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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » A tangled web we weave... » » A Plan for Limiting Exposure on the Web (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Hagerman
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108 Posts

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What kind of effect could we have if we, here at the Café, started joining community driven sites like digg, youtube and wikipedia for the sole purpose of removing magic exposure from those site.

Digg:
Users can do systematic searches in the upcoming story section for magic exposure and bury them before they get enough diggs to hit the front page.

Youtube:
The software automatically takes vidoes offline if enough users flag the video as inappropriate.

Wikipedia:
edit, edit and reedit

I propose we make a new discussion area so that once an exposure has been found, we post it and jump on it immediately as a group effort. It would be wise to make this new discussion viewable by those members who have 50 or more posts so the casual browser has no easy access to these links. I myself am not at this magic number yet, but give me a few months.

If we act as a block, we can have an effect.
Hagerman
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Update- Editing wikipedia doesn't work. They have too many admins watching. I'm already banned!
The Drake
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Quote:
On 2007-02-26 23:28, Hagerman wrote:
Update- Editing wikipedia doesn't work. They have too many admins watching. I'm already banned!


Was that you fighting to remove the Interlude exposure? There was a real battle waged there a few hrs ago. LOL Someone kept removing the method and someone else kept replacing it.

Too bad you didn't read the earlier thread where this was discussed... I warned that removal of Wikipedia content over and over will result in a blocked ISP.

The You Tube flagging sounds interesting however.

Best,

Tim
Hagerman
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Yes, that was me. LOL. After they banned me, I switched to an isp with dynamic ip addresses. Ban me now!

I read your thread after I did the damage and just laughed. After I read your post, I gave up.
Hagerman
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Well, I didn't quite give up.
pkg
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The City of Ithobaal I son of Hiram I
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Have you noticed that the atheists talk about God more than believers ?
what I mean, ignore them, if you fight back they will keep on going more and more.

anyone interested in a "youtube" magic version with no exposure? if yes, PM me! I am working on something!
Double posters should be shot!

No really!!
Bill Nuvo
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Pkg...Are atheists exposing something? (hee hee)
Jonathan Townsend
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Eternal Order
Ossining, NY
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We discussed this with some folks at the wiki last year.

I invited one of their editor/mods here.

Why don't folks read? Smile

Here is a simpler plan to reduce exposure online; Quit being so willing to sell secrets to muggles, as they are under no obligation to keep secrets.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
Futureal
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Realistically, who searches the Internet for magic exposure?

Magicians.

..... the Masked Magician was a little different, it wasn't necessary for lay people to take a proactive approach, they could have just turned on their TV. It's a little different when you have to hunt out information on the Internet though - how is that different to going to a library and looking it up?
Jonathan Townsend
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Getting the data out of the libraries and away from muggles in general is a bigger project.
...to all the coins I've dropped here
C. Loubard
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Hagerman I'll tell you what, If I put up videos, "of me", exposing magic secrets and you headed the charge to flag them, I would personally try to make your life miserable... You have no right to take my constitutional right away.

instead, why don't you take the lead and have everyone stop buying magic. This will discourage the authors from further publishing books and videos, perhaps.
ed rhodes
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Quote:
On 2007-02-28 14:18, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Getting the data out of the libraries and away from muggles in general is a bigger project.


Even Dumbledore understood that without the muggles, the wizarding community would shrivel and die. Voldemort never figures that out (which is odd, because "Lord 'Thingy'" turns out to be a half-blood himself!)
"There's no time to lose," I heard her say.
"Catch your dreams before they slip away."
"Dying all the time, lose your dreams and you could lose your mind.
Ain't life unkind?"
mark2004
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Quote:
On 2007-02-28 14:18, Jonathan Townsend wrote:
Getting the data out of the libraries and away from muggles in general is a bigger project.


Indeed it's an utterly futile one.

Are you suggesting a programme of theft and vandalism targeted at public libraries? (which would frankly be ill-advised and illegal). Or are you referring to online libraries (which is probably equally ill-advised).

Once a secret is out it's out and no force in the world (magical or otherwise) will reverse the process. Even governments and intelligence agencies, with all their massive resources, have found that to be the case and it is also a situation that law courts around the world have supported (eg. The Peter Wright "Spy Catcher" case).

