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rawdawg
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I didn't see nothing... all that Bling was washing out my computer screen... Smile

I'd like to point out that doing moves on the bed, floor, blankets and rugs is way harder than doing them nicely seated at a proper table. This speaks of the level of skill the Operator possesses.

rdwg
One time, when I was young, I botched a sleight so bad, Vernon, Marlo & Miller rolled over in their graves. But I didn't see Elmsley, probably because he was behind the others.
tommy
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A gambler not knowing the name of a move does mean it came from the card table. For all you know I was the old timer who showed the hustler the Zarrow in prison. I take the point however that a move might have been known a long time before a magician reinvented and published it. Its a long time ago that Herb came up the Zarrow though and I think I would credit him with the invention and on the strength of a hustler not knowing it's name it can not reasonably be taken from him.

The hustlers comment: "if I noticed it, it was worthless." is nonsense if you think about it. People have been caught dealing bottoms and so on but it has not rendered them useless.

The Zarrow is like the Bumble Bee:

Calculations made in the 1930s at the University of Gottingen seemed to prove that it was aerodynamically impossible for a bumblebee to fly. Bumblebees, of course, continued to fly about with blithe disregard for these results!
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

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Mr. Z
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Quote:
On 2007-07-18 02:57, rawdawg wrote:

I'd like to point out that doing moves on the bed, floor, blankets and rugs is way harder than doing them nicely seated at a proper table. This speaks of the level of skill the Operator possesses.



And to the lack of finances for proper equipment! Smile
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
Vandy Grift
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Thanks for the vid Doc. Looked great.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
onbekende020
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Thanks everybody, for your point of view...i'll guess this post is like the discusions on Dai Vernons Revelations DVD's on magic vs gambling...

Funny quote from the Professor:

"see, your thinking like a magician again, nobody is interested in dealing continues bottoms..."

Like Expertmagicians said: its a symbiotic relationship, where (again wisdom of Vernon) we have to justify our movements at the card table as well as in magic...

USM
Vandy Grift
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I believe it was Ammars comment about "consecutive centers" that got the Professor all worked up. LOL
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
Unknown419
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Quote:
On 2007-07-18 07:26, Mr. Z wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-07-18 02:57, rawdawg wrote:

I'd like to point out that doing moves on the bed, floor, blankets and rugs is way harder than doing them nicely seated at a proper table. This speaks of the level of skill the Operator possesses.



And to the lack of finances for proper equipment! Smile


I beg to differ...

Proper adjective 1 [ attrib. ] truly what something is said or regarded to be; genuine [ postpositive ] strictly so called; in its true form: 2 [ attrib. ] of the required type; suitable or appropriate : according to what is correct or prescribed for a particular situation or thing: according to or respecting recognized social standards or conventions; 3 ( proper to) belonging or relating exclusively or distinctively to; particular to:

You say lack of proper equipment...I would like to remind you there were no so-call proper equipment in the beginning when all of these moves were originally invented {in its true form}. People played dice in the dirt, in barns, clubs and on the bed...hence the blanket/pad roll and cards were played on tables, floors, crates, porches etc. and still are today in certain countries and in Black and Spanish communities and guess what we're still robbing' ya'll in these areas even though ya'll are still robbing us and taking our moves and putting them in magic and gambling books as your own because we don't have access to writers.

This is one of the main reasons why I post my videos to let ya'll know where the moves originally came from. Note: The move I posted is not in any gambling video or book I've read to date...Why? Because y'all are stuck in the world of poker and ya'll feel that the world must conform to what ya'll are playing or it's not proper. Get the f-out of here with that bull****. The world doesn't revolve around ya'll or this bull****. Ya'll are but a drop in the bucket compared to everyone in the world.

Ya'll post cheating moves fitted for Poker and Gin and that's all ya'll know when there are thousands of cheating moves that exist for various games. Have you noticed in the magic and gambling books that the cheating moves that's written is directed toward the White card and dice games and not the Black ones; likewise with the videos.

You think cold decking originated with ya'll when we had no tables or chairs and had to play on porches etc. this is why we had to invent the cold deck move to go under the money and while I'm on the subject. Scarne's (your so called idol) cold deck move was so horrible in "The Sting" that they had to film it from the side besides the horrible hand muck that he does in his Expose and quiet as kept a lot of the dice combinations and how to make loaded dice in Scarne's book Scarne on Dice is wrong.

When Scarne was at his prime going to the service men to pull coats he still got robbed by the black cheats with their un-proper moves but Scarne didn't run 'tell that in his book did he? And y'all heard in my video that that same man who robbed Scarne after looking at one of Steve's dice moves said "this is what your man was trying to do" showing his level of expertise.

These two men were best friends and hustling partners and I had to go to them in order for them to teach me so when you talk about my teachers and their improper setting/hotel room bed, you’re talking about me.

Bottom Line: Rawdawg is absolutely right…the moves are much harder to do.

Signed

The Doctor

Posted: Jul 18, 2007 4:25pm
Quote:


On 2007-07-18 11:11, Vandy Grift wrote:
I believe it was Ammars comment about "consecutive centers" that got the Professor all worked up. LOL


Vandy maybe Ammar was not absolutely talking about consecutive centers because when you play head-up both parties get cards or maybe he was like consecutive seconds but anyway I video taped a friend of mine who know nothing about gambling dvd's or videos...as a matter fact my friend is uneducated and can barely read.

