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Keith Mitchell
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I am about to receive a brand new set of cups from RNT-II, they will be my first set of expensive cups.

They are RNT-II mini Jester Cups in Polished Copper. Will they tarnish? If so how do I clean them, do I have to clean them, or should I allow them to tarnesh?

When stacking the cups should I be careful? What I have seen with other magicians on DVDs is that they are not gentle when stacking their cups. Not sure at all about the wear and tear of using these cups.

Right now I am watching a DVD "The C&B A Practical Approach" by Bob White and have no clue to what he is saying because of my deafness. I am missing everything he says and I am going to have to hire an SL Interpreter. I can see with my eyes that he is going in dept about the different cups and balls, and I just wish I knew what he was saying.

I would appreciate any help with this.
Thank you
Keith
Bill Palmer
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I haven't gotten my mini-jester cups yet, but if they are like any of Jake's other cups, they will be excellent. Jake generally doesn't clear coat his normal copper cups, so they will probably tarnish.

There are two schools of thought on tarnish. Some say to keep the cups shiny and new -- Bob White feels this way. Others feel that you should let them turn a nice, deep brown. I lean in this direction, for the most part. As far as the cups in my museum -- well, I leave them as they are when I get them, unless they have corrosion or some other problem that must be remediated to prevent further damage to the cups.

When it comes to handling the cups, just don't beat them up. You don't have to be careful stacking and unstacking them, but avoid dropping them on the floor or using them as a place to put a board in order to reach a high shelf! Smile
"The Swatter"

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Pete Biro
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I would suggest getting a book to read for the routines. The key is to get comfortable handling the cups and the balls, learning the basic passes and loads.
Cups are meant to be used and the little wear and tear on them adds to the look IMHO. You can let them tarnish for an antique/older look, or shine 'em up as often as you like. It is a matter of personal taste. I like my copper cups to look as OLD as they can.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Keith Mitchell
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I like the old look as well, hoping that it would look cooler if it had that special look.

Bill Palmer, I cannot imagine you having to polish all those cups in your museum.

Thanks guys.
walid ahumada
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IMHO if you are wearing tuxedo or just a nice suit you should have a nice polished cups, however if you are working the streets or any informal performance I would choose tarnished cups.

walid
“Magic becomes art when it has nothing to hide.” BEN OKRI quote
Christopher Moro
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It's true, nice polished cups look great with a nice tux or suit. At the same time though, I wear a suit and my cups are patinized with a dark brown. Since the cups are metal, they still shine, and it works very well with what I wear. So I think it goes both ways.
Bill Palmer
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There is no hard and fast rule for what your cups should look like. If there were, then nobody would have to ask the question.

Johnny Ace Palmer used to polish his cups every afternoon. He said it was part of his performing ritual.
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
pepka
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Some materials look better with a patina than others. My copper Riser standard cups have a beautiful patina and I'd never polish them. My engraved Sherwoods however, do get a light polish with a silver cloth once a week or so. Of course, they don't get used every day, but when I do take them out, they look like a million bucks. I've never been a big fan of brass cups, except for the way they sound. Brass seems to look better polished. I do have a set of brass Jes cups on the way and I imagine that they'll stay polished.
lint
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Waiting on my jesters too. cant wait to get em.

-todd
"There's many a slip 'twixt the cup and the lip..." -English Proverb
Keith Mitchell
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There is something interesting about the name "Jester," hopefully it'll bring me lots of luck.

Oh man, I wish I had them now!
Bill Palmer
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BTW, sometimes brass does patinize nicely. Take a look at the third set of cups from the bottom of either of these pages:
http://www.cupsandballsmuseum.org/museum/earlycupsdu.htm
http://www.cupsandballsmuseum.org/museum/earlycups.htm
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
pepka
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Why does some look different than others. Most copper cups with a patina seem to look the same to me. Could it be a different kind of brass? Environmental issues depending on where you live?

