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Jim-Callahan V.I.P. 5018 Posts |
Not when you can help others and give up your play time to do so!
J ack H.O.A-X
“I can make Satan’s devils dance like fine gentlemen across the stage of reality”.
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DrSpirit New user 27 Posts |
When I watched the video, my photo of Uri fell off the wall!
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Dannydoyle Eternal Order 21219 Posts |
Holy crap, MY BLUE PEN MOVED. My Sharpie flew out of my pocket. Alex is haunted!
Danny Doyle
<BR>Semper Occultus <BR>In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act....George Orwell |
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ALEXANDRE Inner circle 3024 Posts |
J ack, your assumption that I DON'T use my gift to help people is insulting.
Naturally I don't owe you or anyone here an explanation but I believe in fate so I will mention this because it happened just mere hours ago: As I left the supermarket with both arms busy around grocery bags, I helped an elderly lady as she struggled to reach for her dropped car keys, by mentally lifting the keys from the ground and into her hands. Unfortunately I did bend a key or two in the process, but she was grateful, letting me know that she suffered from terrible back pain. I deserve the million for that alone! And just minutes ago my girlfriend called me because she didn't remember the name of a fine restaurant we had dinner at last week, so I told her, having immediately read thoughts from her subconscious she had temporarily forgotten were stored there. I help, pal, and I could on and on....
HERE'S A SECRET ...
http://www.lybrary.com/mystic-alexandre-m-354.html |
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Dr. Wendy Woo New user 9 Posts |
J ack, you have not asked for my help as a psychologist, but I sense whipped-jealousy on a frustration-pie with an anger-cherry on top in your posts.
As British author Daphne Fielding once said: It doesn't matter what you do in the bedroom as long as you don't do it in the street and frighten the horses. Pm me. |
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drezmagic Regular user 161 Posts |
Shun the non-believers! Why would Alexandre resort to using trick pens! I've never heard of this so-called "Pk Pen" by Banachek. Alexandre is the real deal and Randi is currently quivering in his suspenders! And now they also have a "PK sharpie" - there is no end to these fakes trying to replicate true psychic phenomenon with gimmicked pens. It is an insult to all of us who are true psychics!
:) |
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RicHeka Inner circle 3999 Posts |
Yes I have to admit it is a Penomenon.
Rich |
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Tony Iacoviello Eternal Order 13151 Posts |
Did someone say "PIE"?
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
Let's face it folks, Randi isn't ever going to part with that money. Regardless of who shows up for the test. Even if God showed up, Randi would claim that "his" criteria weren't met. It is just a hype thing to sell his skeptic publications. Skeptics are just that, they are never convinced anything (except what they do) is real. I can't believe anyone still even tries for that stupid challenge.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Dr. Wendy Woo New user 9 Posts |
No way Randi could hold on to that money if God came along.
Alexandre is no God (maybe a "god" in a different sense), but I believe he can win the money. I've watched his "challenge" video nearly thirty times and I get goosebumps almost every time! It's eerie. I heard from a close source that Randi has watched the video and is at a loss for words. Forget the TV show, Alexandre IS a phenomenon! |
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
Has nothing to do with Alexandre's abilitilies or lack of them. It is all about Randi. He never intends to part with that cash, and will always find some sort of criteria to disqualify an applicant. The underlying concept of a "skeptic" is that true knowledge is always "uncertain". Thus, you can never "prove" anything to them. Randi's "challenge" is based on the individual in question demonstrating their ability under conditions set by Randi. It never states what those conditions are. Thus, Randi is free to create any conditions he desires. He could require the challenge taker to perform his feat from another planet or galaxy, which would be impossible. If the challenger can't meet Randi's conditions, there is no payment. Randi isn't going to throw away a million bucks and put himself out of the skeptic publishing business. He is going to create conditions under which it cannot be done. He can do anything from demand riduculous distances, ridiculous time frames, to just about anything else.
