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Doug Higley
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Forget about the threat that mankind poses to the Earth: our activities may be shortening the life of the universe too. Cosmologists claim by observing dark energy the universe has been nudged closer to its death.


The startling claim is made by a pair of American cosmologists investigating the consequences for the cosmos of quantum theory, the most successful theory we have. Over the past few years, cosmologists have taken this powerful theory of what happens at the level of subatomic particles and tried to extend it to understand the universe, since it began in the subatomic realm during the Big Bang.

But there is an odd feature of the theory that philosophers and scientists still argue about. In a nutshell, the theory suggests that we change things simply by looking at them and theorists have puzzled over the implications for years.

They often illustrate their concerns about what the theory means with boggling mind experiments, notably Schrodinger's cat in which, thanks to a fancy experimental set up, the moggy is both alive and dead until someone decides to look, when it either carries on living, or dies. That is, by one interpretation (by another, the universe splits into two, one with a live cat and one with a dead one.)


Full Story:
telegraph.co.uk
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Rupert Bair
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I think the theory lacks sooooo much weight.

Schrodinger's cat is a paradox anyway.

But everytime you look at the future, that changes because you looked at it.
Doug Higley
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Or your wifes bum...or your computer entry...wait, that explains the missing entries...

But seriously just another 'Humans are bad' junk theory this time instead of the environment it's the ENVIRONMENT! (All of it) I think I'll not give a crap.
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Corona Smith
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Careful what you wish for!

I think it is true that our attitudes shape the world.

Dream / reality are intertwined in all human affairs.

Attention and intent are the building blocks of reality.
Rupert Bair
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In the land of the blind, the future is safe.
Corona Smith
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Which is more useful, the sun or the moon?

The moon gives us light at night, when its dark.

But the sun gives us light in the day when it is already light.

So it must be the moon.

-the wise men of Chem.
Doug Higley
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Smile
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kregg
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Edit: In the land of the safe, the future is blind.

In the memory of Pluto. Smile
POOF!
Rupert Bair
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The moon reflects the lights sun, the moon doesn't actually give off light on its
own self esteem, it has none.

Therefore we need both the mirror and the man to make peppers ghost work.
The sun is more important to us. The moon does nothing but produce werewolves in my back garden.
balducci
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There were some other good stories linked to on the page Doug posted.

Such as this "Surfer dude stuns physicists with theory of everything" (a bit misleading of a headline, though):

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jh......l&page=1

And this story about the 'tree=man' is flabbergasting:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jht......e114.xml
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Magnus Eisengrim
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The article gets the uncertainty principle SO wrong, either

1. The article completely misconstrues what the physicists say; or
2. The "physicists" are fakes.

This reads like the sort of nonsense coming out of the Maharishi International University.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Doug Higley
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I've tried to research this without looking at the results...cats were everywhere!
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balducci
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Quote:
On 2007-11-23 12:50, Magnus Eisengrim wrote:
The article gets the uncertainty principle SO wrong, either

1. The article completely misconstrues what the physicists say; or
2. The "physicists" are fakes.

This reads like the sort of nonsense coming out of the Maharishi International University.

John

It seems to me that a lot of modern day physics sounds like that, as does a lot of higher level mathematics. Much of it makes sense and leads to verifiable predictions, even though it seems nonsensical and crazy at first blush. Of course, that doesn't mean that every crazy sounding theory is true.

Concerning your comments:

2. The physicists in the article are certainly not fakes. A quick Internet search demonstrates that.

1. I imagine the article simplified things, as articles tend to do when scientific matters are discussed.

Magnus, have you studied physics and / or seriously kept up with it in recent years? I'm pretty smart and technically I'm a mathematician / scientist, but the math in modern physics is beyond me (well, unless I made it my life to work in that area full-time perhaps).
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rossmacrae
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Schrodinger's bank account - it's both flush with money and empty until someone writes a check.
stoneunhinged
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All of you are thinking too much.

As I have said several times here, intelligence is overrated.

As I understand this thread, we are to think the following: because of Schrodinger's cat, the possibility exists that because I am looking at stuff in the particle accelerator in my basement I have shortened the lifespan of the universe. Or I might have lengthened it. Or it might have stayed the same. And therefore we have scientists and philosophers at state universities making 100K a year thinking about what damage we might have done by thinking about what damage we might have done. Or what damage we might not have done. Or what damage could be done in the Final Fantasy XXIV computer game.

I want to puke!

Bozos and idiots! They get Ph.D.s and run around sucking money from every possible source to study...What? That studying might shorten the life span of the universe?

I want to puke!

I want a Ph.D. which allows me to study pornography. Then I could get paid to do something that I do once and a while when the mood fits.
Rupert Bair
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I have this theory every time we go to the toilet an innocent invisible sea horse in a parallel universe to mars dies.

Can someone fund me to study this?
MagicSanta
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There is only one thing to do. Everyone must hold get a tree seedling and then bury themselves so that the tree seedling can be placed in front of you in the ground. Then everyone can blow their brains out and their bodies can fertalize the tree and the universe and the world will be safe.
Magnus Eisengrim
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Quote:
On 2007-11-23 13:21, balducci wrote:

Concerning your comments:

2. The physicists in the article are certainly NOT fakes. A quick internet search demonstrates that.


I checked Vanderbilt, and all I found about Dent is that he is a "research associate". Kraus is on faculty at Case Western, but his homepage makes no mention of peer-reviewed publications. They are not fakes, but it is hard to tell who they are in their fields.

Note that the original article is in the current New Scientist. It's a good mag, but it's hardly peer-reviewed science.

Quote:
1. I imagine the article simplified things, as articles tend to do when scientific matters are discussed.


I suspect that this is largely the case.

Quote:
Magnus, have you studied physics and / or seriously kept up with it in recent years? I'm pretty smart and technically I'm a mathematician / scientist, but the math in modern physics is beyond me (well, unless I made it my life to work in that area full-time perhaps).


My first degree was in mathematics, but I am no physicist.


These guys could, indeed, be onto something important. For now, I stand by my belief that the whole article reads more like new-agism or an April Fool's joke than science.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
Corona Smith
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Quote:
On 2007-11-23 14:38, Matt Colman wrote:
I have this theory every time we go to the toilet an innocent invisible sea horse in a parallel universe to mars dies.

Can someone fund me to study this?


I am sending you 73p immediately. If this is true, it will probably upset a lot of children and other animal lovers. Hopefully your research will discover this is a local (to you) anomaly and when you cease to exist, the invisible seahorses will once again be free to roam the invisible ocean liberated from the danger of Colman inter-dimensional pollution.
Rupert Bair
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If you can't donate, can somebody wash my fish for free? Fishwashers quote was redicularse
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