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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Tricky business » » Jolly Roger's Marketing Strategies......Finally!! (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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TheDean
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Roger,

CONGRATULATIONS on getting more of what YOU want, but at what cost?

Quote:
JR: - “If you look at my original post of what has now got over 2500 hits, you will indeed see that those are the two things I focus on.........mass exposure and a good product!!”


YES, it’s important to have a GREAT product, heck I’m pretty certain that most all who do this for a considerable part of our lifestyle all consider our respective products a “good product”, (or better! Hehehehe!) though if you “Mystify, Create Curiosity, Arouse Interest, Arouse Suspicion, Annoyances or just plane tick off” an inordinate number of your potential consumer base to what success would that be?

Is that “EFFECTIVE” marketing?

This has been the over-all and ongoing debate regarding mass direct marketing… SURE your hitting a ton of eyeballs, (Woo Hoo, Woopie, Yippy-O-Kiay!”) but when the largest number of those eyeballs (attached to intelligent brains and individuals) are clearly un-happy, what is the COST to our industry, and you business???

Heck, just look at ANY discussion regarding Dave Dee (Don't even go there guys! HA!) and how people "percieve" him here... you want THAT?

In truly effective success solutions and marketing, it’s NOT about what only “YOU” (Me, Us, I… anyone) want if we are to grow and maintain a truly sustainable business success with-out having to chase the growing snow-ball of mal-content spreading like a fungus amongst our potential profit constituency, eventually ****ing off more than we will ever hope to ‘win’ as long-term success relationships…

When we do this, we make life and success soooooo much more impossible for ourselves and for others, (all of us!) and for what?

All cuz “WE” want what “WE” want and the rest be dammed? (Is THAT good marketing???) An unfortunate and proven recipe for disaster, and NOT success at all as has been suggested.

A quick trip to the library and the local book store will bare this out. Carnegie, Hill, Marden, Abrams, Kennedy, Trump, Canfield, Bly, Brediger, Robbins, Nightingale, Gittomer, Ziggler, Rohn, Tracy (Mathew Mark, Luke, John, Paul… etc!) and I could go on into the thousands of individual authors who all suggest that helping OTHERS get more of what THEY want need and desire is the surest way to success and true riches! (YES, Including financial! – That is just a givin’, when we understand this law.)

Simple really… The Golden Rule is ‘ever-so basic’ when it comes to this sort of success support and solution really.

CONGRATULATIONS brother on your success in 2500 viewers. The question is how much harder is it to simple support and encourage these huge number is it rather than creating “Mystery, Curiosity, Annoyance and Hostility” in your over-all buyer base… the internet is a HUGE place and we can win or loose in a few clicks of a mouse button if we miss this VERY important lesson.

Will we make “everyone” happy all the time? – NOPE, no one is suggesting that, but to deliberately (or unknowingly maybe) create tension in our consumer base for the mere payoff of more ‘eyeballs’ is not a welcome trade-off in my book either.

Please DON’T Take My Word for it… visit the library or bookstore and see for yourself.

Funny thing is, we never used to never have to point this stuff out. It used to be common sense. HENCE the (now) cliché: “Common Sense Is Not Always Common Place!”

Quote:
MIKE: - “Deano! Nice to see the marketing guru himself on this thread.”


Hey Mike… no “GURU” here! The closest anyone here gets to “Guruism” is may the “GOO” in Good Food gone messy. (Hehehehe!) Thanks for your kindness! I’m just a guy who is passionate about success (YOURS and everyone’s!) and living his dreams… and SO CAN YOU!

Quote:
“Our marketing, when well-done allows us the opportunity to SERVE, SUPPORT and Provide Real VALUE for those who choose to enter into a real, lasting trust relationship (se: Re-Elationship) with us…"

Could you please give some of your insight and experience on how to effectively do this?


Sure Mike but to tell you’re the truth, this forum is loaded with real-life examples, and truth-be-told you already know the answer. All of us do!

One super-simple and obvious example: (…and it also has to do with THIS very discussion.)
Find out what our buyers want need and desire and do the best we can to deliver it to them (NOT as much a marketing principle, just good, ol fashioned Human Relations principle… go figure.) or get it for them as best we earnestly can.

