The Magic Café
Username:
Password:
[ Lost Password ]
  [ Forgot Username ]
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » Walter Scott 1911 arrest story (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
DStachowiak
View Profile
Inner circle
Baltimore, MD
2158 Posts

Profile of DStachowiak
Here is the NY Times version of the story of the 1911 arrest of Wyatt Earp and Walter Scott for an alleged con game involving a rigged Faro Bank.
nytimes

There has been speculation in the past about the possibilty that this might have been the same Walter Scott known as the "Phantom of the Card Table".
There is also an LA times article available on line, but it is in the LA times news archive and costs money to view. It is at

LAtimes

I don't know if it was ever established whether or not this might have been him, but it makes for some fun speculation.
Woke up.
Fell out of bed.
Dragged a comb across m' head.
C. Loubard
View Profile
Special user
616 Posts

Profile of C. Loubard
IIRC, he was busted in Los Angeles and the cards were said to have tiny bumps on them. Again I can't recall correctly, but I know someone who has an original clipping of that article from the paper.
Unknown419
View Profile
Inner circle
1332 Posts

Profile of Unknown419
Wow my teacher got busted with Wyatt Earp who was best friends with Docholiday.

Now what more can I ask for.


Respectfully,

Docholiday
JasonEngland
View Profile
V.I.P.
Las Vegas, NV
1679 Posts

Profile of JasonEngland
I'd bet some serious coin it wasn't him. The Phantom would have just turned 16 years old in July of 1911. Difficult to believe he was on the other side of the country (he was from Rhode Island) and banging around with a 63 year old Wyatt.

Although The Phantom is said to have traveled extensively throughout the US, a careful reading of the appropriate sections from Phantoms of the Card Table tends to convince me that this didn't happen until Scott was into his 20s and perhaps 30s.

As The Phantom himself told Gazzo when they first met, "There's lots of Walter Scotts."

Jason
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
Silly Walter the Polar Bear
View Profile
Special user
506 Posts

Profile of Silly Walter the Polar Bear
Quote:
On 2007-10-22 03:52, JasonEngland wrote:As The Phantom himself told Gazzo when they first met, "There's lots of Walter Scotts."

Jason


I was actually going to say there were probably several people named Walter Scott back then. I did read that David roth also rejoined Van Halen which surprised me because why would you give up coin magic to play with those has beens?
card cheat
View Profile
Elite user
426 Posts

Profile of card cheat
You are one silly polar bear....

CC
DStachowiak
View Profile
Inner circle
Baltimore, MD
2158 Posts

Profile of DStachowiak
I agree it's a stretch, but then again, people left home pretty young back then. My father was in the Navy at 16 in 1926, and a great uncle served in WWI at 16. Walter Scott is, of course, a common enough name, and it would be quite a coincidence. I just thought it was fun to see the article.
Woke up.
Fell out of bed.
Dragged a comb across m' head.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15861 Posts

Profile of tommy
Still some coincidence that we have a sharp name Walter Scott arrested with pips found on the cards. I would not dismiss it as being The Walter Scott down to this one only being sixteen. I did and many kids do deal at that age in private games to all ages even today and I mean in proper cash games. I said long ago the best I ever seen was a kid of about 14 years old. Street kids are can be very skilled at an early age I have no doubt about that they are kids are pretty fearless. For example some best pick pockets in London today are kids of 10 years old and less. All I am saying is never underestimate the kids. I don’t think it was him but the story does make me wonder. I have heard it mentioned before by Gazzo but thanks for story in any event.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
iamslow
View Profile
Inner circle
Proffessional Slacker
1902 Posts

Profile of iamslow
Quote:
On 2007-10-22 02:54, Unknown419 wrote:
Wow my teacher got busted with Wyatt Earp who was best friends with Docholiday.

Now what more can I ask for.


Respectfully,

Docholiday

that's why you're the doc!!


pal
j
"Everyone is tough till they get punched in the face" Mike Tyson
JasonEngland
View Profile
V.I.P.
Las Vegas, NV
1679 Posts

Profile of JasonEngland
Tommy,

I think it's a wonderful coincidence, but I don't dismiss it just because of Scott's age. I also factored in the difficulty of traveling all the way to California in a day and age where that sort of travel might've taken weeks if not months.

I also considered the fact that Scott doesn't appear to have mentioned this to Gazzo at any point. At least, it didn't make it into the book that Gazzo wrote. Wyatt was a minor celebrity even in 1911, so the likelihood that it would have been forgotten by Scott is slim.

J
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15861 Posts

Profile of tommy
Yes I know, I did read your post and I agree.

The other thing is, faro, has I understand it, was dealt from a box, so I don't think they are talking about dealing the punch or are they?