My Johnson cups really looked like crap if not polished once in a while.
kentfgunn
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The reason I don't polish my brass cups is due to something Al Schneider wrote. He said he'd been busted by people who saw palmed balls in his hands reflecting off his shiny cups. After that he let the patina build up.

I think his point is worth considering. If you've engraved cups they don't reflect an image.

So send Brett Sherwood a bunch of money if you want to work with shiny cups!!!

Kent
Bill Palmer
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Brass cups patinize in a really odd way. They start out looking kind of greenish, which on brass, looks like dirt. Then, after a couple of months, they begin to take on a nice, almost statuary-like patina.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Christopher Moro
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That brass patina looks great, Bill. -- I've noticed the same, Kent. Guys who use shiny cups have to be more careful than the guys using patinated cups. When I used my first metal set in aluminum , I adjusted how my hand came up to the bottom of a cup to lift it, so that there'd be no visible reflection.

Now I use tarnished copper cups.
Mad Jake
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Care of brass and copper, even chrome is a simple process. I have numerous sets in silver and 24kt gold plate I've made for myself and others. They can be a bit more tricky.

A recent problem I've run into is my mortgage investment that I was told was a sound one by Brett Sherwood's website statements has turned into anything but. All my gold plated cups by him are turning black. Meaning the tarnish from the silver or a foriegn alloy is destroying the gold plate, which leads to another question, are these really gold plated or stained? It appears that in one section of Brett's site he says their gold washed, very very thin process, usually applied with a cotton cloth, but then he says in another part of his site the gold is substantial electroplate.

For investments of 1600+ for anything gold plated on the Sherwood cups this problem is unacceptable. I have written Brett 5x on this issue none of which he has replied to in regards to correcting. Those familiar with RNT II plating can tell you our silver tarnish does not bleed through our 24kt pure gold plate. Our plater confirmed that the cups are stained, not really plated.

Bretts suggestion of polishing them lightly results in the removal of the Gold that is there, so I don't recommend doing it. I've had numerous contacts with our customers who have had the same problem with their Sherwoods

With no response from Brett and based on his investment stratagy on his website bolstering his cups as an investment, you may want to consider investing in Junk Bonds instead. I'm sure the Vernon Estate would not be happy that this is happennig since they are attatched to Brett and back him, nor his willingness to accept responsibility in a serious production issue.

Jake
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
pepka
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Good to see you back Jake, hope you're doing a bit better. That is disturbing news though. That's the first I've heard ANYTHING (other than price increases) negative about Brett's cups. I only own the silver engraved and am more than satisfied. I'm very curious to see how this situation turns out.
Mad Jake
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Pepka,
the silver cups are fine, tarnishing is expected, but when you have numerous sets in gold plate or supposive gold plate and the gold turns black, there's an issue. Especially when there appears to be no interest in solving this investment problem they push on the site.

Thanks for the welcome back. I just finished up my last treatment, so we'll see how it goes from here.

Best
Jake
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
Mike McErlain
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Yikes! I've got silver sherwoods, which I love. I have gold plated Owen Cups. Has anyone heard if similar concerns may exist with those?
Maybe it's time to dig them out and see if they're turning black!

Jake, so happy to see you up and around!
I wish you continued improving health.
Mike
Mad Jake
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Thanks Mike!

I have the gold Owens as well. Our plater silvers over copper then gold plates if the material is not silver to start with. But again, if plated correctly and not stained or washed the the air will not reach the silver underlying and cause oxidation, so nothing will turn the gold.

I've had a set of the Anniv. Owens and they're doing great. However every Sherwood I own that has gold on it, the silver tarnish which can get ugly is showing right through. A pure 24kt gold plate, should be very resiliant and rich in color. A stain or a wash is rather dull compared.
For quality Paul Fox Cups spun on Danny Dew's Paul Fox tooling visit us at www.airshipmagic.com
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