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Laura Winter New user Finland 4 Posts |
Greetings,
I wanted to pick up a theme Bilwonder brought up in the "Magic as if it were real" thread : Quote:
Naturalism, Realism, Romanticism, Surrealism, Pop Art....All of these movements have their proponents in literature, paint, drama, as well as other arts. You will notice it happening in magic as well. Magic at this time seems to be shadowing theatre for legitimacy, so you can read about these movement in theatre and just change the art to "magic" and see where we may be going. Thinking about the great 20th and 21st century art and thought movements, contemporary magic seems to me to be moving more and more into the postmodern, and by that I mean two things. First, the "pastiche" - consciously imitating the style of another magician in a recognizable way. DB wannabies or Penn and Teller making fun of Siegfried and Roy are not quite what I mean here, but rather someone doing a Cardini number in their show without explicitly saying so, or using Erdnase's original patter for the four queens trick. The ordinary spectator won't be able to spot it (as it is often with literary pastiches as well), but the knowing one will get an extra kick out of it. This might or might not be considered elitist - I don't. The second and related "postmodern" feature, intertextuality, might be a timeless aspect of magic. Intertextuality is, of course, most commonly defined as "the ways texts are related to other texts" (consider the film Pretty Woman and the stories of Cinderella and Pygmalion) but in connection with magic could be understood as how techiques and effects relate and are understood through seeing other effects and other ways of presenting effects (different versions of levitation and sawing a woman in half spring to mind immediately). Another example of intertextuality, the crossover of genres, would be magicians as fictional heroes, or what has been discussed here at lenght, using books as inspiration for creating magic. (Although I sincerely hope that there aren't many Gandalfs out there performing sponge balls -ugh!) Still the lightness and unseriousness in pastiching and playing with intertextual elements often connected with the postmodern might not be in line with the consistency and congruence demanded of a truly magical performance. Could one do a really good show by having more than one character? Perhaps a (schitzofrenic) good magician/bad magician thing could work? Sorry about the long post, I just got quite inspired reading the earlier thread. I'm trying to put together my program using philosophical ideas of idealism and romanticism as the framework, but am somewhat afraid of making it too cerebral... I'd be glad on any comments, Laura |
The Curator V.I.P. Beware Vampire, I have 3909 Posts |
Hello Laura,
I believe that magic may find a new venue (opening) in the field of contemporary art. The work of Ricky Jay, like his last book "Dice", is going in that direction. My own Surnateum concept is not only a try to give a new background for magic and magicians, but also a projection of Belgian surrealism and magical realism into a performing art. The real traveling museum we're working on, will be a passage between our ordinary reality and the world of imagination. Intertextually "Alice through the looking glass" We must not forget that the word "magic" is in the centre of imaginary or imagination. I'd love to discuss this topic more, but I should do it in French; I'm far more at ease with my own language. |
Reg Rozee Special user Vancouver, Canada 592 Posts |
I think a good show using more than one character could be presented as a series of playlets all involving the use of magic. Probably introduced and concluded by a narrator in a thought provoking way, similar to some Shakespeare plays. This would be much closer to theatre than conventional magic usually is, and would demand more acting chops than many magicians usually display, plus probably some supporting characters. This is intertextual in a way I guess as far as a genre crossover goes.
-bigwolf {*}
Reality is what doesn't go away when you stop believing in it. -Phillip K. Dick
Who are you going to believe, me or your own eyes? -Chico Marx |
Caleb Strange Special user Manchester UK 676 Posts |
Laura, even on my sick bed, I found your comments thought provoking. Let me share some of my thinking with you.
I'm not sure how well the pastiche works in magic as an art form, simply because I don't think non-magicians are familiar enough with magic to understand such allusions. To be honest, I'm personally uncomfortable with this approach in all the theatrical arts. Sometimes it can work, but sometimes the self-referencing, the allusions and the sly winks to the knowledgeable can mask an absence of content. Often it's all style. I believe true art should have depth and sincerity. Also, on occasion, the pastiche approach CAN be elitist. I don't have a problem with elitism per se, and I don't think we should pander to the lowest common denominator, but when a performance needs the equivalent of twenty footnotes a page, then perhaps the entertainer needs to ask just who is being entertained. As for intertextuality, I'm all for it. David de Leon has had some fine thoughts about achieving a consistent whole in one's magic. Maybe, as bizarrists, we should think of building our routines around a common theme? I've recently brainstormed with Doug over his Gathering idea, and what I've enjoyed about our thinking is that it has an overview. As well as the story in each individual effect, the evening itself has its own related story. The whole, touch wood, will be very much more than the sum of its parts. The idea of using different characters is also a very good one. I believe, as bizarrists, we could do this more often. For instance, if we have an effect where we read from an old ship's log, we can alter our performance to give the impression of the Captain's character. Similarly, if we later read a letter from a lover's leap suicide, say, our performance can be suitably altered again. Actually, last week, in a drug-induced reverie (we're talking prescribed stuff rather than some romatic laudanum Kubla Khan situation!) I had an idea for another type of performance venue, where there would need to be several performers. It might interest you. I'll endeavour to post it soon. Regards, Caleb Strange.
-- QCiC --
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Laura Winter New user Finland 4 Posts |
Curator, Bigwolf, Caleb;
Thank you for your thoughts, sorry it took some time to answer - I was away for a long weekend at the countryside in a small, isolated cabin... As you might guess, werewolves weren't far from my mind while I was sitting by the fireplace! I couldn't recognize a set of tracks on the snow, definitely big paws with a trail of a tail next to them... I don't know how else to start than by cursing my weak French skills - Curator, I'm going to get to know your Surnateum better, and I hope after that you will discuss your thoughts also in English - not my native language either... I'm going to look up the Ricky Jay book, thanks for the tip! Caleb, I fully agree with you that imaginary footnotes do not belong to a good performance! I certainly don't think erudition for the sake of erudition adds anything to the artistic value and meaning of a performance. I was perhaps thinking more along the lines of having different levels of depth, more like in a very good modern fairytale. A child would get an emotionally and intellectually meaningful experience simply from the fairytale itself, while an adult might get that AND an added level of enjoyment when she or he recognizes possible allusions to Freud or an old Grimm brothers tale. Caleb, I hope you have returned -at least temporarily- from the river Alph and will write more about the idea you mentioned! And, with your permission, do you think I could start a thread here on the idea of an European framework of magic, quoting your reply to my introductory post? Laura |
Mark Rough Inner circle Ivy, Virginia 2110 Posts |
I'm finding this string very refreshing. As a semi-bizarrist I find the state of magic, at least on much of this side of the Atlantic, quite stale. Many of us carry the idea of using "pastiche" to the extreme. I've seen whole shows copied. They usually only come of as poor parodies of the original. Yet, I like the idea of using allusions to those that have come before us. I'm sure that is what we're talking about though.
Also, I've always been intrigued by Caleb's ideas for alternative venues (an empty warehouse, the woods, etc). I get frustrated when I have ideas that I just can't use in the venues that I perform in now. Occassionally I get the chance to work in a small theatre that is very open to alternative performance. For all intents and purposes, though, none of the places around me would be the kind of place that Caleb, for example, could perform one of his pieces. What sort of venues are available in other places? Mark
What would Wavy do?
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Caleb Strange Special user Manchester UK 676 Posts |
Laura, you'll be pleased to hear that I've finished exploring the caverns measureless to man and woman. Though the men from Porlock still keep bothering me. I would be very happy for you to start the thread you mentioned, and please feel free to quote me.
The idea of LEVELS of performance is something that interests me very much. One mystical tradition that I didn't mention in that post, that has flowed through history, albeit largely unobserved in the West, is Sufism. As far as I understand it, they use stories almost like technology, to heal and enlighten. And, again as I understand it, a fundamental principle is that these stories have many levels and layers. The Nasrudin stories, for instance, can be enjoyed simply as jokes. Or, depending on the time, place, and condition in which you experience them, they offer additional nutrition. I strongly believe that, as creative people, we should strive to build substance in our work, as well as flavour. Mark, the venues issue is well worth raising. At the moment, bizarre magic is not widely known. Getting adequate investment, time, and the facilities to develop 'big' stuff, can be a real problem. It's maybe something we can discuss in another thread. I do believe that lots of the material in this forum would play very well with all kinds of audiences. But how do we get feet through the door? Or, as you ask, where do we find the door? I don't have any easy answers, but I do believe that, collectively, we have more than enough creativity to solve these kinds of issues. Maybe we should brainstorm? As it happens, I'm working on an idea for a central performance space for bizarrists, which is more than a little ambitious in scope. Again, it'd be an unfamiliar experience for the audience. But, I'd hope, it would play well. I'll post it here soon, when I've ironed out some of the creases. Funnily enough, it's called 'Caravanserai'. Regards, Caleb Strange.
-- QCiC --
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Mark Rough Inner circle Ivy, Virginia 2110 Posts |
Levels in Sufism. . .hmmm. . .yes. Rumi is the obvious example. Beautiful poetry. Love poetry. Love poetry to God. Wonderful stuff and I hadn't thought about using it for inspiration before. Could be very interesting. Also Kahil Gibhran. . .
Thanks Caleb. Mark
What would Wavy do?
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Caleb Strange Special user Manchester UK 676 Posts |
Interestingly enough Mark, in Idries Shah's books, there are several stories about magic. In one, Nasrudin goes to the patent office and says, 'I'd like to report that I have invented a magic wand'. The patent clerk says, rudely, 'Go away. We don't want your fantasies, mad man. We only register REAL inventions here'. So Nasrudin waved his magic wand, and the clerk disappeared.
There are also accounts of Sufis working as conjurors. From what I've understood, they also worked as troubadours in medieval Europe, sharing their knowledge through story and song. As a matter of fact, it was Shah's work that revitalised my interest in the power of stories in general. Aside from their specific uses by Sufis, I think the rest of us have much to gain in telling, and listening to stories. That's partly why I'm a bizarrist. And the more meanings with which we can imbue our work, the better, in my opinion. As Laura suggests, this can enable a broad range of responses. A favourite example for me would be 'The Simpsons'. My two year old son loves the title sequence, especially Homer screaming as he's nearly knocked over in his own garage. I find the programme equally as funny, but for its satirical, and well-observed humour (though the slapstick tickles Daddy too). And my partner seems to amuse herself by comparing me with Homer, and finding many similarities. Many levels. Many resonances. Many effects. D'oh! Caleb Strange.
-- QCiC --
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Mark Rough Inner circle Ivy, Virginia 2110 Posts |
D'oh indeed.
Another great reminder. I'll check Shah out. I haven't read this stuff since I was in college. I guess that comparative religions degree might end up paying off after all. Thanks again, Mark
What would Wavy do?
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