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mota Inner circle 1658 Posts |
Does anyone know of any busking activity in Dallas/Fort Worth Texas area?
Thanks! |
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JordanB Special user dallas, tx 626 Posts |
Not much in the way of busking in DFW. Every now and then someone tries it in the West End and is promptly shut down by police.
I've heard good and bad about people trying to busk at Sundance Square in Ft. Worth, maybe someone who has tried it can reply. I thought about trying to get a permit to work Taste of Dallas in the West End, but in the end it was more trouble than it was worth. |
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MOTO42 Loyal user Whitehouse Texas 225 Posts |
The city of Dallas hasn't a clue where to draw the line between "Begging" and "business".
Standing around asking for spare change = begging (I agree) Performing in a public place = begging Selling firewood/watermellons/vegitables/roses in a parking lot (wether you have obtained permission from the owner of that parking lot or not) = begging. There /might/ be a legal way to busk in Dallas. It probably involves a permit. But I seriously doubt that the local police and court system would honor any permits or permissions you obtained. (oops, I hadn't noticed how much of a necro-post this was, sorry)
"One man's miracle is another man's warm-up"
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Ronnie Ramin Loyal user 233 Posts |
There is Busking activity in Ft. Worth all the time. Magic very seldom (I've done it, but not lately) In Sundance Square there is a Piano player, some Bucket Drummers and a Painter every time I go there. The Piano Player said they won't let you do a hat line, he just sets up a tip jar. I used the hat line myself without any trouble, your mileage may very, as I'm not an aggressive personality like some are.
As far as permits, I was never able to get one or a straight answer about one. I never worked Sundance Square because I didn't care for the flow of the People. It was better at other places. As far as Police... I never had trouble, usually if you don't cause trouble you won't get in any. |
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Father Photius Grammar Host El Paso, TX (Formerly Amarillo) 17161 Posts |
Most of Texas tends to be anti busking, not differentiating between street performing for tips and begging. Largely due to the warmer climate in the state attracting large numbers of transients. However, my experience is that the begging laws are seldom enforced on the beggars, as one can easily see at any intersection, underpass, or ramp during rush hours. Yet, let someone start to street perform and they seem to be quick to enforce. Go figure.
"Now here's the man with the 25 cent hands, that two bit magician..."
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Bill Palmer Eternal Order Only Jonathan Townsend has more than 24312 Posts |
Back when I first started doing magic for a living, there was a juggler in Houston named Michael Marlin. Mike used to perform for the people standing in line at Jones Hall (a ritzy place) while they were getting their tickets. The police ran him off.
So he went before city council to see if he could get some kind of special permit to perform -- not necessarily to solicit tips, but just to perform. They were really uptight about it. They didn't consider how many great blues performers had been street performers. One in particular was Sam "Lightnin'" Hopkins. Eventually, Bruce Barnett did a television special about him. It won some kind of award.
"The Swatter"
Founder of CODBAMMC My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups." www.cupsandballsmuseum.com |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-02-18 22:56, photius wrote: You actually draw a crowd, the beggers don't. Therefore, in the eyes of the law, you are the largest threat to the serene passing of the public. I have a permit here in RI. I was told I was not allowed a hat line (their exact wording was; "direct solicitation for funds") but that a passive bucket was allowed. Then the police lt. told me in HIS eyes, a passive bucket WAS a "direct solicitation for funds" and he wouldn't have it!
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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mota Inner circle 1658 Posts |
Thank you for the input.
The following is copied from http://www.balloonhq.com/faq/twister_busking.html I asked them for details about the court case but got no answer...anyone know more? From balloonhq: # I would have asked him where in the city codes this information could be found. I still would've quit and not alienated this person by asking them to bring me a police officer to tell me that what they say is correct. In Dallas, you are allowed to "practice" your area of entertaiment with a thought toward sharpening your skills. If any of the people in the crowd you gather in so doing wishes to give you a "gratuity", it is legal to accept it. # I'd go downtown and look up the codes. When I went to the code enforcement office here, they were even nice enough to photo-copy the regulations for me. Come to think of it they even highlighted the section pertaining to my need. Funny what a lil' yeller bird and a rose balloon will do for you. # I would assume that you don't wish to be the test case. Although, when a fellow who does water color portraits for tips and one who does balloon tip work on a regular basis were confronted with this same regulation told the police officer that they were going to leave as he had requested, but only after he issued them a citation so that they could have their day in court. The judge threw it out qouting the thing about "practice and gratuity". I must say, to their credit, the two fellows did stood up for the officer and explained to the judge how they had demanded their day in court. The judge has been scolding the officer about bringing him something he could sink his teeth into. They carry a photo-copy of the judges ruling with them all the time to show to any officer who hasn't heard yet that busking in Dallas is not considered to be "generating income". Now me... I also have searched the Dallas city code online and have been unable to find the relevant code...I could just be blind though. |
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fireperformer911 Special user 547 Posts |
Ronnie
What cross streets in Ft Worth? I went to Sundance Square this weekend it was dead. Mota I will get my attorney to research the City Code this week and post if he finds anything. Thanks All for giving me hope in DFW area to be able to perform! |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Good luck!
