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Vayron
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Belgium
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Hello

I would like to learn cheating techniques like the cold deck, nullifying the cut, the push trought, pull out, false cuts, hops, mucks, etc.

I only practice the zarrow, the riffle stacking and the second deal.

I have got Ernase, expert card techniques and poker protection (steve forte).

What are the best dvds to learn cheating techniques ?

Thanks for your answers

Bruno Vayron
MagicKim
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Åland, Finland
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Hello Vayron.

I would suggest you get the following:

The Cheat - Richard Turner
Shifts, hops and magic passes - Richard Turner
The Science of Shuffling and Stacking - Richard Turner
Best of the Bottoms - Richard Turner

I have all of those and they were great to me.

Then Steve Forte's GPS (only on VHS at the moment but hopefully on DVD soon, or a set with new stuff on it as well). People have heard some rumors about it. So you could wait and see.

Sal piacente's Poker Cheats exposed is quite good as well, taught me a few things as well.

Cheating at black jack - The Real Work - Dustin D. Marks. It has some nice mucks, some stacking etc.

For table faro work I would recommend to look into Marlos work, I am not sure which film I viewed to get started though, someone else might be of help here? Martin A. Nash's Infinity DVD has a _great_ crimp and teaching some table faro work as well.

That will keep you busy for the rest of your life Smile

Good luck.

Kim
tommy
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Fast Company

Herb Zarrow

Anything on this forum said to be any good I should think.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
Vayron
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Belgium
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Ok thanks

What do you think of those dvd's : cheating at poker (george joseph), the wheapons of the card shark.

What dvd explains the mucks in detail ?
C-Taylor
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Probably giorgio new dvd set
"theres a lot of good card magic in that book, unfortunately you have to have skill to do most of it." Smile
MagicKim
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Yeah, Tony Giorgio - The ultimate work is the mucking DVD for you. I feel G J Cheating at Poker is OK but was rather boring to watch as I new it from before. I.e, if you have those DVDs I told you earlier, you don't need it. Weapons of the cardshark is ok, worth adding to your DVD collection.


Kim
magician8
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The cheat by richard turner, it will give you a lot of material to work on and even better, you'll see one of the best perform just for you.





8
card cheat
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Start with the Forte tapes. All of the others are runners-up to these, if you ask me.

CC
Unknown419
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You all earned your knowledge and you're just giving it away just like that? Let any one in the future who ask search the search engines; it would show that they are really interested and that's when we help them.

Why are you saying this when you do it Doc? If everyone knew what you know about card or dice cheating and were able to do the moves in a game, than how would you be able to make money when everybody would be doing it as well? Cheating and knowledge comes in stages (I'm still learning new things everyday) so why are you guys sending elementary students straight to college?

I guess I'm the pot that's calling the kettle black.


Take care,

Doc

P.S. Vayron these guys just saved you hundreds of dollars and years of practicing a lot of stuff that you would eventually have to unlearn.
Vayron
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Unknow419, I already did a research on the web.

I just wanted to be sure that the DVD that I will buy are good. I'm not a beginner in card magic, but I study cheating since only 3 month.

Vayron
Unknown419
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Vayron that's just what I meant, even though an expert magician probably a beginner in this field (3 months).


Take care,

Doc
magician8
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Doc, when do you consider a person to stop being a beginner?



8
Mr. Z
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One of the problems I see around this place is the desire for a "quick-fix" for everything. Which DVD should I get? What are all the sources to learn this? Etc...

To me, and maybe I'm just being a snob, but it demonstrates a certain laziness and lack of seriousness. There's nothing wrong with an honest inquiry on certain things, but you're also missing out on the growth in your study that only comes through personal discovery. I remember when I was first starting out, the only source I really had was the bookstore and local library. I wanted to learn gambling moves but didn't really find any books that were instructional. I didn't even know there were tapes on the subject. But after reading so many books you start to find other sources and you're eventually led to the right direction. Hopefully you've learned a thing or two along the way.

Same goes with your practice. "How do I improve this? What do I do here?" These are all the types of questions you can answer yourself. Watch, learn, figure it out on your own, and you'll be amazed at what you produce. Show a sincere interest and you'll gain the confidence of the people you'll want to guide you.

In other words, research is one of the primary components of your study. If you're expecting to be given all the work on a silver platter you're just setting yourself up for mediocrity. What's the old line? It's the journey, not the destination.
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
magician8
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There are no gambling books where I live except for revelations so I guess some people need to ask for reviews because they can't buy things from other countries because it's very expensive.


8
Doc Dixon
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Quote:
On 2008-02-18 08:49, Mr. Z wrote:
One of the problems I see around this place is the desire for a "quick-fix" for everything. Which DVD should I get? What are all the sources to learn this? Etc...

To me, and maybe I'm just being a snob, but it demonstrates a certain laziness and lack of seriousness. There's nothing wrong with an honest inquiry on certain things, but you're also missing out on the growth in your study that only comes through personal discovery. I remember when I was first starting out, the only source I really had was the bookstore and local library. I wanted to learn gambling moves but didn't really find any books that were instructional. I didn't even know there were tapes on the subject. But after reading so many books you start to find other sources and you're eventually led to the right direction. Hopefully you've learned a thing or two along the way.

Same goes with your practice. "How do I improve this? What do I do here?" These are all the types of questions you can answer yourself. Watch, learn, figure it out on your own, and you'll be amazed at what you produce. Show a sincere interest and you'll gain the confidence of the people you'll want to guide you.

In other words, research is one of the primary components of your study. If you're expecting to be given all the work on a silver platter you're just setting yourself up for mediocrity. What's the old line? It's the journey, not the destination.


