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krisnevling
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I think the trick is pretty sub-par and really adds nothing new to a basic plot. The double lifts were very obvious and the method the same. The method is so simple in fact that I would have a hard time believing this hasn't been done a million times already. I'm not taking sides here I'm just trying to be honest. I think that's what makes people better magicians. Honesty. And that's what all these forums are for right? To make all of us better magicians.
I am 27 years old and have been performing magic for 12 years. My main interest is in card magic, but I love all aspects of it. I love to discuss magic with anyone. Feel free to email me anytime.
Steve Haynes
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Quote:
On 2007-10-28 19:17, krisnevling wrote:
I think the trick is pretty sub-par and really adds nothing new to a basic plot. The double lifts were very obvious and the method the same. The method is so simple in fact that I would have a hard time believing this hasn't been done a million times already. I'm not taking sides here I'm just trying to be honest. I think that's what makes people better magicians. Honesty. And that's what all these forums are for right? To make all of us better magicians.


Well said.

Perfection Guaranteed
The 21stCentury Transposition.

The 21stCentury Transposition?

instruction booklet (with 20 colour illustrations), factory printed Bicycle gimmick,

factory printed Bicycle gimmick?


I understand using gaffs or gimmicks to make an effect stronger, or more impossible but I don't see the point in this!, as you could do what your doing with regular cards, and be gaining, not losing.

Also, a stapler is not needed, and if you feel it lends impossibility to the effect, (or a better memory of what happened) I think using a small coin envelope with your info printed on it as a hand out with the folded card inside would solve the problem, and keep that bulky stapler at home.(unless you have a better use for it)

This simple transposition gains nothing from all the extra baggage.
matthew leatherbarrow
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Hmmm...

The staple is a permanent reminder of the impossibility of what has happened. A small pocket stapler takes up virtually no room and adds so much. To me, an envelope is just a container that once the card is removed from, is no longer a permanent reminder.

The gimmick allows for a much clearer method and thus effect. Ringing in the gimmick also has an in-built logic within the plot.

I was going to write a long winded defence but...

Since the method is so obvious, it was never supposed to fool magicians. It was supposed to economical and impossible. I say try it!

Obtain the gimmick, perform the routine and see the result. And if you don't get people going a bit crazy when they peel open the stapled card, well, I'll eat my hat. If you do, perhaps you should consider ordering the effect.

I wouldn't consider releasing an effect unless I'd performed it and received reactions that justify it. So I suggest detractors do just that. The giggles, gasps, laughter and stunned silences I have received while performing this effect are enough to contradict above posts.

Such reactions’ to a demo, or a product someone does not own, seems a bit like a lack of imagination. Hence my offer. Try it.
Magic Spank
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Matthew,

I agree with you about the staple, it adds tremedously to the effect.

Reading this, I almost thought the criticisms must be a joke. These supposed magicians really need to read more. The idea that there are only 5 or 7 basic effects in magic certainly is not new to me. To question that statement shows extreme ignorance.

The idea that Steve Beam invented the basic transposition you begin with is preposterous. Again, you are being pummeled with ignorance.

I'm not sure what you did to provoke such an attack but I commend you on your self control. I wouldn't be so kind.

Nice site, I appreciate the link. Keep up the good work!
krisnevling
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clearfield, pa
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Matthew, I really want you to understand that I was not bashing your performance, and I understand that 90% of the magic market is geared towards newer magicians so the trick may seem like a good purchase. To anyone who has been into card magic longer than a couple of years would know the method to this immediately. I don't believe this is strong enough to sell by itself, but maybe should be included as a bonus effect with something stronger. Just my opinion.
I am 27 years old and have been performing magic for 12 years. My main interest is in card magic, but I love all aspects of it. I love to discuss magic with anyone. Feel free to email me anytime.
matthew leatherbarrow
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I do take your comments seriously. But as I've said earlier, knowing the method is not really the point. I think the plot and embellishments make this a strong effect... when you order the effect you also get a detailed script and other bits of information. Regarding its strength, all I can say is 'try it'. Really it is very strong.

Having been learning magic for over a decade, there isn’t that much that fools me, in fact, anyone who's read a couple of books can probably work out most marketed material. That's why certain producers make awful demos that show a fifth of an effect...the rest of the footage being filler. For a while I resisted cutting my demo's at all. I only changed because cuts make the demo more dynamic.
Steve Haynes
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Quote:
On 2007-10-29 08:39, krisnevling wrote:
Matthew, I really want you to understand that I was not bashing your performance, and I understand that 90% of the magic market is geared towards newer magicians so the trick may seem like a good purchase. To anyone who has been into card magic longer than a couple of years would know the method to this immediately. I don't believe this is strong enough to sell by itself, but maybe should be included as a bonus effect with something stronger. Just my opinion.