When we get feedback, genuinely weigh it and then actually apply it appropriately and accordingly.

MAGIC BULLET MARKETING? – NOPE!

Does it WORK? Absolutely! Zig and others have all said it on one way or the other; “Help Enough People Get What THEY Need, and You Will Have All You Desire!”

Hope this helps and adds to the discussion. WELCOME to the Success and Marketing section of the Café. There’s LOTS more to be had here… the search tool at the top is awesome for getting you more of what YOU want need and desire!

Party On!

I am at your service and In HIS Service,
Dean
<><
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
Michael238
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Deano,
Lets discuss then the ways to go about finding buyers. Could you give some examples of your marketing succes, lets say to the school/library market?You have a lot of great advice, as always.

Mike
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ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2006-10-30 11:10, jolly roger wrote:
Donald........

In my humble opinion, you ****ize all this way too much! Please don't take that remark personally, as I believe most people do. You ask a number of "what if?" questions.

"What if they think they are good, and aren't willing to listen to others, or just don't see the clues? What if they aren't willing to work on improving? What if they put performances out there before they are properly rehearsed? What if their entertainment value is just bad?"

My response would be, "what does it matter!"

If you believe you are good, are happy in what you do, and can actually make a living out of magic.....or at any rate make some good weekend bucks if you are a semi-professional, surely that is all that matters.

I think I am the greatest children's entertainer on the planet(lol), my friend JoJO thinks I am mediocre....so what! I have a wonderful life. I love every second of every day. I have bought happiness and smiles to hundreds and thousands of children over the years, and I have just bought a Lamborgini! I am sure you will have more questions, so keep them rolling in. Look out Dave Dee!!


Ed Wood had the enthusiasm and the confidence. Have you ever seen any of Ed Wood's pictures?
"He was born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad." - Rafael Sabatini, Scaramouche
TheDean
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Mike, it IS a great question and one that has been addressed and answered hear at the Café as well as other places around the net. Too, since this is a bit off-topic (for THIS thread anyway...) I will [try and] keep this short. (We'll see how it goes.)

Certainly the one of the best ways to get new business (regardless of the target market) is to work with-in our sphere of personal influence.

In your example Mike, you (at the very least) KNOW someone who knows someone in your market of interest. Simply start by ASKING (an entire book on success in "ASKING") people you know if they know someone who needs your service support. They will either know or know someone who knows... (etc.) someone who can and likely WILL book you and THEN you are set for life!

Sound simple? - - Too Simple?

Yes and NO!

Quick story:
I was working internationally and on yet another cruise ship just prior to moving to (Rural) Reno, NV. (From Urban Sprawl California!) Being OUT OF THE COUNTRY, out of touch and THEN (while I was away!) moving to an entirely NEW market and yet working full time as a professional performer in a new (a LOT Smaller!) market, knowing NO-ONE and "Meeting & Greeting" my way to success all inside two short weeks.

I don't say this to "impress" you, I say this to impress upon you that not only is it possible, it is SIMPLE!

NOT sexy, not 'no-sweat, magic bullet marketing', not zero effort, but VERY SIMPLE and EFFECTIVE Success and Solutions in a VERY short amount of time!

In my experience (and in those coaching members that have done what I have told them to do, all) get the same RESULTS! Success.

The short HOW:
I talked, discovered, supported and ASKED anyone and everyone who was appropriate (which were more than most would expect.) to support and ask how I could HELP THEM thus helping me... see?

Most will say, well duh! And THAT is the right answer! YOU KNOW THIS, and though it's NOT that cool, sexy, magic bullet, 'technique' laden secret to success' we all read about in the magic marketing courses advertised, we think it can’t be all that easy... BAD MISTAKE!

ASK JIM Snack, Steve Hart, Julian Franklin, John Cooper, Eric Paul, Millard Grubb, Rick Allen, Chris Egelston (or ANY of the other guys who have success support products out there...) if what I am suggesting is true.

Simple, obvious and still true!

The truth is, it's true for YOU (all) as well. Not sexy, magic-bullet, but still 100% true!

