear don't have to agree about anything, except where we are going to meet them for dinner.
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Posted: Oct 17, 2006 09:27 pm 
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