Well said

Im not trying to bash this at all, and I'm sure you get great reactions from the effect.

I was just expressing my opinion.

I understand using a gaff to make the switch easier, but anyone who can do multiple lifts can do just as convincing switch with regular cards.

Offering a gaff card helps build value in a product, but a gaff should make something cleaner, or do something you just can't do with regular cards.

This is a classic effect, and I'm sure you get great reactions from laymen.

I do stapled (out of a Paul Harris book) which is very direct and leaves them with a stapled card and uses regular cards.

Anyway, I'm not saying this is a bad trick(classic), and anyone that watches the demo and likes what they see and feels it would be worth it if it is a workable trick (new to magic), then I say knock yourself out, as you could do a lot worse!

All the best,

Steve
Hart Keene
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I'm sorry but I do not care for this transpo at all. And you need a gimmick? There are a ton of better routines and methods out there that are much more direct, to the point, and magical. Even with a dupe you can have something that plays much better than this.

With "new" effects like this being released I always ask, what is the improvement? I have never been a big fan of sandwich type transpos but what is the significant improvement here?
-Hart

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Magician Portland Oregon
Hart Keene
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Quote:


You know nothing about me or my work. You have entered a topic on a tangent and been rude and disrespectful. Not to mention making damaging remarks about myself and my brand.



Dude, we have seen your work...and we are not sure why you are selling it. Its guys like you selling sub par rehash material that is over saturating the market today. I wouldn't pay to own either of your effects, and certainly wouldn't perform them for my paying customers. Oh and your "brand", I won't even go there...
-Hart

Check out my website:
Magician Portland Oregon
matthew leatherbarrow
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Dude... that quote has to be taken in context. It was aimed at another manufacturer who hijacked this thread to make needless and damaging comments.

Quote:
we are not sure why you are selling it


This is why forums are dangerous. In case you haven’t noticed, there are a number of people who like my work, and a number who don't. To assimilate is foolish.

I have no problem with constructive criticism, and of course I welcome praise. But fuelling the fire of an irate manufacture who seems to needlessly attack someone much smaller is pretty pathetic.

Quote:
Its guys like you selling sub par rehash material that is over saturating the market today.


Yes, of course it is. Do you have ANY idea how silly that is? Really, I mean ANY?


I have a limited set of stockist and have released two products in over a year.

But yes, of course it is all my fault. Not the trick-a-month large scale peddlers, not the ‘names’ re-releasing their back catalogue, not the copy-cat mass manufactures… but me. Get real.

Unless you have PERFORMED my effects you can’t with any accuracy appreciate their strengths, versatility or usability. All you can do is comment on a demo.
Hart Keene
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Quote:
On 2007-10-29 14:14, matthew leatherbarrow wrote:
Dude... that quote has to be taken in context. It was aimed at another manufacturer who hijacked this thread to make needless and damaging comments.

Quote:
we are not sure why you are selling it


This is why forums are dangerous. In case you haven’t noticed, there are a number of people who like my work, and a number who don't. To assimilate is foolish.

I have no problem with constructive criticism, and of course I welcome praise. But fuelling the fire of an irate manufacture who seems to needlessly attack someone much smaller is pretty pathetic.

Quote:
Its guys like you selling sub par rehash material that is over saturating the market today.


Yes, of course it is. Do you have ANY idea how silly that is? Really, I mean ANY?


I have a limited set of stockist and have released two products in over a year.

But yes, of course it is all my fault. Not the trick-a-month large scale peddlers, not the ‘names’ re-releasing their back catalogue, not the copy-cat mass manufactures… but me. Get real.

Unless you have PERFORMED my effects you can’t with any accuracy appreciate their strengths, versatility or usability. All you can do is comment on a demo.


We are not talking about them...this thread is about your brand and your effects. I guess I should have said that you are just another guy adding to the over saturated marketplace.

I might come off as rude but really I'm just frustrated with the stuff people are releasing today. Seriously, what does your effect ADD? Please don't say the stapler...