Mr. Z, does the "Z" stand for "zen"? Because that post was spot on. From what I've seen of your work via this forum, I'm don't have half your gambling move chops (and that's being charitable to me) and I'm sure you don't need me to tell you that. But even from my section of the peanut gallery, you nailed it.

Permit me to echo what you said with an example. About two years ago I started to reconstruct (for lack of a better term) my bottom deal. I was unsatisfied with certain aspects of it so I basically started relearning it from the ground up. At the risk of sounding overly-philosophical the "journey" this took me on not only improved my bottom deal, but made me re-examine several other moves as well. This was a journey that only began with research and books. It continued with hours of sitting at the table with a mirror constantly trying to figure out how to make it look the way it should. The books were maybe 5% (if that) of the work.

Respectfully,

DD
“For centuries we’ve said playing cards – even a single playing card – could reveal a person’s innermost thoughts.
Now you can prove it!”
See http://www.dixonmagic.com/page5/page5.html
C. Loubard
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Z. that is perhaps the most thought provoking thing I've ever seen come from you. is your cynicism wearing off with age? Seriously though, good stuff.

Now excuse me while I scrape my jaw off the floor.
tommy
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Oy Vey.
If there is a single truth about Magic, it is that nothing on earth so efficiently evades it.

Tommy
LOUIEL
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Vayron I must agree with Unknown419 and the others you said you have ERDNASE well start from there first, I'm not going to list sources as I too believe people should research on their own and when they do and truly and I mean really truly have the passion and devotion when they research what they are looking for and put the time and effort into their passion of study they too will be great someday and again it depends on your discipline, do you want to be good, mediocre, or truly great it really depends on you!

I've seen many people who claim to know all types of fancy shuffles, deals and what not and yet when I tell them to just SHUFFLE FOR ME it is the most horrendous thing I or anyone can see as ERDNASE would say a BUNGLER LOL)

My grandfather and father who are reformed cheats as well as my many uncles taught me a very very valuable lesson they made me read ERDNASE at least 20 times whether you want to believe me or not I would show them a shuffle from the book and they were like not good practice again and again and agin(IF ANYBODY THOUGHT VERNON WAS BAD AT CRITISIZING YOUR TECHNIQUE YOU SHOULD OF SEEN ALL OF THESE GUYS LOL) I got it right and made the shuffle look like I was doing nothing cause I was to be doing nothing at the card table so it seemed, anyway this taught me a valuable lesson in all I read, meaning study with all your heart and you will find the light to what you want to accomplish.

Keep Practicing and good luck in your quest!

EMVT
Jeremy Brown
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In my opinion, perfect technique is only found in real settings. Finding one's own unique style is what everybody should be after. Knowing precisley what I am after, gaining knowledge of similar routes to get started(and I repeat only to get started), and meeting that knowledge gained with my own creativity is the only way I have ever found myself successful.

There is no perfect technique that meets everyone's standards. If somthing is a fake, it will always have kinks and flaws, and there will always be someone out there to point them out. That is not to say that an imperfect move will not fly by. If there was ever a description of perfection pertaining to man regarding this field, than I believe that if it goes undetected, than it was perfect.

Respectfully,
Jeremy
Mr. Z
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Las Vegas, NV
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Quote:
On 2008-02-18 10:58, Doc Dixon wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-02-18 08:49, Mr. Z wrote:
One of the problems I see around this place is the desire for a "quick-fix" for everything. Which DVD should I get? What are all the sources to learn this? Etc...

To me, and maybe I'm just being a snob, but it demonstrates a certain laziness and lack of seriousness. There's nothing wrong with an honest inquiry on certain things, but you're also missing out on the growth in your study that only comes through personal discovery. I remember when I was first starting out, the only source I really had was the bookstore and local library. I wanted to learn gambling moves but didn't really find any books that were instructional. I didn't even know there were tapes on the subject. But after reading so many books you start to find other sources and you're eventually led to the right direction. Hopefully you've learned a thing or two along the way.

Same goes with your practice. "How do I improve this? What do I do here?" These are all the types of questions you can answer yourself. Watch, learn, figure it out on your own, and you'll be amazed at what you produce. Show a sincere interest and you'll gain the confidence of the people you'll want to guide you.

In other words, research is one of the primary components of your study. If you're expecting to be given all the work on a silver platter you're just setting yourself up for mediocrity. What's the old line? It's the journey, not the destination.


Mr. Z, does the "Z" stand for "zen"? Because that post was spot on. From what I've seen of your work via this forum, I'm don't have half your gambling move chops (and that's being charitable to me) and I'm sure you don't need me to tell you that. But even from my section of the peanut gallery, you nailed it.

Permit me to echo what you said with an example. About two years ago I started to reconstruct (for lack of a better term) my bottom deal. I was unsatisfied with certain aspects of it so I basically started relearning it from the ground up. At the risk of sounding overly-philosophical the "journey" this took me on not only improved my bottom deal, but made me re-examine several other moves as well. This was a journey that only began with research and books. It continued with hours of sitting at the table with a mirror constantly trying to figure out how to make it look the way it should. The books were maybe 5% (if that) of the work.

Respectfully,

DD


I can't count how many times I've had to "re-learn" certain moves. I've been re-learning one in particular for 9 months now, ha.

The books and tapes just give you the basic blueprint. The rest is all you. I've always done a lot of riffle stacking work and the amount of work on it in print is near zero. When I first started working on it I'd just practice Darwin Ortiz's Fast Shuffle routine. Then over the years I just tinkered away at it myself.
"...if you have to say you is, you ain't."--Jimmy Hoffa
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