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Jay Jennings
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Quote:
On 2008-07-09 22:47, tacrowl wrote:
I realize this vent didn't see my act, that he simply pulled the material in based on his conversation with audience members and management before the show.


If you didn't see his act, it's possible he used the material in a way that you'd find completely okay. Especially since it was for the same crowd, he might have thrown in reference to what you did as kind of a call-back to your act.

If he continues using it in a different venue, then yeah, he's probably scum. =:)

Jay Jennings
tacrowl
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Jay,
I had totally forgotten about that incident. It is amazing how much something can bother you at the time - and later you realize it just doesn't matter. You are right though - it probably was just a call back...
Tom
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Jay Jennings
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Oh, good-freakin'-grief! I had no idea this thread was more than a year old!

Sheesh, I usually look at that before I reply.

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Dynamike
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Quote:
On 2008-03-30 18:55, Neale Bacon wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-03-29 01:21, MagicalArtist wrote:
Finally a thread that lets me vent here (no pun intended).

A lot of vents are going to disagree with me on this, but I find that children don't respond terribly well to ventriloquism, at least not as compared to magic.


Some may suggest that you have the puppet “ad lib” with the children. Not a good idea! Children don't know what are the proper bounds of behavior, so they will start saying more and more outrageous things to the puppet to see how you will respond. Add libbing with the children does not work well.

The one exception to this is when you do vent one-on-one for a child. The child loves it when the puppet is talking directly to them, because they're the center of attention. Not so with groups. With groups you really need to be interactive and get the kids involved.


Hey it's OK to disagree - which I do in this case Smile

Kids love vent if it is presented right. Kids DO respond to verbal humour if it is at the right level. For young ones (say 4-6) they love things like having the puppet try to do a nursery rhyme or song and messing it up. It almost become Magici in Trouble syndrome.

As for ad-libbing - a lot of our show is adlibbing. I get a lot of good responses when adlibbing. Jack Benny once said the best adlibs are well rehearsed. I have never had a kid respond with something out of bounds.

My puppets intereact with kids one on one as well as a group. It depends on how you do your intereaction.

I agree that "just" verbal humour might not work if you don't get the kids involved much the same way kids would be bored if you just stood there doing tricks in front of them without a chance to "join in" as a group or one-on-one.

MagicalArtist, I agree with Neale. It is all about how you present it to an audience. I am great with kids when it comes to magic. I am not as great with adults. Some magicians are vice versa. They like performing for adults more than kids. I do my average magic act with 95% of the kids audience. The other 5% I have to make some adjustments. I perform in Detroit a lot. A lot of the kids are being grown up with a bad life and wants to challenge the magician by given him a lot heckling. Or since the kids do not get much attention from their parents, they want to be a heckler to get your attention. One way that solves that with me is if I play I grew up with a bad life. The kids will immediately let me in their boat and listen to me. Or I can start off by being a good role model to them by dressing up hip hop and talking a little ebonics. I look at it all the same way with ventriloquism.

I watched Kimmo's magic and ventriloquism DVD, "Talk To The Hand!". He performs great for the kids. He kept their attention the whole time He also used different puppets. I do not know how well he can perform an adult show, but it all depends on how you perform to the age group and type of audience.

On my drawing board soon as I noticed his face talking and asked his name, I say to him, "Are you crazy?" He quickly responds back, "No, you crazy." It always get a good laughter every time. I do have other funny lines, but the script is not a long one yet. I have to put more time working on it just like I did with magic.

And, MagicalArtist, if you think you can never keep the kid's attention, no problem, it just means kids are not your type of audience with ventriloquism.
Joseph_Then
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Quote:
On 2008-03-29 01:21, MagicalArtist wrote:
Finally a thread that lets me vent here (no pun intended).

A lot of vents are going to disagree with me on this, but I find that children don't respond terribly well to ventriloquism, at least not as compared to magic.

Maybe that's an unfair comparison. Children LOVE Magic! Most things are not going to compare well with magic for children.

Yeah, I know that this is a year's old topic but then when you make the above statement it's like me going to "The Little Darling" forum and say "Run Rabbit Run is the worst trick in the world!" Smile

In my kids show, they response very well with my puppets. I have had kids who laugh for almost 10 minutes NON-STOP and the parents are very impressed.

In fact, I have been called back to do the shows with the same puppets again because they remember him.

I think that if you cannot do ventriloquism, you may want to stop doing ventriloquism in your shows.

Similarly, in my case, I used to do kids magic shows but I suck so I turned to puppets, where I grew.

I think it's just the natural ability of individuals so just build on that.

Quote:
On 2008-07-06 15:53, Neale Bacon wrote:
Probably my biggest frustration is when I am doing walkaround and kids keep trying to put their fingers in the puppets mouth or punch the puppet etc. Worse is when adults do or even worse is when parents encourage kids to do it.