Unless I was watching Alexandre's performance live, I would not pass judgement on it. Video is a poor and unreliable source, giving limited angle and reducing a 3 dimensional image to 2 dimensions. I have one of my undergraduate degrees in physics, plus I've been a magician over 50 years. I can think of any number of ways to duplicate what I see on the video. Thus, I can't verify nor deny that one or more of those methods are or are not being employed. I'm sure Randi or anyone watching a video would presume the same thing. Randi is never going to pay that prize based on a video. The challenge requires that the domonstration be done live, under conditions set by Randi. Not on video under conditions set by the demonstrator.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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lumberjohn Special user Memphis, TN 626 Posts |
Photius,
You make some strong statements about Randi and the challenge with no evidence to back them up. You suggest that the million dollar challenge is simply a publicity stunt to further Randi's career and that even if valid claims are submitted, Randi will create impossible conditions to insure the applicant cannot win the million dollars. Essentially, you are accusing Randi and the JREF of fraud. You make a number of misstatements that indicate your ignorance of this subject. First, Randi is not involved in setting the criteria for the challenge. This is done by the non profit organization that administers the one million dollar fund, which was donated and does not belong to Randi. You cite examples of "impossible" conditions such as "requiring the challenge taker to perform his feat from another planet or galaxy." Do you have any examples of such ludicrous "impossible" conditions being imposed on ANY applicant for the million dollar prize? Have you even researched the history of those who have applied in the past? Did any of the conditions agreed to by the JREF in those circumstances seem "impossible" such as those you have conjured up? The "conditions" are simply ways of insuring that a testable claim is being made and that it is evaluated under objective scientifically measurable criteria. Please provide an example of a condition imposed by the JREF that does not fall into this category. You also say that a skeptic is one that believes true knowledge is uncertain. I do not know of any self professed skeptic that would agree with such a definition. Skeptics do generally believe that knowledge is certain and definite, but require that it such knowledge be supported by evidence. It is the requirement of evidence that distinguishes skeptics from non-skeptics. Without evidence, skeptics believe, there is no sound criteria for distinguishing true claims from false ones. The million dollar challenge is about this very thing: demanding evidence for extraordinary claims. I do agree with you on one point. The JREF is not going to hand over the one million dollars on the basis of someone's video. If Alexandre is serious about applying for the money, he can fill out an application and submit it like everyone else. If he meets the initial criteria, he will be contacted to discuss a mutually agreeable protocol for testing his claims. If Alexandre does choose to go this route, I'm sure we would all love to hear of his experiences, including whether he believes any of the JREF's "requirements" appear "unfair." In the meantime, please keep your comments to things of which you are familiar and avoid libelous statements with no factual basis. |
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
Well yes that is the official line. Though official lines and and what actually happens are often different things. But the organization set up to administer, etc. wasn't the point of my post. My point was the idea that you can't prove anything to a skeptic, since philosophically skepticism believes that true knowledge and certainty don't exist. As such nothing can be proven. I believe you are confusing the scientific principle with skepticism, which are two unrelated things. And while the critera set up by the committee, organization, etc. are "are simply ways of insuring that a testable claim is being made and that it is evaluated under objective scientifically measurable criteria." Such is arbitrary to the the person setting up the experiment. To follow the scientific method something must be observeable, quantifiable, and repeatable. So called "psychic" phenomenon to date cannot be observed (alleged results can be observed but the actual force, or phenomenon cannot be observed), we do not at present have a means of quantifying them, perhaps in some cases you might get repeatability. But as such they really cannot be submitted to the scientific method. But then much in "Science" does not meet the criteria of science.
