The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The little darlings » » Idea for finale... (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
ClodAppleleft
View Profile
Regular user
Manchester, NH
195 Posts

Profile of ClodAppleleft
I've heard a lot of you say that you don't do "torture" tricks for kids. Needle through the arm or tongue, nail up the nose, arm chopper, etc. I am doing a B-Day party for my neighbor this summer, and when I was talking to the mother, I told her that my new finale was sword thru the neck. The mother was a little apprehensive, but the kid who the party was for got wide eyed, and said, "COOL!" I have been trying to think of a way I can do this, but make sure that the kids don't do something stupid.

Then it dawned on me. One trick in my repetoire is the "Enchanted Glass" where I tell a story about a Princess and a broken magic necklace. I give the pieces out to the kids, and have them toss them back to me, (seems to work) and then put them in the glass. When I'm done, and I turn the glass over and dump out the pieces, they've combined to become the necklace again. What I am thinking is combining the 2 tricks, and after I pull out the necklace, put it around the neck of the person I'm doing sword thru the neck on, and say, "Now the magic necklace will protect our Princess"

Thoughts?
There are many different ways to cut an apple.
Emazdad
View Profile
Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

Profile of Emazdad
Woah! I wouldn't even think about doing it, Of course the boy concerned will go "Cool!" they love the gory stuff, but that doesn't mean they should see it.

Out of interest how old is this kid.

Even with the magic necklace story, you may get some kid with a kitchen knife and his/her mum's necklace trying to copy what you did.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
kenscott
View Profile
Inner circle
1869 Posts

Profile of kenscott
HUM! I kindy like the idea of the two tricks. But I do see the concern that Emazdad has.

In GA. the library system is having a theme called Books ahoy. A theme about boats, ocean, under water, pirates. I want to do a sword through neck using a pirate theme.

So yes I like your idea. Why not do it to an adult as opposed to a kid?

Ken
ClodAppleleft
View Profile
Regular user
Manchester, NH
195 Posts

Profile of ClodAppleleft
I was actually planning on doing it to an adult. I figured I would say that this is much too dangerous for a child, and pull out one of the adults. As I said, the party is for my neighbor so I know most of the people going to be there in general. The boy is turning 5, but the age range overall is from about 5 to 14 for the kids. I understand the concern about the child, the kitchen knife, and their mother's necklace. That is also why I'm going to do it to an adult, and make sure I say that the necklace is magical, and there is no other necklace ANYWHERE like it, so don't try this with your mother's necklace.

Don't get me wrong, I do understand that there are certain things that we need to be careful of when dealing with children. I have a 2 year old daughter myself, and I am very concerned as to what she watches on TV and does in general.

Before my show, I am going to go to all of the parent's there and explain to them what I am going to do. If ANY of them objects, I will go with a contingency finisher.

Jeff
There are many different ways to cut an apple.
Emazdad
View Profile
Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

Profile of Emazdad
I did a magic show at an old peoples home, the show was for Adults (This was before I decided not to do Adult stuff anymore), I took along my headchopper (I can't spell guilowhat'sit)and during the show I had one of the nurses on stage about to have her head "chopped off", all of a sudden there was a frightened cry from the side of the room, and there was a girl of about 7 standing there with her dad, they'd come to pick up Mum who just happened to be in the headchopper. The girl was very upset and despite being told that nothing bad was going to happen to mum as it was magic she wouldn't believe it and was so upset I had to release her mum and abandon the trick. Some children do not understand that it is pretend, after all we go a long way to convince then the magic is real, and they can get very upset. If you do decide to do the trick be aware this may happen.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
p.b.jones
View Profile
Inner circle
Milford Haven. Pembrokeshire wales U.K.
2642 Posts

Profile of p.b.jones
Hi,
In the venues where I perform my adult cabaret regularly, I use a guilotine. But I have the Bar manager to point out a suitable candidate for me. One Bar manager, Jim, is a dab hand at it now after weekly shows for 15 years from March to the end of October.
He knows not to pick dads with young kids and to pick helpers that are fit enough to stay kneeling on a cushion for a while.
Phillip
TroyRoark
View Profile
Loyal user
Springfield IL
282 Posts

Profile of TroyRoark
Quick answer:

Don't do it. It's not worth the possible problems you might have with other kids/parents invited to the party.

Troy Roark
kenscott
View Profile
Inner circle
1869 Posts

Profile of kenscott
Danger tricks have been around along time and kids like them. Are you guys saying DO NOT do any danger tricks in front of kids? I can remember a magician coming to my school as a kid and he used Abbotts arrowhead where he made a kids head disappear. To this day I remember that and how cool it was. It did not make me go home and try that on my sister. I think as performers we have the obligation to do what is right when it comes to performing but I think we may be getting too politicaly correct. Now I am not saying go into a PRE school /daycare and do danger tricks. I am not saying bring out the bloody cloths to wrap around the neck or to show a chopped off hand in a basket. You can do danger tricks and make them magic as opposed to making them dangerous. This is just my 2 cents. I may be off base here.