By the the way Earps pal Bat Masterson was arrested in 1902 I think for cheating someone in a faro game. Cheating at cards is a small world and I think most these card cheats would have some links to each other.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
DStachowiak
View Profile
Inner circle
Baltimore, MD
2158 Posts

Profile of DStachowiak
I agree this is a long shot, but it's fun to speculate. This is sort of similar to the mysterious stories of a shadowy grifter named E S Andrews who had a string of documented arrests for investment fraud throughout the midwest, and who many think may have been S W Erdnase. We'll never know for sure, but it makes for a good story.
Woke up.
Fell out of bed.
Dragged a comb across m' head.
Unknown419
View Profile
Inner circle
1332 Posts

Profile of Unknown419
Quote:
On 2007-10-23 04:38, tommy wrote:
Yes I know, I did read your post and I agree.

The other thing is, faro, has I understand it, was dealt from a box, so I don't think they are talking about dealing the punch or are they?


They still definitely play the punch from a dealing box right along with rough and smooth. Magician8 is superb and he's only 13 years old.

Repectfully,

Doc
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15861 Posts

Profile of tommy
Re Faro “The dealer shuffled a single deck and placed it “face up” in a special shoe.” see pic etc here:

http://www.bcvc.net/faro/gambling.htm

So I just don’t get what good pips are in faro if the top card is face up and can be seen since all a pip does is tell us what the top card is.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
JasonEngland
View Profile
V.I.P.
Las Vegas, NV
1679 Posts

Profile of JasonEngland
Tommy,

I probably wasn't a matter of whether one could read the card, but whether one could read the card faster with an index. Even today after ~ 20 years with a deck of cards, it's still quicker for me to see a 10 in the upper corner than to count the center pips. Although all are distinctly different, I still look twice at the 7s, 8s, 9s and 10s just to make sure I'm not making a mistake.

Sure with training I could get to the point where all I did was recognize (as opposed to count) the center arrangement, but a casual gambler in the 1800s or early 1900s would not necessarily have put in the time to do that.

J
Eternal damnation awaits anyone who questions God's unconditional love. --Bill Hicks
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15861 Posts

Profile of tommy
Sorry Jason I said "pips" but what I meant was, blisters, the "tiny bumps" that CL reffered to above.

What good is puting secret "tiny bumps" into the cards for faro when the cards are "face up" in a faro box where the top card can be seen?

Tiny bumps in faro indicate to me that they were using "Tie Ups" tiny holes allow one to tie up slugs of cards and suckers can shuffle but the slug is still kept together. Its a very old form of cheating in faro.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
ASW
View Profile
Inner circle
1869 Posts

Profile of ASW
Quote:
On 2007-10-23 15:28, Unknown419 wrote:
Quote:
On 2007-10-23 04:38, tommy wrote:
Yes I know, I did read your post and I agree.

The other thing is, faro, has I understand it, was dealt from a box, so I don't think they are talking about dealing the punch or are they?


They still definitely play the punch from a dealing box right along with rough and smooth. Magician8 is superb and he's only 13 years old.

Repectfully,

Doc


LOL
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

Hideo Kato
DStachowiak
View Profile
Inner circle
Baltimore, MD
2158 Posts

Profile of DStachowiak
Quote:
On 2007-10-24 07:05, tommy wrote:
Sorry Jason I said "pips" but what I meant was, blisters, the "tiny bumps" that CL reffered to above.

What good is puting secret "tiny bumps" into the cards for faro when the cards are "face up" in a faro box where the top card can be seen?

Tiny bumps in faro indicate to me that they were using "Tie Ups" tiny holes allow one to tie up slugs of cards and suckers can shuffle but the slug is still kept together. Its a very old form of cheating in faro.

Tommy, can you elaborate on the "Tie-ups" technique? It sounds interesting. I'm imagining slugs of cards with punch style bumps perfectly aligned, so that the cards interlock like Lego blocks and stay together. Is that anything like it? I'm thinking about possible uses in card magic.
Woke up.
Fell out of bed.
Dragged a comb across m' head.
tommy
View Profile
Eternal Order
Devil’s Island
15861 Posts

Profile of tommy
I put it on the secret sessions for you.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
DStachowiak
View Profile
Inner circle
Baltimore, MD
2158 Posts

Profile of DStachowiak
Thanks Tommy, I wasn't thinking when I posted that here in the open!
Don
Woke up.
Fell out of bed.
Dragged a comb across m' head.
The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » Walter Scott 1911 arrest story (0 Likes)
 Go to page 1~2 [Next]
[ Top of Page ]
All content & postings Copyright © 2001-2020 Steve Brooks. All Rights Reserved.
This page was created in 0.22 seconds requiring 5 database queries.
The views and comments expressed on The Magic Café
are not necessarily those of The Magic Café, Steve Brooks, or Steve Brooks Magic.
> Privacy Statement <

ROTFL Billions and billions served! ROTFL