I don't say JERFs requirements are unfair, in fact it is quite possible that under any given experiment they may not have enough controls. That isn't the point. The point is that it is possible for them to set any criteria they desire, including practically impossible ones. Some alleged psychokentic practitioners seem to need to have some sort of physical manifestation of their "psychic" energy. The wave their hands, point their hands and arms, make fists, grimace, etc. Now IMHO, if such existed they should be able to do it without any physical manifestations on their part, after all it is supposed to be purely mental in nature. No one really sees us "think" Though people think all the time, only occassionally do you see someone doing a physical manifestation when they think,like stroking the chin, scratching their head, closing their eyes to concentrate, etc. Now what relationship such may or may not have to an individuals ability to concentrate or focus has never been demonstrated, and such manifestations tend to vary with culture. Scientifically there is no way to subject the relationship or lack of to scientific evaluation with our present means of technology. It involves that which is not observable and which isn't quantifiable. But the fact that something cannot be observed, quantified, or repeated is still no evidence that it does or does not exist. Just that it cannot be subjected to the rules of scientific methodology with our present ability to observe and quantify. And I've read quite a few posts on the Café in which people claim to have tried to take "Randi's million dollar challenge". And as you state they generally have a video, or some other demo they show to us or others, but they don't seem to want to fill out the form and submit to an evaluation according to JERF's critera, which is what it takes to have a chance at winning the challenge. Is it purely publicity on Randi or JERFs part? Well since that isn't observeable, quantifiable, I suppose I can't submit it to scientific method to determine scientifically. And since skepticism philosophically does not accept the reality of certaintity or true knowledge, I can't meet any form of criteria to qualify that statement to a skeptic. It is their internalized justification that what they do is scientific, real, etc. It is my internalized justification that its main purpose is to give publicity to their organization, agenda, etc. (And my internalized justification cannot be any better observed and quantified than theirs can. Both are , at best the opionion of the opinion holder.) Even if I could make a ten ton object levitate and fly around the room, world or anyplace else, if I claim to to it with psychic power, which cannot be observed, and cannot be measured with current technology, then I cannot prove to myself or anyone else that I am the causative party or that I am not the causative party. Thus, it is highly doubtful that anyone will ever be able to claim the prize, unless we come up with some accepted technology that allows us to observe things we cannot present observe and measure things we cannot presently measure. It is a waste of time to even attempt the challenge. In fact, IMHO, the only use for the challenge that seems to have occurred is a bunch of people who use it to claim that they have these powers and abilities, but Randi and or JERF are afraid of them, or for Randi and JERF use to publicize their positions, organizations, and things sold by them. IMHO if you can move a pen or pencil, you should be able to just move it, you shouldn't have to set in in a particular position on the stem of a glass and make physical manifestations. But then what do I know? I don't do it, at least not by psychokentic means. I only move them by natural means, using laws of physics and techniques of magic. So I can only answer for how those methods are done. Since I cannot observe or quantify what Alexandre claims to do, nor have I been able to observe it in real time and space to eliminate the methods I know of, I cannot say he is or isn't using one of them. I, in fact, can't say what he is doing or not doing that may or may not be causative to the pen's fallng in the video. And to bring this long diatribe to a close, IMHO, I do not believe there is anything that Alexandre can do to convince JERF or Randi that the pen falling off the glass is being done by any supernatural ability or force. My point remains that it remains a waste of time to continue to pursue such claims against the "challenge" under current methodology to observe and quantify.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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mesmer Inner circle 1186 Posts |
I miss your Boxer Short and the Jazz music..No actualy the Short :-(
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ALEXANDRE Inner circle 3024 Posts |
Easier days, mesmer ... easier days....
As far as "filling out an application" and "submitting like everyone else", these are suggestions I find offensive. Randi has internet access, I've sent him a video of my abilities and I don't have time to play games with his organization. I'm sure Randi has experts sleeping around his home who can verify the authenticity of my video and what was accomplished in it, therefore I find it insulting that I should be like "everyone else" when it's been made evidently clear that I'm NOT! Still nothing from Randi.
HERE'S A SECRET ...