Here's what I do when I face this situation: JOIN THEM!

Let me explain...

When the invited kid punch the puppet, my puppet said "What did he do?" I said, "He did this!" And I also punch my own puppet. Then, I gave the kid a Hi Five. After that, no one punch the puppets.

I think that the rationale is that the kids expect us to protect our puppet and when I turn around to support them, they don't know how to respond to that.

Of course, at this time, I also explain to them it's not right to do so.

This little tip may help you, but use it wisely. If it doesn't suit your act or turn out to become worse, don't use it.

I used it once a while only.
-----



Joseph Then

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Matt_24
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Hmm...I must agree with an earlier poster.

I find nothing entertaining about a vent doing 5 minutes of "Oh, we don't use letters B old pal.", to which the dummy replies, "Oh, you mean I can't take Bobby Bowling while drinking a bottle of beer while sitting on a billboard, etc, etc, etc."

Just my .02.
tacrowl
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Matt,
I think that depends on how it is presented. Ken Groves does an excellent bit about the letters a ventriloquist can't say. I first saw him do it live back in 1998 and it was awesome.

The link below is a video clip of the routine...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLd9Fsn-9CM
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Bob Baker
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Quote:
On 2009-08-04 14:58, tacrowl wrote:
Matt,
I think that depends on how it is presented. Ken Groves does an excellent bit about the letters a ventriloquist can't say. I first saw him do it live back in 1998 and it was awesome.
9CM


Ken is a popular and talented ventriloquist. But I think the routine with the plosives comes across as showing off. Great for vents, no doubt, but I wonder how regular audiences react. (On the other hand, Ken has been doing for years, so his audiences must like it. ) I enjoy watching Arthur Worsley do his "bottle of beer" routine, but after a few minutes, I want to say, "Okay, what else do you do?"

I, for one, avoid doing vocal gymnastics for their own sake. I only do them if they serve the routine and the characters. For instance, I do rapid voice changes when having two characters argue with each other and with me.

Again, I mean no criticism of Ken Groves. He is a model for us all to emulate. I just don't care for that particular bit.

Bob
tacrowl
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Bob,
I see your point. If he was doing it for ventriloquists, I'd think of it as showing off too. Ken uses this routine for his lay audiences. The first time I saw him - I wasn't even interested in ventriloquism. I would consider myself a lay person at that point. It played very well. I was laughing and amazed at the same time. So were the people around me.

I like that fact it's not "Bottle of Beer" over and over. I felt it was an entertaining build to the final line. You made Matt's point though - we all like different things. Its all good...
Tom
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Matt_24
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Ken is a superb ventriloquist but I think it takes away from his act. I don't think he needs it. Again, I may be in the minority here but just my .02.

I always liked the fact that Charlie/Mort were presented as being alive. As being real. And I believed (heck, I still believe) that they were real. If Bergen would have (well, could have...LOL) started showing off his lip control...it would have totally taken away from the reality he was creating with his show.

Great discussion.
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For me it adds mystery to the art...just like tape over mouth...whether its entertaining or not to a lay audience, escapes me at the moment. Smile
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tacrowl
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Quote:
On 2009-08-06 19:25, Matt_24 wrote:
I always liked the fact that Charlie/Mort were presented as being alive. As being real. And I believed (heck, I still believe) that they were real. If Bergen would have (well, could have...LOL) started showing off his lip control...it would have totally taken away from the reality he was creating with his show.


Interesting way of looking at it Matt. I always looked at the comedy created by the figure doing something that the vent said it couldn't. Your view makes something else even funnier to me...

When I put out my DVD, Ken gave it a critical look and came back with the fact he hated when I point out the fact my characters aren't real. If I take your view, he's basically doing the same thing!

I agree, good discussion.
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ColinDymond
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My Biggest Frustration is that Axtell puppets are so popular!
I have probable the first Orang-Utan, I pestered Steve for ages about it, he sent so fast he forgot to put a lable in it. Now I find that another magician in the same town has one and it's even called Oscar!
I know it's not just about the puppet but I would love to have my own character!
Hey Steve, Keep up the good work!
Matt_24
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Colin,

YOu could always have a custom AXTELL made. My friend Greg Claassen (who builds great McElroy replicas) has used a custom Axtell puppet for probably 20 years in his full-time act...so it has definitely paid for itself many times over and is one/of!
Joseph_Then
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Quote:
On 2009-08-07 17:06, Matt_24 wrote:
Colin,

YOu could always have a custom AXTELL made. My friend Greg Claassen (who builds great McElroy replicas) has used a custom Axtell puppet for probably 20 years in his full-time act...so it has definitely paid for itself many times over and is one/of!

Agree. I have a custom-made Vern puppet where I request a change of the feathers. It cost not more than $100 extra.

Still a unique puppet for me till now.
-----



Joseph Then

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