I have quite a few of my own versions and ideas on classic effects. Some even offer, I'm my oppinion, more of an improvement than yours. You don't see me rushing to release this stuff just to say I have a dvd or download or whatever. I believe that just because you make a few changes and additions to standard effects it doesn't give you the right to "release" it, let alone sell it and make a buck. It should just be left as "personal touches" on standard effects, unless it is truly a groundbreaking addition that actually moves things forward. In this case it doesn't. As I said before, I wouldn't perform either of your effects. Please know that I am a working professional and I know good material from bad so don't tell me to "try" an effect. I trust my own judgement.

Furthermore, seeing that you were unfamiliar(or so it seemed) with other routines and ideas that predated yours is it safe to say that the crediting is not up to par?
-Hart

Check out my website:
Magician Portland Oregon
Dave Forrest
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I didn't hijack anything. This is an open forum.

Matt, get your head out of the clouds son - you're still missing the point. It's not about another manufacturer coming along. If I was at all worried about the competition from 'In-Magic' I'd have to seriously re-examine my own business as it stands. To clarify - you are not a threat to me and this is not why you are receiving such harsh criticism. I don't know what's bigger - your self delusion, your ego or your utterly abhorent attitude.

What you don't seem to realise is that there are a ton of real world performers on these forums. They are much older and wiser than you and, despite what you think, can take one look at your demo and KNOW for a FACT how well it's going to play or whether it's new or worthwhile. It's called EXPERIENCE and it's what you are severely lacking at the grand old age of what? 19 - 20?

See, people don't like it when some young punk wanders in and starts telling them what's what. You are underqualified to make the statements you've been making - not just in this thread, in others too. Your absolute desperation to prove you have an in-depth knowledge of magic has led you to make a complete arse of yourself. Interested parties please see here for some of Matt's staggeringly amateurish insight:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......forum=27

And just so you know, I couldn't give a flying f**k what you think of my work. Please don't condescend to critique it as though somehow your opinion actually means anything to me.

I'm done with you - have the last word if you must. Soon enough you'll disappear, all caught up in some other fad hobby you've come across.

Dave.
Hart Keene
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Quote:
On 2007-10-29 15:04, Dave Forrest wrote:
I didn't hijack anything. This is an open forum.

Matt, get your head out of the clouds son - you're still missing the point. It's not about another manufacturer coming along. If I was at all worried about the competition from 'In-Magic' I'd have to seriously re-examine my own business as it stands. To clarify - you are not a threat to me and this is not why you are receiving such harsh criticism. I don't know what's bigger - your self delusion, your ego or your utterly abhorent attitude.

What you don't seem to realise is that there are a ton of real world performers on these forums. They are much older and wiser than you and, despite what you think, can take one look at your demo and KNOW for a FACT how well it's going to play or whether it's new or worthwhile. It's called EXPERIENCE and it's what you are severely lacking at the grand old age of what? 19 - 20?

See, people don't like it when some young punk wanders in and starts telling them what's what. You are underqualified to make the statements you've been making - not just in this thread, in others too. Your absolute desperation to prove you have an in-depth knowledge of magic has led you to make a complete arse of yourself. Interested parties please see here for some of Matt's staggeringly amateurish insight:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......forum=27

And just so you know, I couldn't give a flying f**k what you think of my work. Please don't condescend to critique it as though somehow your opinion actually means anything to me.

I'm done with you - have the last word if you must. Soon enough you'll disappear, all caught up in some other fad hobby you've come across.

Dave.


Well said David...

One more thing, what the hell is a fashionable magic product? Is a stapler and a cheap plastic wallet fashionable? Just the name alone is ridiculous. You are trying to put out this "cool" image to sell rehash weak ass magic, I'm just doing my best to help impressionable young magicians spend their money elsewhere, on material that has value.
-Hart

Check out my website:
Magician Portland Oregon
matthew leatherbarrow
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I am not going to start trying to ‘sell’ my effect. I have already documented what I think my effect adds to the premise.

There are some who appreciate my work, and some who don’t

Thankfully, among those who do, are some established performers, reviewers and manufactures.

Quote:
Please know that I am a working professional and I know good material from bad so don't tell me to "try" an effect. I trust my own judgement.


This is a problem. It is kind of a granted that unless otherwise stated, forum posts are opinions. Unfortunately things are more complex than that. Opinion and fact become confused.

I believe my take on the effect warrants a release. And to all those who suggest it should be sold as a part, not as an individual, well all my effects come with a code that grants access to five other effects. So for £9.99 you are getting effectively six effects plus the gimmick.

The way certain people are reacting, it’s as if I’m some sort of soulless multinational company with dominion over the magic community.