http://www.lybrary.com/mystic-alexandre-m-354.html |
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lumberjohn Special user Memphis, TN 626 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-10-06 02:36, photius wrote: Photius, You weren't saying that it is merely possible for the JREF to create impossible conditions. You were saying that they actually do it when the million dollars is threatened. I have yet to see any support for that claim. You've also made some new points I would like to address. Your problems with the challenge appear to stem from several things. In fact, while you say you aren't saying the challenge is unfair, you go on to describe why you think it is unfair and "a waste of time." First, you do not believe it is valid because while effects can be measured, the underlying causative mechanisms may not be subject to such measurement. It is interesting that you mention the scientific method, because that very method is used to make these determinations all the time. We can control for known causative variables and statistically determine whether an unknown variable is at play. If an applicant can demonstrate that such a variable is at play, they will win the million dollars. They need not show its exact mechanism. In short, they must only demonstrate a statistically significant result that cannot be explained by any known cause. Your argument that actual psychic forces must be observed before the challenge can be won is simply a strawman. Our current methodology is quite sufficient to detect paranormal forces by simply controlling for known forces. Another strawman you present is the suggestion that the challenge rules will not allow applicants "wave their hands, point their hands and arms, make fists, grimace, etc." Where do you get this information? The rules set no such restrictions. As long as it is clear the applicant is not using any sort of gimmicks such as magnets or thread, I can't imagine any such restrictions being imposed. You say you "do not believe there is anything that Alexandre can do to convince JERF or Randi that the pen falling off the glass is being done by any supernatural ability or force." I disagree. IF Alexandre were in fact serious (he is not), he could agree to protocols that control for known forces and cause the pen to fall in such a way that would be statistically improbable to a material degree by any known causative force. That would do it. Show me a situation where this occurred and the million dollars was withheld. Finally, I want to address what you call the real "point of your post," "the idea that you can't prove anything to a skeptic, since philosophically skepticism believes that true knowledge and certainty don't exist. As such nothing can be proven." Modern skepticism (as opposed to classical philosophical skepticism, which we could discuss further, but it is not relevant to this discussion) does not promote any such belief. You go on to state that I am confusing skepticism with the scientific method, which, you claims, are "two unrelated things." In fact, they are not unrelated at all. Modern skepticism is intimately related with the scientific method. In fact, I've heard it described by critics as the philosophy that exalts the scientific method above all else. While I wouldn't agree with this statement as written, it is not far off. Specifically, when you discuss the JREF, this is exactly the kind of "skepticism" it employs. In that context, you can use the term "skeptic" synonymously with anyone requiring evidence and application of the scientific method to truth claims. Do a quick search on "skeptic" organizations, or listen to "skeptic" podcasts and you will find this to be true. You may want to update your definition to the twenty-first century. So basically, what the JREF does is to apply the scientific method to paranormal claims. If the claims survive the controlled testing, the applicant walks away with the million dollars. If you have evidence that the JREF is doing something other than this, I'd sure love to see it. |
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JimFaulkner New user 9 Posts |
I don't know who Randi is, he looks like father Christmas.
But Alexandre - wow, how did you do that! Is it really real? Jim |
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ALEXANDRE Inner circle 3024 Posts |
Quote:
On 2007-10-06 10:52, lumberjohn wrote: I beg your pardon? You just might be banned for that statement. Flaming!
HERE'S A SECRET ...
http://www.lybrary.com/mystic-alexandre-m-354.html |
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Magnus Eisengrim Inner circle Sulla placed heads on 1053 Posts |
Yawn.
I can't read Randi's mind, but I suspect that he's not very interested in every performer who wishes to use the challenge as a publicity stunt. Frankly, I'm amazed at how easy it is for any mental entertainer to post Randi's name and bolster his image in front of an audience happy to buy the next great routine. John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned; The best lack all conviction, while the worst Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats |
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ALEXANDRE Inner circle 3024 Posts |
John, apparently you are not interested in the "next great routine", but even if you were, the "next great routine" happened over a year ago with "Ex Nihilo" and unfortunately its no longer available.
I DO have another eBook coming out soon called CINCO. Keep checking my site! I've met Randi, I like Randi, I sat in his library with my daughter; my daughter has an autographed picture of Randi (I kept it, though) and that was the first time I "challenged" him when my daughter was able to call out a color Randi merely thought of. He ignored the "challenge" and spoke quite excitedly about all kinds of performers who "faked" the act in the past. We left after a couple of autographed books, but I'm back now, and this time I'm not going anywhere. I don't need to use Randi's name to get publicity. I can use yours.... (I just got an idea)
HERE'S A SECRET ...
http://www.lybrary.com/mystic-alexandre-m-354.html |
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