The non-magic world will write about magic whether you like it or not. One of the main problems is that because magicians seem to be shying away from publications the void is filled by geeky non-magicians who are interested in exposure. If there is no one else writing "non-exposure" material then the exposure stuff will achieve greater prominence. It seems to me that the best defence is for the magic community to get involved in producing good material for non-magic audiences that doesn't include exposure. The sort of thing I'm talking about is historical and review type material.

I think the attempts to erase or vandalise Wikipedia articles will achieve very little other than to get magicians a bad reputation. It is easy for editors to revert articles and in addition there are other ways of protecting against vandalism that have been developed for other controversial topics. It would surely be far better if magicians were to contribute positive edits. This would help magicians and their works to be recognised as comparable to other significant historical figures and their achievements.

In an effort to set a positive example I have recently signed up to Wikipedia and started a series of articles on magicians and illusions. I would welcome feedback and any suggestions for additional information.

These articles include:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffery_Atkins_(illusionist)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Val_Walker
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radium_Girl
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aztec_Lady
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_Death

Please note that there is NO exposure in these.
Chris Meece
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Quote:
On 2007-03-01 18:11, C. Loubard wrote:
Hagerman I'll tell you what, If I put up videos, "of me", exposing magic secrets and you headed the charge to flag them, I would personally try to make your life miserable... You have no right to take my constitutional right away.

instead, why don't you take the lead and have everyone stop buying magic. This will discourage the authors from further publishing books and videos, perhaps.


Then include me in the list of people whose lives you will try to make miserable. I would be more than happy to stop your exposure videos. Reminds me of the wikileaks nutjobs.
All small town magicians know what 793.8 signifies.
Mr. Mystoffelees
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I haven't changed anyone's opinion in
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I am with you, but at this rate of conversation, it will be the year 2856 before it gets resolved...
Also known, when doing rope magic, as "Cordini"
Braaainz
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Yes, people exposing magic tricks are hurting magic shops and making magicians work harder. I don't like guys revealing the hard won work of others merely to increase their online popularity. HOWEVER, I would willingly fight for their right to speak.

The Linking Rings can still wow a crowd, even though most people know how the trick is done. Heck, everyone knows how juggling is done, yet people are still amazed by balls and clubs dancing in the air. It's not so much the secret, as how the trick is presented.

Suppressing information is only going to encourage people to spread that information further and farther. For example, if I found that people were actively falsely flagging YouTube videos, I would gladly mirror those videos to keep them alive. Try taking the high ground. If you try dishonest methods (like suppressing information thru false flags or attempting to game Wikipedia), then you will only take the low road.
danhughes
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Whether I know how a trick is done or not, I still love watching a master perform.

So my question is, does exposing a secret make it any less impressive when it is done by an expert?
Chris Meece
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Quote:
On 2012-08-07 22:45, danhughes wrote:
Whether I know how a trick is done or not, I still love watching a master perform.

So my question is, does exposing a secret make it any less impressive when it is done by an expert?

Depends on the trick. Some effects rely a lot more on the magic than the performance wrapped around it. For example, the Balducci levitation would be a good example of that. No matter how well you framed the effect it would fall flat on its face as soon as someone googled it on their phone. ITRs would be another example.

Cups and balls is a trick that wouldn't lose its impressiveness. You can expose the trick with clear cups like Penn and Teller and it is still impressive.
All small town magicians know what 793.8 signifies.
Pakar Ilusi
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The cat's out of the bag.

Ages ago.

Since the first published Magic book.

Surprise, surprise... People know it's all tricks.

Smile

Magic is not about doing tricks, it's about entertaining people.

So, ENTERTAIN them.

Even though the situation now is that they know how it's done.

THAT's the challenge. Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
Zombie Magic
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Quote:
On 2012-08-19 11:09, Pakar Ilusi wrote:
The cat's out of the bag.

Ages ago.

Since the first published Magic book.

Surprise, surprise... People know it's all tricks.

Smile

Magic is not about doing tricks, it's about entertaining people.

So, ENTERTAIN them.

Even though the situation now is that they know how it's done.

THAT's the challenge. Smile


Very well put!

Lance Burton added an illusion right after the masked magician exposed it.
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