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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Ever so sleightly » » Paul Gertner's Ball Bearings (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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dxsare
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Hello all,

I found a great site on ebay to get great deals on chrome plated ball bearing for the Gertner cups and balls. Has all sizes from less than half an inch to 4" bearings, and prices are pretty good if you don't decide to go too big. I actually want to know in general what size bearings does he use for his routine? It's been a long time since I've seen that routine and it has had a great inpact on how I viewed magic throught the years. I'm ordering his Steel and Silver Vol 2 DVD as well (Originally bought his 1st volume thinking his routine was on that one, but never the less still a great DVD.) I'm thinking about using my paul fox brass cups for this routine since I know have a few sets so I'm trying to think what would be the best sizes to order. I don't want to go to big because I know that will make the routine that much harder to hit the final loads. Any do the routine or had had experience with it?? Thanks

http://stores.ebay.com/Chrome-Steel-Balls

Stevie D
-Stevie D
dxsare
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So after doin some research with various sized balls I had lying around I put together a set that I think would go nice for my cups. This should be a good set for any paul fox sized cups. And very cheap from what I previously thought it was goin to cost to get into this effect. Here's the line up:

4x 7/8" Ball Bearing $.90 each
2x 1 1/4" Ball Bearing $2.50 each
1x 1 7/8" Ball Bearing $10.00 each
1x 2 7/8" Ball Bearing $36.00 each (baseball sized)

That's less than $55 for the whole set and with shipping it would between $61-65 which is pretty reasonable. The bearing are made out of grade 100 chrome and that's supposed to be good quality. Hope this helps.

Stevie D
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lint
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Jake also sells bearings, although you'll have to check his site for prices. nice find though!
"There's many a slip 'twixt the cup and the lip..." -English Proverb
Bill Palmer
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Quote:
On 2007-06-24 00:05, dxsare wrote:
So after doin some research with various sized balls I had lying around I put together a set that I think would go nice for my cups. This should be a good set for any paul fox sized cups. And very cheap from what I previously thought it was goin to cost to get into this effect. Here's the line up:

4x 7/8" Ball Bearing $.90 each
2x 1 1/4" Ball Bearing $2.50 each
1x 1 7/8" Ball Bearing $10.00 each
1x 2 7/8" Ball Bearing $36.00 each (baseball sized)

That's less than $55 for the whole set and with shipping it would between $61-65 which is pretty reasonable. The bearing are made out of grade 100 chrome and that's supposed to be good quality. Hope this helps.

Stevie D


Paul Fox cups won't take a baseball. The chick cups will, but the standard cups won't. A 2 7/8" ball will not fit at all. A 2 7/16" ball will fit with just a tiny bit of play. For Paul's routine, you also need one that is way too big for the cups, say a 3 1/4" ball.

The balls are NOT made of chrome. They are made of chrome steel, which is a different thing altogether. Since he doesn't sell a 2 7/16" ball, you might want to try a 2 1/2" inch ball. It might fit, but it also might not. The mouth diameter of the cup is not what determines the fit in the final analysis. It also has to do with the inner curve of the cup.
"The Swatter"

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Mad Jake
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I searched 100's of vendors, remember something, you get what you pay for and as usual there are a lot of things that aren't mentioned on ebay. First grades are questionable unless buying from a reliable source.

I have chrome molly bearings we sell, these are machine grade bearings to tight tollerances. What you will find with cheaper bearings and I have a box load here is that even chromed they will rust, which means the chrome process was not applied correctly or to specs. Trust me you do not want to have to constantly remove rust from bearings, it's not a simple hand rub polishing procedure.

I sold a 4" Chrome Molly bearing to a client 3 years ago, he uses it constantly and all he has had to do is windex it. The moisture from your hand on the cheaper balls will take the micron thin chrome coat off and they will rust.

This isn't a sales pitch to buy ours, just search for the best you can find if you plan on using the bearings for a regular routine, this is not a tool you want to go cheap on, in the end you will be sorry. Search through Google and find bearing dealers that handle Chrome Molly bearings.

Also, some will tell you stainless steel is the way to go. I personally use stainless, but again watch the grades, I use only surgical grade which will never rust, lower grades of stainless will rust based on alloy content.

Bottom line, cheap is not always better and will usually leave you bitter in the end.

Jake
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
dxsare
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The 2 7/8" ball is not supposed to fit, that's the kicker ending. I forgot to mention my cups are a little bit smaller than normal paul fox cups as they will not comfortably fit a lacrosse size load. I seem to have made some of the balls just alittle too small I believe and now I would go with :

4x 7/8" Ball Bearing $.90 each
2x 1 3/8" Ball Bearing $5.00 each
1x 2" Ball Bearing $11.00 each
1x 2 7/8" Ball Bearing $36.00 each (baseball sized)

You could go with the 3" bearing, especially if you have large cups, and even if you wanted to use cups that already fit a baseball final load, he sells a 4" bearing, although I think "that's ridiculous"...