WATCH-OUT; BLUNT TRUTH AHEAD!
There is simply NO EXCUSE that anyone here, with a quality product can’t enjoy a VERY successful business! Full-time, part time, which ever each may choose, but still a VERY SUCCESSFUL business "IF" they so choose and then simply DO what it takes to enjoy that lifestyle!

NONE what so ever!

I KNOW it's true cuz not only have I done it, (many times over!) I have seen and supported it in so many others who simply did what it took regardless of who, what, when, where that were at the time!

HERE is the so-called SECRET:
"The Key To Success Lies In The Simple Fact That SUCCESSFUL People Have Formed The Habit Of DOING The Things That un-successful People Are un-willing To DO... Regardless Of How They Feel!"

Shhhhhhhhhhh... don't tell anyone. It's our little secret, OK?

I am at your service and In HIS Service,
"Book em' Deano!" in Reno
<><

PS
Back to your regularly scheduled thread.
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
Jolly Roger
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"There is simply NO EXCUSE that anyone here, with a quality product can’t enjoy a VERY successful business! Full-time, part time, which ever each may choose, but still a VERY SUCCESSFUL business "IF" they so choose and then simply DO what it takes to enjoy that lifestyle!"

Dean,
You cerainly have some very wise things to say, and thank you for your contribution to this thread. You have not in my opinion gone off topic.......at least not to the extent that much of this thread has been off topic! I realise I am guilty of causing some of this wandering, but isn't that half the fun of it? Good old cyberspace!!

I am a believer in the power of 3. In simply financial terms it means that for every $1 you give away, you will get $3 back. I also believe it works in every corner of life. Some on the Café may think of me as a taker. They may think that the only reason I joined the Café was to sell my products. This is simply not true. I know this, and if you look at the threads I have started, many of them have well over 2000 hits, so hopefully the subjects I have bought up have caused people to discuss, debate, and be inspired on a number of different levels. The more you give, the more you will receive. The universe is bountiful, and each one of us can achieve greatness if we continue to believe in ourselves.....and never settle for second best! JR
calamari
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JR, that was very motivational thank you.
any thoughts on marketing?
"I came, I saw, SHE conquered." (The original Latin seems to have been garbled.)
NJJ
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I'm still reminded of MacBeth Act Five, Scene Five
Michael238
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Quote:
On 2006-11-10 17:12, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote:
I'm still reminded of MacBeth Act Five, Scene Five


What is this Nicholas?

Dean, thanks for posting to the topic.

Roger, I am not in Arizona, so lets say you talk about marketing in the thread?
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Michael238
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LOL Calamari!
That was pretty good! Smile
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calamari
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Thanks Mike, I thought I was being subtle.
"I came, I saw, SHE conquered." (The original Latin seems to have been garbled.)
TheDean
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Quote:
JR: - “I realise I am guilty of causing some of this “wandering”, but isn't that half the fun of it? Good old cyberspace!!”


Fun? For who? - - Oh, that’s right, it’s all about YOU! – Hahahahahaha… Just kidding with ya’

Truth be told, you confuse me, (and apparently most others as well…) which is exactly the POINT of so many who are sharing here “begging” for clarity and yet all we get is more confusion and frustration via nonsensical rhetoric, and I ASK YET AGAIN, is “THIS” good marketing???

ONE real, direct, clear and worthwhile answer to the questions posed would be a good START, though maybe a day late and a dollar short… but who knows.

Also, to be clear, just because there are over 2700 views doesn’t mean much more than just a few hundred (MAYBE) viewing eyeballs, but rather ‘all the same viewers coming back time and time again’ to see the ‘curiosity’ of this marketing train wreck! Hey, it’s your business brother, and you are welcome to destroy it all you please, I just hate to see the good business you say you have go terribly south due to something so obvious and simple to rectify and fix.

Quote:
JR: - “I am a believer in the power of 3. In simply financial terms it means that for every $1 you give away, you will get $3 back.”


Ha! Funny…
The “Principle of 3’s” has little, even nothing to do with any sort of fiscal term… it is a influence principle having to do with spaced repetition.

Quote:
Some on the Café may think of me as a taker. They may think that the only reason I joined the Café was to sell my products. This is simply not true.”


Great, now is your chance to PROVE IT!

