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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » The Gambling Spot » » Clean hand dice switches (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Tony45
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I saw George do the coat move over 20 years ago, he was doing a class for the place I was working at and I laughed to myself when he did it. I was like "Great, you just got your work in, now how do you get it out without going fishing in your sub ?" Its a good magic move but to someone who has watched thousands of guys shoot dice, it didn't look natural at all and I was 3 feet away. It was like seeing loaded dice going down a table, to me they would look like the proverbial flat tire but to someone else they would seem normal.
Marlin1894
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I hope and pray that time and health will allow Tony Giorgio to do that dice DVD that has been talked about for so long. I think if he does we will have a darn-near definitive resource on the topic.
ronfour
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Does anybody know where there is a video of a clean hand dice switch, besides Doc's?
ASW
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Quote:
On 2010-11-25 03:23, Tony45 wrote:
I saw George do the coat move over 20 years ago, he was doing a class for the place I was working at and I laughed to myself when he did it. I was like "Great, you just got your work in, now how do you get it out without going fishing in your sub ?" Its a good magic move but to someone who has watched thousands of guys shoot dice, it didn't look natural at all and I was 3 feet away. It was like seeing loaded dice going down a table, to me they would look like the proverbial flat tire but to someone else they would seem normal.


It's a real good point you make. But how many protection lecturers work as a team or crew to show how things might go down over the course of play (I know of one duo but dice isn't their long suit)? The point is that he showed how the work could be put in, does he need to show how it's managed in the game and then brought out? If you don't catch it going in, and don't follow the spike in the action, how are you going to be set for the clean up? How much detail does a room full of pit bosses need on the minutiae anyway? Not a lot I'd say. As long as he's discussing behaviors and tells and the pit bosses understand the game dynamics, isn't that the key objective? Is a protection lecture about the tiny, tiny, minutiae? Who has time for that?
Whenever I find myself gripping anything too tightly I just ask myself "How would Guy Hollingworth hold this?"

A magician on the Genii Forum

"I would respect VIPs if they respect history."

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Tony45
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ASW, youre right, cant argue with that kind of logic. I was just expressing my view on the move itself and not on the complete act that would be going on at the time of the move. If it was to go down, they would first scout crews and look for the weakest one and do it as late in the shift as they could assuming the crew would be tired at that point. Then I would guess there would be at least 4 of them and maybe more including a girl who would take the boxes attention and another giving the stick a two way bet for sure to get his attention,and a third giving the heavy prop action assuming they were going in with T,s. At least that's my theory on how to do it and seeing the shape of some of the crews that are working today, it would be a snap,lol.
I understand holdouts have made some huge leaps and bounds in the last 10-15 years, so that might be an even better option than going to the sub.
Its still an enormously dangerous play, at least in my eyes it is.
Mr. Z
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Historically when they used to do that sort of thing they'd try to get as many people down as possible to take off the big scores. A reliable source told me you'd want the stick and box in as a minimum, if you could get the whole crew, the box, and the floor, the sky was the limit! Apparently though just having any one of the aforementioned employees down was often enough to get the money, but obviously a bit more risky.

At any rate he said there may have been 3 squares at the table, if any, depending on the play.

I've also heard of instances where they got it on without any help, but it was definitely a daredevil "hit and run" play for some quick cash, the tees only staying in action for one or two rolls at a time. Apparently some of these crews ate speed before they walked into the joints, which would definitely help explain the mindset...

It's worth noting that all said examples took place many many years ago--different ballgame back then.
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
Tony45
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On 2010-12-06 07:17, Mr. Z wrote:
Apparently some of these crews ate speed before they walked into the joints, which would definitely help explain the mindset...

It's worth noting that all said examples took place many many years ago--different ballgame back then.

Sure, back then the cameras are nothing near what they are today. Its like comparing a 1950,s tv set to a HD one today ! lol
And what you said about the crews coming in on speed ? that's just the beginning,probably 1/2 the crews working had bottles in their lockers and joints in their socks! I know I don't have to tell you about the old Horseshoe and what went on down there, lol. But for those who don't know, I will explain : When Benny Binion, who in my opinion is or was the greatest casino operator the world has ever seen, used to allow his dealers to go outside the building on their breaks and do what they wanted and I do mean anything ! So long as you came back on time and did your job and didn't overly abuse anyone, you were fine. Well, these guys used to go drink a shot and beer at either the Pioneer or the old Alligator bar behind the Shoe. EVERY BREAK! And this aint some story someone told me as I used to work downtown years ago and used to drink with them at the Pioneer after I got off work they were still on the game on grave at the Shoe. I used to walk thru the Shoe when I got done at like 5-6 in the morning and be sloshed and these guys would be on the game dealing like it was nothing, hilarious.
Now heres a story that has been printed before and I know a guy who swears he was on the table behind it when it happened. My friend was working at the Nugget in craps on grave. Now one of the Shoe dealers went too far at one of the bars and really tied one on during the course of the shift, anyway the guy is messed up and he walks into the Nugget and taps the stickman on the shoulder to take him out, the stick don't look behind him, merely says "Two to the right" or whatever and goes to the base. Now the guy gets on the stick and the base dealers and the box look at the guy and the guy gets a roll !! lol. No one says anything but they can figure out what happened real easy, so they let the guy go on calling the dice and a few minutes later, the floorman and the shift boss are standing there laughing and they decide to call the Shoe,s crap pit. They call and ask if they are missing a delaer and the Shoe says yes, so they tell them whats going on and the Shoe says " Hows the guy doing ?" and the Nugget answers "Hes doing fine", or whatever. Anyway the guy gets tapped out and they direct him back to the Shoe and they send him home, no suspension, no problem, no nothing, just sober up and come back to work tomorrow.lol. Imagine that happening today ?? Its an old story and like I said, my buddy swears he was there and knowing the mentality back then, I totally believe it happened. Also, the Horseshoe had standing orders to its security guards to go no where near the dealers break room at any time, just to leave them alone. Sure, they were all burning fat ones down there and they didn't want them hassled. That was one way to keep your employees happy.
Mr. Z
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By "crews" I should note I was referring to the crossroaders coming in from the outside to take off the house, not the dealers themselves.

Anyways everything Tony says is true, wild times back then.

Table 17, heh...
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
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