Stevie D
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Mad Jake
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4" isn't ridiculous if you know what to do with it Smile A Derby is required Smile
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
fishwasher
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How heavy is a 4" ball bearing? I'm, thinking contact juggling.
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Quote:
On 2007-06-24 06:34, fishwasher wrote:
How heavy is a 4" ball bearing? I'm, thinking contact juggling.


Your shoes have steel toes?.. Smile ..
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Mad Jake
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Cycling helmet might prove useful as well.
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
fishwasher
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I get the picture Smile
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Bill Palmer
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Quote:
On 2007-06-24 02:33, dxsare wrote:
The 2 7/8" ball is not supposed to fit, that's the kicker ending. I forgot to mention my cups are a little bit smaller than normal paul fox cups as they will not comfortably fit a lacrosse size load. I seem to have made some of the balls just alittle too small I believe and now I would go with :

4x 7/8" Ball Bearing $.90 each
2x 1 3/8" Ball Bearing $5.00 each
1x 2" Ball Bearing $11.00 each
1x 2 7/8" Ball Bearing $36.00 each (baseball sized)

You could go with the 3" bearing, especially if you have large cups, and even if you wanted to use cups that already fit a baseball final load, he sells a 4" bearing, although I think "that's ridiculous"...

Stevie D



That makes sense, then. I've seen Paul do this routine a couple of times, and the contrast between the last ball and the cups is very visual. It's not huge, but it is definitely visible.
"The Swatter"

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Richard Evans
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Those are really good prices for those balls.

Here's some info you might find useful:

A while back I was looking for some large chromed steel balls to do final loads. I wanted three loads, but the prices quoted for the large steel balls were too high to justify getting them. I found an excellent compromise: chromed balls used in the French game Petanque. This is a game played on rough gravelly surfaces, so the balls are really tough. With a set of three balls starting at around $25, these are a great option.

Several different sizes of balls are marketed, ranging from a junior size (around 64mm (2.5in)) to adult size of 74mm (3in). Some Petanque balls are patterned and other plain. The plain balls are basically huge chromed bearings. The junior size is too big for a PF cup. The larger sizes are perfect for jumbo cups. Most balls are stamped with the manufacturer's name, but I don't think that detracts from the effect.

For those interested in getting these from the US, they're available from Petanque America. Some sets come nicely packaged in cases. If you want to go nuts and spend $$$, take a look at the Unibloc solid brass balls on the 'Competition Boules' page.
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Bill Palmer
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I picked up a Bocce set that had metal balls a couple of years ago for about $20.00 at Ross. They sell overrun merchandise. Looking at that web site, they may be a Petanque set. Bocce is not real big in Texas. In Texas, we play horseshoes instead. Real Texans leave the horses in the shoes! Smile

In Georgia, they use toilet seats. Check this out.
http://matcmadison.edu/clarionline/news/default.shtm

Scroll down to the Redneck Games.
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
WoodRat
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I bought a 2" bearing from that same eBay shop (Chrome-Steel-Balls) for about $12 as I recall. I've used it regularly for about a year. When I first got it, it was beautiful, now it has a few small scratches but no rust and it still shines. It is heavy and I don't know if I could hold out anything much larger, but I'm satisfied with the quality overall. I know I could buy better but it wouldn't make a difference to me since I'm using it as a magic prop and not a critical machine part.
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Bill Palmer
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There are some aluminum and/or steel balls sold for contact juggling. They may be a tad lighter.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
dxsare
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So I just got the ball bearings in in the mail today and I couldn't be happier. I got the sizes that I mentioned earlier in the post and they all work out great for this routine. The balls are very shiny, and very heavy! well the big ones anyways. Working with the steel has been much better than the glass marbles, 8 ball and baseball I was practicing with. It is quite a sight to see the presentation left at the end of the routine in person. It looks amazing, and in a few months I can't wait to perform this routine for friends... it's been about 15 years I've wanted to learn this routine and it's now finally a reality that I have all the props, and the routine down. Now I just have to make it look pretty ;-)

Like WoodRat said, I'm sure there are better balls out there, but these are beautiful and strong, as I already dropped the 2" one on the patio floor and it still looks brand new. These fit my needs perfectly without breaking the bank.

Stevie D
-Stevie D
WoodRat
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LOL just don't drop in on your toe! That smarts, I know Smile

Cheers,
WoodRat (aka One-trip-Charlie)
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Zhang
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LOL.
Bill Palmer
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Quote:
On 2007-07-10 20:21, dxsare wrote:
I already dropped the 2" one on the patio floor and it still looks brand new.



The floor or the ball bearing? Smile
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
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