He told me that he saw a picture of Scarne's Center deal in a book and made up his own because he couldn't read. I could only imagine how Vernon felt after seeing Al Kennedy do a middle deal. Well center deals is no longer a thing of the past but when you meet someone who is the best at everything I've seen him do especially inventing them on his own because he can't read, I was awed by his geniusness and talent.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vJ0g6z0oa4

Take Care

Respectfully,

Doc
Vandy Grift
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I'm in awe as well. That's outstanding!

Posted: Jul 18, 2007 4:33pm
Doc,

It's on the Revelations series where Vernon goes off on Ammar. I think you have that set and I can find when it happens if you want to watch it.It's actually kind of funny.

I thought Ammar asked a pretty reasonable question. But Vernon gets all ****ed off. Ammar asks about "consecutive centers" and Vernons says "NO,no,no you're talking like a magician now" and when he says magician, he says it like it's the dirtiest word in the world.

He really lets Ammar have it, more than he should have probably. But I think the Professor was getting a little tired and cranky at that point.

Posted: Jul 18, 2007 4:41pm
Man I'm looking at that video some more. To think that a man could come up with that from just a picture is mind boggling.
"Get a life dude." -some guy in a magic forum
silverking
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Doc, that was amazing.

Like Vandy I'm in awe of your center dealing buddy!

I wouldn't have suspected a thing if you hadn't set it up as a center and greek deal.

Your friend really brings to light how good a guy can get.
If Alan Kennedy was as good as your buddy, you can see how it probably fried Vernon on the spot.
rawdawg
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Quote:
On 2007-07-18 07:26, Mr. Z wrote:

And to the lack of finances for proper equipment! Smile


Says the guy with pocket sized close up pad...

Man oh man, those centers! Last time I saw decent centers an Australian and Scottish dude were cutting heads in the Castle close up room.
One time, when I was young, I botched a sleight so bad, Vernon, Marlo & Miller rolled over in their graves. But I didn't see Elmsley, probably because he was behind the others.
Expertmagician
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Great deals Doc....thanks for the video !

I never did a center deal....too hard...But, used to do a greek deal in my youth. Although your looked cleaner...I used to like to do my greek deal which dealing the cards "face-up" stud style. I found the stud deal gave me great cover.

I look forward to other videos ...

Thanks again to a true artist !
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Mr. Z
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Quote:
On 2007-07-18 16:46, rawdawg wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-07-18 07:26, Mr. Z wrote:

And to the lack of finances for proper equipment! Smile


Says the guy with pocket sized close up pad...



Oh I have a real big one too, but I only whip it out on special occasions.
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
Expertmagician
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Mr. Z,

Just don't take it out for your kitchen table poker game Smile

Save it for strip poker. So you can control who wins and loses and when Smile
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splice
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Very nice as always Doc. Thanks for sharing, always great to see more from you.
luvisi
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Doc: How familiar with your friend's technique are you? Are you able to answer a question or two?

It appears as though the outer right corner of the lower half is between the first and second fingers, the corner of the lower card of the upper half is just to the right of the second finger, and the corner of the top card of the upper half is between the first and second finger, with the top half beveled to the left and the lower card of the top half gripped between the second finger and the palm of the hand. The third and little finger rest against the face of the bottom card of the upper half. Am I close?

When I take this position, I can deal the top card, pushing it over the second finger, the second finger making sure that only one card is pushed over, and I can deal the center card, the third and fourth fingers easing it out from the grip of the second finger. The trouble is, I have a very obvious step at the outer left corner of the deck. Do you know if your friend has this step? If so, do you know how he hides it? Is it visible in person, and just difficult to see because it is shrunken on video and the cards have an all over back pattern, or is he hiding it somehow?

Andru
J Wessmiller
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Amazing video Doc- thanks for sharing it.
be well,
JW
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Unknown419
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Andru to be honest with you I can't do his middle deal even though I have footage of him teaching me of which I will not explain nor post. This video was for Vandy to see basically consecutive middles while dealing....that's all.

I wish you luck with the deal.

Take Care

Doc
Paul H
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Hi Doc,

This really is THE most incredibly deceptive center deal I have ever seen in my life!!! What wonderful technique. Now I will be spending all weekend trying and failing to reproduce the method. Thanks a lot!!!

Seriously though, many thanks for showing us the footage Doc. Its very special.

Regards,

Paul H
ASW
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Quote:
On 2007-07-19 00:58, luvisi wrote:
Doc: How familiar with your friend's technique are you? Are you able to answer a question or two?

It appears as though the outer right corner of the lower half is between the first and second fingers, the corner of the lower card of the upper half is just to the right of the second finger, and the corner of the top card of the upper half is between the first and second finger, with the top half beveled to the left and the lower card of the top half gripped between the second finger and the palm of the hand. The third and little finger rest against the face of the bottom card of the upper half. Am I close?

When I take this position, I can deal the top card, pushing it over the second finger, the second finger making sure that only one card is pushed over, and I can deal the center card, the third and fourth fingers easing it out from the grip of the second finger. The trouble is, I have a very obvious step at the outer left corner of the deck. Do you know if your friend has this step? If so, do you know how he hides it? Is it visible in person, and just difficult to see because it is shrunken on video and the cards have an all over back pattern, or is he hiding it somehow?

Andru


Come on now, Andru. Does this guy have a choice about all of his stuff being picked apart by a bunch of magicians who want everything for free? How would you feel?

Doc: that's a really pretty deal. I don't want to know what he's doing, but thanks for letting us see it.
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

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iamslow
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Thanks Doc, pure eye candy..
"Everyone is tough till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
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