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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Polly wants a cracker... » » One Handed Opening of Dove Bags (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Christopher Moro
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I used General Grants for a while. It's nice. A problem I had was that the one handed release is small -- it closes only a small portion of the bag (about 1/2 an inch) leaving the rest open. This is usually fine, but your dove can duck down and move his head back and potentially get his head out. Also, there is some white of the feathers visible at the top.

Andy Amyx's is terrific. It shuts much more of the bag than General Grant's, holds very securely, and is a quick surefire release. It's larger than General Grants, so in a way, there's a little more to hide, but that's negligible. I can't recommend it highly enough. (I have no stock in Andy Amyx Productions)
Dave Scribner
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Christopher, again I have to make the comment about the size of the bird and where the fastener is located on Gen's bag. The fastener should be at the base of the neck of the dove and it should close completely. If the bag is too loose, you are correct and it can duck it's head out from under the fastener. The fasteners may need to be relocated a bit to provide a tighter fit.

I also like the bags made by Peter White of P&A silks. He uses a combination of fasteners and attaches extra material much the same as Greg Frewin. They work great but I've found they are not easy to use for one handed production.

In the end, it's really just a matter of taste I guess. Everyone has their favorite and whichever works for you, that is the correct bag to use.
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Dynamike
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If anyone can display several dove harnesses side by side, please go head. I want to see what they all look like without purchasing them all.

Presently, I have Bob Sanders and Gen. Grants. I use to have Tony Clarks and Shimada's about 15 years ago. I misplaced them because I only did self-working dove magic back then.
sperris
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Go with andy's....they're a lifetime investiment and are very well made
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Christopher Moro
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Yep, I agree, Dave.

When it comes to bags, honestly, there are so many that are good that I think it would actually be quite a task to find and purchase a "bad" one. My first was homemade from looking at a drawing in the Chavez Encyclopedia. Head was sticking out, tail was sticking out, fabric was not shiny, not slick, two-handed release, and it worked fine.
Dave Scribner
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Smile that sounds familiar. My first one was home made as well and just didn't come out like the pictures. It worked but it certainly wasn't professional looking.
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sperris
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The first dove holder I bought was a red general grant dove holder. I didn't think I needed instructions so I threw them away...ALONG WITH THE DOVE POCKET because I thought it was included by accident. The holder didn't even have a loop so I was trying methods of holding it under my arm or in my sleeve and stealing it with my fingertips without a loop...wow what a hack! ...not much has changed.
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Dave Scribner
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Hey Dan, normally I agree with you but not this time. I've used Gen's Grant's harnesses for years and have never received one without a nylon loop attached. I don't think it takes instructions to figure out that the hook goes in the eye. My holders have two hooks. One near the edge and one farther down the side to adjust for the size of the bird. I wouldn't call him a hack regardless.
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DoveDaddy
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Dave,

I think you misunderstood who the "Hack" was that Dan was referring to. Not the General but rather Dan himself. This is Dan's typical sarcasim. I know personally that Dan respects the General's contributions to Dove magic. Dan was thirteen when he started to do Dove magic and he started out with General Grant pockets, holders and tail pockets. I know this because I bought many of them for him. that is when he got his first General Grant holder. The reason Dan was calling himself a "hack" is that when he started out he didn't understand anything about holders and pockets to properly use them and then he adds sarcastically "not much has changed". Anyone who has seen Dan perform in recent years knows that this is not the case.

I hope you realize now than Dan meant no disrespect towards the General.
Just wanted to clarify things.

DoveDaddy
Dave Scribner
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DoveDaddy, I've seen Dan perform and talked with him. I agree he's the ultimate performer and you are correct. I misinterpreted his comment on my first read about the hack. Probably because it followed the comment about the holder not having a loop attached and him having to retrieve the dove manually. No disrespect meant toward Dan at all.
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EdwardHilsum
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I have both Greg Frewin's and General Grant's DVDs, but do not own either of the holders or pockets they use. Can someone tell me if I am correct in saying that the style of bag they both use is the same, and it is just the 'clasp' that is different.

Also, are General Grant's pockets that go into the jacket similar to the way Greg's work to show no 'bumps' in the jacket, as he doesn't go into very much detail when showing them in the video. By this, I mean do they have the clever stitching on the back.

Thanks in advance,

All the best,

~Eddy
Dave Scribner
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Eddy, basically they are the same. The difference in the holders is that Greg attaches extra silk material to match the bag and Gen does not. Both are equally effective. I would say that Greg's has a potential of being a little better if you are using a small production silk. Otherwise, they are the same.

There is a difference in the pockets however. Greg's are individual pockets like most however Gen's are the full length of the front of the jacket. If you want more than one of Gen's pockets on one side, you need to purchase his double tier pocket.
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EdwardHilsum
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I see - so Gen's pockets are on a big patch of fabric, as shown on the video. Now I understand why the single and double tier pockets look the same size!
Dave Scribner
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Not exactly. The fabric is the pocket. They are not attached to the fabric. Think of two pieces of fabic sewn together with a gap at some point along the edge. The double tier pocket has a seam sewn across the center to create two pockets.
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EdwardHilsum
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Got it!!!
Powermagic
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Has anyone seen the Bazar de Magia One hand Dove Bag?
What do you think if so?
Kyle^Ravin
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I bought a couple of the bazar de magia ones a long time ago...A few years to be exact and I'm still using them! They're ok... not the best I've seen but since I already have working ones, I'm still using them. They operatate with Velcro and you may find that in time to come, the stiches around the velcro start to undo themselves. Another disadvantage is that most of the bags are cotton and not Satin or any other 'smooth' material. Unless you really wanna make use of somethin you already have, like I do, get the better ones out there...
magic4545
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Jimmy Fingers
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If the bag is designed correctly, there doesn't need to be a fastener holding the dove in. My dove bag has a wall in front of the dove that prevents the dove from getting out while it is in the dove pocket. If the bag and dove are hung in a bunch of silks, the dove still can't get out. Only when I hold the bag and dove in my hand can the dove get out... Ta-da! One handed dove release!

Let me know if you would like the pattern for this. Get the material to match the color production that you want, and take it to a seamstress or friend to sew together. You'll never be happier with a dove bag.

Both are used in this video...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CrGenzCK8hw



Invisible harness? I've got one that is so secure and invisible, even the dove forgets that it's there!!!
dove-boy
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Joe Yu (Stage Name)
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Hi Jimmy Smile

Glad to see you here Smile

I still kept the e-mail you send me in 7th April 2008 for the Most invisible dove harness ideas Smile

Your ideas in dove magic is brillant! Smile

Take care! Smile
dove-boy
Dynamike
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Quote:
On 2009-05-10 09:50, magic4545 wrote:
Invisible harness? I've got one that is so secure and invisible, even the dove forgets that it's there!!!

Do you glue lose feathers to the Invisible Harness?

Dealing with the video clipping, I see good skill, but be careful PETA is not in the audience.
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