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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dilan_thomas Regular user 101 Posts |
Eight or ten years ago I did street magic in Sundance Square. At that point in time there was an organization called something to the effect of Sundance Square Entertainers. They actually paid me $25 or $50 (I don't remember which) to perform for 3 or 4 hours and gave me a little card thing to keep the cops away. The cops never bothered me at all. I would always take my night club table and set up where that closed theatre is down from the coffee shop. It actually blocked the sides and kept people from getting behind me.
I didn't get a lot of tips, but then in retrospect I wasn't very good. |
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AaronTheMagician Loyal user 291 Posts |
Sundance Square... like, the immediate square surrounding the large parking lot (near Billy Miner's, Four Day Weekend, etc).
It took a few phone calls a couple of weeks ago, but there is a permit you have to have. The lady talked too fast and I didn't catch it, but she took down my e-mail address and supposedly e-mailed me the permit application. It never came through, but that's proof enough that it exists. I'll try again in a few days. I'm sure that as long as you're not getting in the way, there won't be a problem. There was, as Ronnie pointed out, a lot of street performers. The piano player, there was a guitarist with a battery amp, two painters (one amazing one, one really bad one), and a trumpet player down the street that I could hear. I don't think that there would be an issue where you would be required to produce a permit, but it's better to be safe than sorry. |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Well, I just found the Sundance Square website with a "contact us" button. I sent them an e-mail asking for further information on performing in the Square. If they get back to me, I'll pass it on here.
Posted: Mar 11, 2008 11:53pm --------------------------------- Got a response about an hour later. Just found it in my e-mail. Quote:
Dear Ed, Ah well.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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Brian Proctor Inner circle Somewhere 2323 Posts |
WOW... sounds like the USSR.
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
It's not exactly totalitarism... just don't breathe too deep, OK?
Seriously, the beaurucratic (sp) mind is a tightly closed thing. They can't understand and are uncomfortable around the free-spirited nature that is buskers! To them, every busker is a begger or a con man lying in wait to annoy and harrass their precious tax-paying citizens.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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AaronTheMagician Loyal user 291 Posts |
That kindof upsets me that the cute-sounding lady on the phone lied to me that day...
.: sigh :. But, thanks for the shared insight, Ed! |
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ed rhodes Inner circle Rhode Island 2885 Posts |
Any time I can! You're welcome.
"...and if you're too afraid of goin' astray, you won't go anywhere." - Granny Weatherwax
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MOTO42 Loyal user Whitehouse Texas 225 Posts |
I wonder if they actually have an ordinance against it, or if it is assumed to be illegal because the city does not issue a permit for it.
From the tone of the email it sounds like Sundance Square is privately owned. Is this true? If so, they can deny us the right to busk there all they like. Until we stand on the sidewalk. (Then they just call the cops and claim we are forcing people into the street.)
"One man's miracle is another man's warm-up"
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Ronnie Ramin Loyal user 233 Posts |
Just go out and do it... move along if they ask you too. If you ask other people that do it: some will give you mis-information, because they don't want the competition. I never got a straight answer out of the Court House. One person would say you need a permit the other would say no. One of the "performers" on my street (not Sundance Square) tried to intimidate me and fed me bad info, etc... I just performed and did a good job and treated people with respect. I got no hassle from the cops but a Tour Guide lady asked me to move across the street, I did, it was a better spot anyway.
I got a positive feeling from the response that Ed got from Sundance. It sounded to me like they were giving the go ahead. "...We as in "Sundance Square" do not own the sidewalks and you will see from time to time various entertainers out and about in the Square that are not our "hired street performers." We do not and cannot control that activity unless there is a noise complaint from one of our residential tenants. At that point our security will ask the entertainer(s) to move along or if there is a problem to contact the FWPD...." I think they are saying don't be a problem and there won't be one. So don't go out and harass people or cuss them out or...any of that stuff. If you "Add" to the atmosphere and don't impede the public negatively you should be ok. As I said earlier I think Sundance Square isn't the best place in Ft. Worth for Busking. The place I was at was great. Aaron PM if you want details. Ronnie |
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phatmatt New user Dallas TX 14 Posts |
Just wanted to add to this as I am from Dallas...
Also, if anyone in Dallas is interested in offering a helping had to a fresh beginning magician it would be greatly appreciated. http://www.dallasfarmersmarket.org/Events/buskar.html |
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