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Darth Ewok
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I posted this in another section, but this is my fav section of the Café and I wanted to share:

I just bought a book at a garage sale for one dollar. its one I've not seen before.
its called: "Magic: stage illusions, special effects, and trick photography" compiled and edited by Albert A. Hopkins

this edition was published by Dover publications in 1976, but it says its an "unabridged and unaltered republication of the work originally published by Munn & Co., publishers, scientific American ofice, new york, in 1898 under the title Magic:Stage illusions and Scientific Diversions, Including Trick Photography"

heres a pic of the cover: http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh286......book.jpg

I've never heard of this book before. I bought it because Keller was on the cover. lol. it actually has information on Torrini. says his real name was Comte de Grisi

some GREAT history in this book! even a big section on temple magic from Eygpt and greece. I cant wait to read it
my real name is Kevin Harrison

http://www.myspace.com/magicalclerk
Bill Palmer
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This book is historically more significant than most people know. When Bev Bergeron was working with Mark Wilson, Walt Disney was looking for some ideas for the new amusement park he was planning called "Disney Land."

He borrowed the book from Bev. A few weeks later, it was returned to Bev by courier, insured for something like $1500.00. I have seen the invoice and Bev's copy.

So, when Bev was working for Disney World, the board of directors was braying about all of the "new" and "different" ideas they had at the park. Bev said, "You guys don't know what 'new' is! Most of this stuff is at least 75 years old."

They thought he was nuts. So he brought the book and the receipt to the B.O.D. and showed them the upside down room and a bunch of the other stuff. One of them said, "We must destroy this book!!"

Bev said, "Good luck. There are thousands of copies out there. Dover reprinted it years ago."
"The Swatter"

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My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

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pepka
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I have a copy I picked up at a library sale about 12 years ago. I believe I paid the princely sum of $3.00. Knowing me, it was probably marked at $5 and I talked'em down. This is a very fascinating read.
Pete Biro
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Especially the vanishing elephant statue.
STAY TOONED... @ www.pete-biro.com
Bill Palmer
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That one is particularly clever. Not that we could do that these days.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Mr. Muggle
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Thanks for the history lesson Bill...that was an interesting story!
"Now you're looking for the secret... but you won't find it because you're not really looking. You don't really want to know the secret... You want to be fooled." - The Prestige (2006)
Darth Ewok
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Well I'm loving it so far. theres a lot of history just in the introduction. I even saw a picture of what looked like a dekolta chair in there.

I cant put this book down. you guys got any suggestions for other good reads I should check out? I love magic history
my real name is Kevin Harrison

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Bill Palmer
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Finish this one first. Pay close attention to the construction of the Bayreuth opera house, which is near the back of the book. The dragon is particularly interesting.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
kentfgunn
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Bill,

You know entirely too much about too many topics.
Darth Ewok
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Ask him about banjos sometime
my real name is Kevin Harrison

http://www.myspace.com/magicalclerk
Bill Palmer
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This is one of my favorite books.

Okay. Next book -- Secrets of Stage Conjuring by Robert-Houdin.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
fortasse
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Clarke's "Annals of Conjuring".......(the Miracle Factory edition).

Fortasse
Bill Palmer
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I'm not nuts about either of the editions of Clarke. I have the old one. Clarke assembled a lot of errors. There is some factual material there, but Clarke was one of the people who believed that the Beni Hasan material was about cups and balls.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
fortasse
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Did Clarke actually say that? I don't have the original edition, only the newer one (published by the Magic Factory) in which there is no mention of the Beni Hassan mural in the text attributed to Clarke, only a print of it with the rather ambiguous caption "Ancient Egyptian Amusement". The only reference I could find in the actual text of Clarke's work to cups and balls in ancient Egypt was a single line : "The Cups and Balls trick was popular many centuries ago in Egypt, Greece and Rome...". That's it. However, in the notes to this section, the modern editors state :"Clarke included the tomb illustration from Beni Hassan, Egypt, as an example of an ancient performance of the cups and balls". I would be very interested in knowing for certain whether the caption for the illustration in the original "Annals of Conjuring" does indeed suggest that it shows a performance of cups and balls.

Fortasse

Posted: Mar 21, 2008 3:44pm
I should have added, of course, that the suggestion that the ancient mural shows a performance of C&B has been thoroughly debunked. Much more likely, according to modern scholars, that the two chaps were simply baking bread!

Fortasse
lint
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Don't forget the updated version of "An Illustrated History of Magic". I read this book as a child and it is what got me interested in magic. I fell out of interest with magic for about 10 years and picked up the revised reprint about 3 years ago. What a delight to reread it! Now I am knee deep in cups & balls information...

-todd
"There's many a slip 'twixt the cup and the lip..." -English Proverb
Bill Palmer
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The Annals of Conjuring was originally a series published in The Magic Wand

When David Meyer assembled all of the issues, they retained their original pagination in the upper left/upper right corners, but David inserted new page numbers at the bottoms of the pages. So, on page 8 of the Meyer edition, is the famous Beni Hasan sketch with the caption below "Cups and Balls in Ancient Egypt."

If Todd Karr edited that out, shame on him.

Posted: Mar 22, 2008 2:46am
The Illustrated History of Magic, while a fairly decent overview of magic, is, in my opinion, more of a coffee table book than a serious historical overview. Milbourne Christopher had a huge library, but often used speculation, rather than accurate historical reference, in this book.

Two of his classic faux pas (whatever the plural of that is!) involved Ancient Egyptian magic. One was that the Westcar Papyrus was lost. It wasn't lost. It was in the Egyptological Museum in East Berlin. The other was a complete mixup about the Beni Hasan material. Somehow, he had no idea where Beni Hasan was, and assumed that it had been submerged by the Aswan Dam project. He was wrong.

So, with the Christopher material, for me it's "trust (not) and verify."

In favor of this book, however, I will say that the material from about 1800 on is fairly accurate.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
fortasse
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Speaking of C&B history, the best overview of the historical development of C&B that I've ever read is Victor Farelli's introduction to "John Ramsay's Routine with Cups & Balls" (1948, London. Meticulously researched and succintly presented.

Fortasse
Bill Palmer
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That is absolutely true.

A lot of the old historians, as you well know, would take an out of context quote from someone, and turn it into an historical fact. Remember all the controversy from a few years back over the authorship of the "Cremer" material. Some of that was based on H. Adrian Smith listening only long enough to get a name, then assuming that the material fit the time frame.

It didn't.

One of the results -- your wonderful treatise on the French works!

Sometimes going after the facts with villain zeal results in great work.
"The Swatter"

Founder of CODBAMMC

My Chickasaw name is "Throws Money at Cups."

www.cupsandballsmuseum.com
Magnus Eisengrim
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If I recall correctly, in his book Glorious Deception Jim Steinmeyer suggests that much of the material in Magic: Stage Illusions, Special Effects, and Trick Photography was secretly sourced by William Robinson, aka Chung Ling Soo. I don't have the Steinmeyer book, so I can't check. Does anyone know

a) how solid this supposition is? or
b) if it is supported, how much material Robinson supplied? or
c) if Robinson was giving his own secrets or those of his competitors?

Anyways, enjoy the Hopkins book. It is a very interesting volume.

John
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.--Yeats
fortasse
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Thanks for the compliment, Bill. Much appreciated.

Happy Easter to you, and to all members of the Forum.

Fortasse
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