Ken
braddevant
View Profile
Regular user
133 Posts

Profile of braddevant
I also used to do guilotine in my act, but that was years and years ago. Times have changed and kids are (for better or worse) not as tough. The world is more dangerous and as a result we protect them from everything, to the excess sometimes I feel. I would never do a danger trick in this day and age.
Adam V
View Profile
Special user
603 Posts

Profile of Adam V
David Ginn used a headchopper all the time. In school shows too.
Adam V - 9 out of 10 dentists recommend him.
Andy Wonder
View Profile
Special user
Auckland, New Zealand
744 Posts

Profile of Andy Wonder
I have a headchopper but very rarely use it. I will use it at birthday parties if I have a 10 year old boy and all his mates about the same age are there. I will also use it in a larger family show. The only time I had a child reacting the wrong way was at a particular birthday party a few years ago. All the children were aged about 8-13 years. The birthday boy was 9 and he had a 13 year old sister. What I didn’t notice throughout the show was that the older sister had Down syndrome. She could not handle the danger aspect and panicked when she saw her brother in there. She began screaming and crying and it turned the climax of my show a little sour.

You really do have to be careful, but I think the real danger is not really scaring the children so much as it is offending the parents.
Smile
Andy Wonder, Auckland, New Zealand
Richard Landry
View Profile
New user
Chatham, Illinois
18 Posts

Profile of Richard Landry
I use the Arrowhead illusion in one of my school shows using a 5th or 6th grader. So far I have not had any negative feedback.
JSMagic
View Profile
Loyal user
Boston
202 Posts

Profile of JSMagic
I remember about 6 years ago when I was about 7 I was at a cub scout meeting thing and we ahd these magicians that had built up what was behind the curtain the whole (you know"now lets see whats behind the curtain...no wait its too good we'll wait)-and finally at the end they took it out, it was a nice looking head chopper-oo's and ahh's and they picked a kid that if i remember correctly was younger then me at the time (maybe 5 or 6) and there was absolutly no problem-kids and parents loved the head chopper. My guess is you should ask the parents before hand, then everything would work out fine. Josh
If a magician is not intending to "trick" a spectator, why is every "trick" called a magic "trick"?
TroyRoark
View Profile
Loyal user
Springfield IL
282 Posts

Profile of TroyRoark
Hey Richard, how are you doing?

Anyway, I can't tell you how many times (and I've done it maybe 500 times) I've put a kid in the guillotine, and he freak out. Of course, I'm still doing it.

Sword through the neck is another story. That particular trick should be called Sword through The Throat, because that's what every mom is thinking that watches their kid getting put into that collar. It's really, really scary to watch. And vice versa when a child sees mom or dad get put into it.

The arrowhead (which to me is a disapperance more that a torture trick) and even the gullotine are more over the top, and humorous looking, than the sword thru neck. The original question was about that effect, wasn't it?

BTW, Richard Landry does a nice Arrowhead routine. I wouldn't worry at all if my child was picked for his routine.

Troy Roark
johnpert
View Profile
Veteran user
Ontario, Canada
322 Posts

Profile of johnpert
Just to get you thinking... a friend of mine uses his sword through neck around another body part. Consider where else it can be used besides the neck. It may lessen the danger associated with this trick if used on another part of the body.

just a thought,

j.
Emazdad
View Profile
Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

Profile of Emazdad
Where ever you stick it, it's still through a body part and is still unsuitable for children. If you were boked to entertain Adults and depite telling the booker your show contains dangerous illusions you saw there were children in the audience, you can make an anouncement before the show that some of the tricks may be unsuitable for children and people with young children may wish to take them elsewhere. If the parents decide the child can stay that's their problem not yours, however if your invited to entertain at a childs birthday party then in my book the dangerous stuff stays at home. Kids shows should be fun, not shocking. Anyone who's been up half the night with a child that's having nightmares about something they'd seen ( it may be something as silly as the child catcher in Chitty Chitty Bang Bang) will understand where I'm coming from. They may go wow! awsome! at the time, but afterwards it sometimes plays on there minds.

As a parent I've been there, and I've got the 't' shirt.

PS, The child catcher scared the c&^p out of me when I was a kid, I also used to hide behind the settee from the Darleks. Now I watch the repeats on Sky gold I can't see why.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
Peter Marucci
View Profile
Inner circle
5389 Posts

Profile of Peter Marucci
Ken Scott writes: "Are you guys saying DO NOT do any danger tricks in front of kids?"

That's EXACTLY what a lot of us are saying.

Sure, there may be many, many instances of kids enjoying the sword thru neck, head chopper, etc.

But there is always the chance that one kid may take it seriously -- and possibly try to emulate the magician (using a younger sibling).

Is that kind of risk worth it? After all, it's just a magic trick!

Sure, there are those who have endless anecdotes of how they do "danger" tricks and the kids love it.

And they will continue to do "danger" tricks until the disastrous happens.

