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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Shuffled not Stirred » » Memory technique? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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MagicKim
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Which memory technique would you recommend the most? If I basically want to be able to know what card is in the 45th position and what position the 3 of hearts has, just as 2 examples. Thank you.

Kim

ps. trying a pegsystem, I don't like it.
Scott Cram
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First, be aware of what constitutes true memorized deck mastery. I mention this first, so as to start with a goal in mind.

Where else can we go, if the peg system didn't appeal to you?

There is an alternative system, similar to the peg approach, but different enough you might want to consider it. Dominic O'Brien uses a system in which he takes a journey through a familiar place, such as his house, or his work, and he sees various celebrities performing various unusual actions at various stages of the journey. The celebrities as well as their particular actions, each represent particular cards. The particular stages of the journey represent the location of those cards. Here's the full detail of Dominic's playing card approach, if you're interested.

Dominic O'Brien, who has won the world memory championship 8 times, used this approach to memorize as many as 50 decks without mistakes! Understand that I'm not talking about the order of 50 separate shuffled decks, but rather 50 decks shuffled together, where you might have to deal with things like 5 or more of the same playing card in a row!

Rote memorization might be the way to go. It may take longer (or it may be quicker for you), but you do have the advantage that the only thing that comes to mind when you see a card is it's position! You could use flashcards to help you here. The old fashioned way is good, and there are also numerous online and offline flash cards programs you could use. I talk about them in posts on my blog here, here, here, here and here. If you're using Windows, StackView has a great quiz section that would be helpful here.

Finally, for a great and detailed comparison of the various approaches to remembering a stack, check out Doug Dyment's An Introduction to Full-Deck Stacks. Another good resource for your question is section 3, How Do I Memorize the Stack? of Simon Aronson's Memories Are Made of This.
S2000magician
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Quote:
On 2007-12-02 12:15, MagicKim wrote:
Which memory technique would you recommend the most? If I basically want to be able to know what card is in the 45th position and what position the 3 of hearts has, just as 2 examples. Thank you.

Four of clubs and 7, respectively.

;)
Vlad_77
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Just a note: Dominic O'Brien's approach is reminiscent - pardon the pun - of the method used by Aristotle. I used this method for the Aronson Stack and got it down in two days.

Best,
Vlad
MagicKim
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Thnx for the replies. now, which stack would you recommend and why?

Take care,

Kim
Scott Cram
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As a matter of fact, that discussion is going on just a few threads over:

http://www.themagiccafe.com/forums/viewt......m=205&14
ghostpianist
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Rote.
Nathan Alexander
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You know I'm never afraid to post, but wow. The work that Scott puts in his post (he'd probably say it's not much) is a great example of good people on the Café helping out with links and all that.

Thanks for a great post Scott!
edh
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Yes I noticied that in Scott's posts.

My thanks and appreciation, Scott.
Magic is a vanishing art.
MagicKim
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Thanks a lot scott!

Kim
Scott Cram
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Thanks for the compliments!

I'm here to help when I can. (OK, I occasionally sneak in my own questions, too)
kosmoshiva
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In Mnemonica, Tamariz suggests a combination of techniques – audio, musical, visual, muscle memory - even having a crib sheet handy for psychological back-up (rather like a concert pianist I heard of who sits on the sheet music). His method of learning is a lot of fun. The more methods you have for memorization, along with having more ways of testing yourself - the better you end up knowing your stack. Smile
Don't forget to breathe.
ghostpianist
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Quote:
On 2007-12-04 09:58, kosmoshiva wrote:
In Mnemonica, Tamariz suggests a combination of techniques – audio, musical, visual, muscle memory - even having a crib sheet handy for psychological back-up (rather like a concert pianist I heard of who sits on the sheet music). His method of learning is a lot of fun. The more methods you have for memorization, along with having more ways of testing yourself - the better you end up knowing your stack. Smile


That did not work for me at all. Audio, visual, muscle...none were useful for me. I had to learn by rote for some reason. Hope you guys don't' have to learn it the hard way.
Krumb
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Magickim, do you mind if I ask why you don't like the peg system? I used it for the Tamariz's stack and I had near instantaneous recall when using it.
boinko
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Remember, too, Bob Farmer's system.

http://www.ludism.org/mentat/PlayingCardSystems

(Scroll down the page to see Farmer's 'Queen of Halloween' system.)

With Farmer's system and Dominic's journey method, I was able to memorize both Tamariz and Aronson in two weeks or so.

Plus, I can memorize an entire shuffled deck in about 8 minutes. (Working on getting it down to less than three, but I find the deck memorization to be absolutely exhausting.)
Dennis Loomis
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At the start of the thread, a peg system is mentioned. That means using mnemonics. When I learned the Aronson Stack, I used the mnemonics I had learned from Harry Lorayne's system. Simon used mnemonics, and so did Mike Close as well. However, today when Simon, Mike, and I perform, we do NOT use the mnemonic associations. I don't even remember the particular peg words I used to first learn it. This is important. If you still have to use the peg words while you are performing, I would suggest that you may not be ready yet to use a memdeck for an audience. It depends on what you're doing with it. There are some effects where the delays caused by having to think through the original mnemonic codes do not matter.

When I practice today, I'm really practicing just the rote associations. The mnemonics were merely a tool to INITIALLY remember the cards and their stack numbers. What matters is to get to this point by any means that works for you. I enjoy mnemonics and use them for many things. I think they are fun. But you may prefer a different method. Don't put down rote memory. That how all of us learned most of the things we know. Just learning to talk was one long exercise in rote learning. It works. Repetition will get the job done. And while I enthusiastically do recomend mnemonics, you need to find what works best for you.

Good luck.

Dennis Loomis
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<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
jennings
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Hi Dennis,

I learnt AS by rote. I just kept banging away until it went it. If you pardon the expression ! I found mnemonics, word association and the like made learning it even harder. Took me about a month to learn and about 6 months to get performance ready.



Andy
Dennis Loomis
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To Andy,
When I learned the Aronson Stack, I had already been working with mnemonics for many years. (I probably would not have earned my college degree without mnemonics to help me learn so many things.) I had peg words for the numbers from 1 to 100, so I didn't have to learn pegs for that. I had also worked with Harry Loraynes pegs for playing cards. I had to brush up on those. But I was a little ahead. If you are new to mnemonics, it's true there is some initial work to do. However, the benefit is that once you have mnemonic pegs and understand how to make links, you have a tool you can use for so many other things. Not just in magic, but for all kinds of things.

But yes, use what works for you. Absolutely.

Dennis Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
Scott Cram
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Quote:
On 2007-12-06 18:48, boinko wrote:
Remember, too, Bob Farmer's system.

http://www.ludism.org/mentat/PlayingCardSystems

(Scroll down the page to see Farmer's 'Queen of Halloween' system.)

With Farmer's system and Dominic's journey method, I was able to memorize both Tamariz and Aronson in two weeks or so.

Plus, I can memorize an entire shuffled deck in about 8 minutes. (Working on getting it down to less than three, but I find the deck memorization to be absolutely exhausting.)


You can also learn Bob Farmer's mnemonics here, with the added bonus that you can quiz yourself on them until you're sure you've got them memorized!
Harry Lorayne
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What silliness! Pick up any one of my books for goodness sake and learn the right way to memorize cards or anything else. HARRY LORAYNE.
[email]harrylorayne@earthlink.net[/email]

http://www.harrylorayne.com
http://www.harryloraynemagic.com
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