If you want to raise a serious debate about the rights and wrong on releasing magic – here is not the place. There are much better topics for this.

If you want to throw a tantrum and try to damage my decidedly delicate project – do so, but you will look silly.

Oh Dave, Dave, Dave… I believe you instigated the bitterness. Others have since contradicted you and rather that accept it, you launch into a hissy-fit.

Quote:
Interested parties please see here for some of Matt's staggeringly amateurish insight


You are behaving like a child. What have YOU done Dave? That thread is based on intensive reading done for Uni. You know education, which outside of you angry little bubble seems nonexistent.The topic has raised some very interesting debate.

Quote:
I couldn't give a flying f**k what you think of my work. Please don't condescend to critique it as though somehow your opinion actually means anything to me.


Well said Dave. If you’d stick to this sentiment, we could have saved a great deal of time and typing.

Steve Fearson who has worked with Copperfield likes my work.

Dave Forrest who has worked with… well that’s not important. Doesn’t like my work.
Hart Keene
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Quote:
On 2007-10-29 15:36, matthew leatherbarrow wrote:
I am not going to start trying to ‘sell’ my effect. I have already documented what I think my effect adds to the premise.

There are some who appreciate my work, and some who don’t

Thankfully, among those who do, are some established performers, reviewers and manufactures.

Quote:
Please know that I am a working professional and I know good material from bad so don't tell me to "try" an effect. I trust my own judgement.


This is a problem. It is kind of a granted that unless otherwise stated, forum posts are opinions. Unfortunately things are more complex than that. Opinion and fact become confused.

I believe my take on the effect warrants a release. And to all those who suggest it should be sold as a part, not as an individual, well all my effects come with a code that grants access to five other effects. So for £9.99 you are getting effectively six effects plus the gimmick.

The way certain people are reacting, it’s as if I’m some sort of soulless multinational company with dominion over the magic community.

If you want to raise a serious debate about the rights and wrong on releasing magic – here is not the place. There are much better topics for this.

If you want to throw a tantrum and try to damage my decidedly delicate project – do so, but you will look silly.

Oh Dave, Dave, Dave… I believe you instigated the bitterness. Others have since contradicted you and rather that accept it, you launch into a hissy-fit.

Quote:
Interested parties please see here for some of Matt's staggeringly amateurish insight


You are behaving like a child. What have YOU done Dave? That thread is based on intensive reading done for Uni. You know education, which outside of you angry little bubble seems nonexistent.The topic has raised some very interesting debate.

Quote:
I couldn't give a flying f**k what you think of my work. Please don't condescend to critique it as though somehow your opinion actually means anything to me.


Well said Dave. If you’d stick to this sentiment, we could have saved a great deal of time and typing.

Steve Fearson who has worked with Copperfield likes my work.

Dave Forrest who has worked with… well that’s not important. Doesn’t like my work.


Um, just so you know...I happen to like Fearson but many many magicians don't. A lot of them believe he is a rip off artist. I just think he is a marketing genius. BTW, you need to quit talking about who likes your magic. Nobody cares. Your magic needs to speak for itself. Anyone can make up a quote and paste it on a website. Quit using two big names to sell "your" rehash material.

Also, you avoided my question about crediting...If I were to buy "your" effect would I see the proper credits? Again, what makes this effect yours?
-Hart

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Magician Portland Oregon
matthew leatherbarrow
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Quote:
you need to quit talking about who likes your magic. Nobody cares.


You're doing it again. So you have scanned the entire of magicdom and asked if people care? I'm being ridiculous of course, but so are you. Since those who have nothing to do with my work feel free to attack it, it's only fair that I remind people that others who are arguably in a better position to comment, do like my work.

Quote:
Also, you avoided my question about crediting...If I were to buy "your" effect would I see the proper credits? Again, what makes this effect yours?


Why don't you buy it and find out. See this is the problem with commenting on things you don't own.

Who owns the transposition?
Who owns the particular gimmick?
Who owns the double lift?

The patter, the plot, and the stapled aspects are not in any books I've seen, the agent of the transposition being a guarantee is the important aspect. Paul Harris's effect is totally different and so are various other effect's I've come across that use guarantees and staples. If you were to really examine the genealogy of a trick like Perfection Guaranteed, you’d probably need a whole separate booklet citing everyone who’s invented a transposition or used a guarantee joker or a staple.

If I was working with a very particular technique, or borrowing a plot then citation would be important. Citing for a transposition is, as another has pointed out, ludicrous.
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