Contribute to the discussion instead of deliberately causing all the “wandering” (confusion, contention, frustration… etc) and only trying to boost the view-counts (albeit misleading as noted previously!) and “answer the questions” asked of you instead of telling us how awesome you, your products and your marketing prowess is in your eyes.

Quote:
JR: - “I know this, and if you look at the threads I have started, many of them have well over 2000 hits…”


Again, just to be clear… NOT thousands of individual viewers, only the SAME small number of folks just waiting to see what-else will happen in this thread… kinda’ like viewing that road-side accident, a bad soap opera or watching the GONG SHOW to see who gets “gonged” (sent off the island, booted… etc) next! - - This may make for sensationalist television, but it’s lousy, “long-term effective marketing and customer service”.

If you REALLY want to help, SERVE YOUR CONSUMER BASE here at the café, answer the questions posed with real, valuable responses instead of more confusing (albeit sensational) road-side mis-happs.

Just an idea based on what we see most here are asking for over and over again.

IF you truly want to help, stop ignoring ‘them’ (us) for you own personal entertainment, folly and enjoyment and truly help those who are ASKING for your insights “with real answers”. - - I’m guessing there really ARE some valuable answers in there somewhere! Come-on stop holding out on us… really share! – How many more times do we need to ask???

THAT would be a good start, right?

Quote:
JR: - “so hopefully the subjects I have bought up have caused people to discuss, debate, and be inspired on a number of different levels.”


Maybe… but so far, the biggest level inspired is malcontent. Again, is that what you really want? I find it hard to believe that is you real aim brother… is it? I hope it’s not anyway. That wouldn’t be “Magician’s Helping Magician’s” here would it?

PLEASE understand me correctly, I am only asking and continuing to comment cuz I really WANT to see you succeed big time, and to that end, you may choose to approach this thing a bit differently now, but it’s up to you brother.

Quote:
JR: - “The more you give, the more you will receive.”


The KEY point here is that you must genuinely “GIVE” first, and MORE IMPORTANTLY, you don’t GIVE “to” GET, that is a selfish manipulation of the principle, it is NOT the intent of the law nor will the principle be honored.

Quote:
JR: - “The universe is bountiful, and each one of us can achieve greatness if we continue to believe in ourselves.....and never settle for second best! JR”


This is as close as anything, but the KEY POINT is that we CAN, in fact, achieve greatness if we continue to believe in MORE in “OTHERS” as we continue in our ability to assist them in achieving those dreams!

Selfishly, that is what I would love for you and your REAL, LASTING Success!

I truly hope you hear my heart on this…

I am, as always at your service and In HIS Service,
Deano (because I care) Hankey
<><
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
Michael238
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What ever the point of Roger's "marketing finally", it does not make real sense.Case in point:
David Ginn is in town doing a lecture tommorrow. If Roger is out to get his name out for the lecture tours, I have not seen one thing that would cause me to reccommend him.
I have seen no concrete marketing strategies here.
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Jolly Roger
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Mr. Lucky..............David Ginn is a good friend of mine. When you see him tomorrow, ask him about me. Also, ask him about my lecture at Blackpool this year. I am not out to market myself on the lecture tours. I get asked a lot, but will only do the occasional lecture these days. I have already done the largest magic convention in the world, so that was not a bad start!!I shall be posting more on marketing in due course. My problem is that my marketing strategies are working so well, that I don't have the time at the moment to give out too much information. But I will. Just watch this space!!
TheDean
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Interesting Mike... Thanks!

Which begs the ANSWER to the question: (for JR)
Q?: Was/is "THIS" the desired result you were looking for from your marketing scheme?

or as Dr. Phil would say:
"How's That Workin' For Ya'?"
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
NJJ
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Quote:
On 2006-11-10 17:42, mrlucky wrote:
Quote:
On 2006-11-10 17:12, Nicholas J. Johnson wrote:
I'm still reminded of MacBeth Act Five, Scene Five


What is this Nicholas?



Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player
That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
And then is heard no more: it is a tale
Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
Signifying nothing.
TheDean
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Nick,

Nice Shakespeare!
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
Jolly Roger
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"Is this a dagger which I see before me, the handle towards my hand?
Come, let me clutch thee! "( Macbeth..the Scotish Play)

I wish you chaps would not get off topic, although I must admit I love Shakespeare! So, seeing as you have decided to quote from the Bard himself, I might relate something that could be of interest. When I left Drama Scool in London many years ago, my first job was in a production of Macbeth at the Forum theatre in Billingham. I played a small part and Macbeth was played by Michael Gambon. MG was an unknown actor at the time( this was in the late 1960's) but ofcourse later went on to become a big star. His most recent role was ofcourse Dumbledore in the Harry Potter movies, taking over from Richard Harris.

In the early 1970's I did a comedy act where I recited from Shakespeare, and everything went wrong on purpose. I actually did that speach from which my friend NJ quotes. He left out the line before:

"Tomorrow and tommorrow and tomorrow,
Creeps in this pety pace from day to day
Till the last sylable of recorded time
And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
Their way to dusty Death.
Out out, brief Candle,
life's but a walking shadow..... etc.

When I came to blowing out the candle I was holding, I used Ken Brooke's relight candle. Then I went into a wobbly candle, finishing with multiplying candles. It was hilarious, and the act was picked up by a TV show New Faces! The result was that I was booked on a cruise ship for 7 months from New York to Bermuda.........my first time in the USA!!

Now, please can we get back to marketing!!!
calamari
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Evidently not.
"I came, I saw, SHE conquered." (The original Latin seems to have been garbled.)
Jolly Roger
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"oh wad some power the giftie gie us
to see oursels as ithers see us"

Bobbie Burns
TheDean
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Thanks gang!

Yes, I have received all your letters and private messages pointing out what we all know is obvious. – Thanks for caring!

This thread, at the intention of ONE of it's posters has little marketing value offered by this poster, intentionally! It is offered as mere game for the sake of sport, and his-own personal enjoyment... thank you we all know this. The REASON I am posting at-all is that hidden in this malaise of nonsense "IS" a very powerful marketing and success lesson to be had.

QUESTION:
Is what is happening valuable and effective "marketing" that will produce a 'desirable' BOTTOM LINE RESULT? (Profit and impact for our respective business???)

Yes and No. – Mostly NO.

Each individual is either a "LESSON" or and "EXAMPLE". The great news is, we can learn from each!

In this discussion there are "LESSONS" to be learned, and thus avoided, if we aim to be successful at anything more than destroying our base of influence in the name of folly and personal (selfish) fun at the expense of someone else! (The Magic Café.)

My posting is to ONLY to encourage the "EXAMPLE of successful, effective, solutions based marketing" rather than the "LESSON" of facilitating frustration as sport.

Do “we” (You n’ Me) ever cross this line in our own marketing? Certainly maybe not to this degree or maliciously or intentionally, but do we, or have we??

Maybe we have at some point and to some degree... so allow THIS to be a powerful and successful "LESSON" from which we can learn and grow from in each, our own success support business. (I'm sure someone will try n' take "CREDIT" for that as well... "Oh look how great "I" am, that is what they intended from this thread. NOT! Hahahaha!)

To me, I don't know the individual who is offering this particular "LESSON” personally, and other than the "LESSON" offered here 'of what NOT to do', I have nothing personally against him. My guess is that he may be a nice chap. Who knows.

My aim was and is to point out what we all know is true anyway, and that is to SERVE our relationships based on what they truly want, need and desire.

"SERVE Your Way To Success!" and life will be just peachy!

Hope that helps, and THANKS for the e-mails and PMs!

I am at your service and In HIS Service,
Deano
<><

So... Lesson or EXAMPLE?

I know I have been BOTH though-out my life. (That is right, we are all imperfect… willing to admit it or not! – Hehehee!) I hope that my/our "Examples" will well outweigh the "lessons" I/we put ourselves and others through.

TRUE, that is NOT for us to decide about ourselves, it is only something to strive for and hope that OTHERS will see us as an EXAMPLE of what is good and right.

Have a great one... peace-out!
Dean Hankey, *M.D. - The Dean of Success Solutions!
Serving & Supporting YOU and Your Success!
"Book More Shows... Make More Money... SERVE MORE PEOPLE! - Not Necessarily In That Order…"

(*Marketing Doctor) Smile
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