At that time, they will be among the first to wonder "what happened?"

You have been warned. But do whatever you want; you will anyway!
Dennis Michael
View Profile
Inner circle
Southern, NJ
6018 Posts

Profile of Dennis Michael
As with a lot of magic and postings, many are opinions. "Danger tricks" presented right have their place in kids shows. (IMO) I agree with David Ginn when he says to put some danger element in your show.

Certain cautions should be observed. For instance, I don't recommend using matches to light the dove pan, or in any way give the impression that playing with matches is magic, and fun. However, Flashpaper, fire books, smoke/flash pots is a differnt story. There is an exception to this rule. When doing a fire safety show, matches are uses to prove a point on the danger.

The above is stated to express an OPINION. I did the guillotine on the Scout master at a cub scout meeting. We approached it as a fund raiser and we all voted to see who was going to put their head in the guillotine. It raised $162 dollars and everyone was told it was safe, and it was a magic illusion before hand and it was presented in funny comedy manner. Everyone loved it.

Now I would not do this in a Day-Care Center, because I know I can get a better reaction with a puppet than with a million dollar illusion.

If I subscribe to the the premise "Kids will emulate what they see." I would never allow my kids to watch cartoons. They would go out and shot my rabbits like Elmer Fudd or Jump off my deck to kill the birds in my yard like the Road Runner. Or choke on a cookie by copying the Cookie Monster way of eating cookies. Heck, I shouldn't turn TV on at all, because of it's influence it would have on them, with the morning Jerry Springer type shows, talk show on sexual problems, afternoon sex soap operas, evening news on on killing and more killings, war and destruction, and even showing them blow their heads off with a gun... Then there are the reality shows, of eating bugs, stabbing each other in the back to win a game, and all this is on one channel. Should I flip to the cartoons and watch Power Puff girls beat up on animals, or Dragonball-Z destroy the other guy in a mighty battle. Maybe, they are better off of learning where a baby comes from on The Learning Channel, watching David Cooperfield saw himself in half with a buzz saw, or the foul language of the many X-Box/Playstation Games. Forget all this and get them involved in computers and so they see all the porn pop up on the screen.

Any body for playing War with cards?

As for Ken Scott doing a sword through neck routine, his personality can pull it off, but I could never see Sammuel Smith do it. It is not in his gentle personality. It would be out of Sammy Smith's Character, but not Ken Scotts Character.

If I listen to all I've heard and read on this topic I would get out of magic, because we teach/display deception, trickery, and lying is OK and even fun. (Boy, that should spark a nerve or two.)

Remember, This is in my opinion. One final point, (bragging rights) I raised and demonstrated to my children a strong moral obligations to family, society, and self. Numerous people have commented on how they wish their children were like ours. What did I do? Should I tell them I exposed them to sawing-in-half, head chopper, sword through neck, talked candidly about my Vietnam experinces, mention they played those video games they were nt supposed to even see and watched He-Man save the world from Evil-Lynn and Skelator. They were exposed to the cuel actions of Darth-Vador and the witchcraft of Harry Potter.

It's now time to get off my soap box. If a child is going to stab another, it is not from what he saw a magician do. In Psych 101, a child has heard everything and seen everything in one form or variation of it, before the age of five. He/She will spend the rest of his/her life expanding on those learning experiences.
Dennis Michael
Emazdad
View Profile
Inner circle
Plymouth UK
1954 Posts

Profile of Emazdad
The thing to look at when considering the advice given is the experience of the entertainers giving the advice, you will notice that most seasoned childrens entertainers do not do dangerous tricks in front of children, and if they do it's in a large stage show environment, where the publicity etc contains the proper warnings, not a childrens birthday party. Every show is an advert for your services and if you do something the parents disagree with it will have a negative affect on your bookings, they want there childs friends to have good clean safe fun and that's what your show should reflect. Remember if little jonny goes home and stabs his sister it's you they are going to sue.
Yours Funfully
Clive "Emazdad" Hemsley
www.emazdad.com

"Magic is a secret, without the secret there is no magic"

Remember there are only 3 types of people in the world, those that can count and those that can't.
Dennis Michael
View Profile
Inner circle
Southern, NJ
6018 Posts

Profile of Dennis Michael
The point is well taken. If the parents do not want a danger element in your Birthday Party routine, they will tell you this. It is your obligation to inform them of what they are getting when you book the show. This is why alternative Birthday Packages should be offered.

And Yes, you have to take into consideration the trend in times. Such as a gun in a school show setting. Right now I don't think that would be appropriate.

David Ginn still does over three hundred school shows a year and he hasn't changed his view point here. It is done in a humerous non-serious way and with appropriate warnings.

As far as being sued, don't drive a car here in the US, it is a way of life, being sued. One is more likely going to get sued for what is said on the Internet than from what one does in a magic show.

To Café Members: Has anybody been sued for the magic they have done? (Not copying and marketing anothers product.)
Dennis Michael
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The little darlings » » Idea for finale... (0 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2019 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.28 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL