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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Rings, strings & things » » Ball and Tube (1 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Angelo the Magician
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I think there is a logical problem with this effect in many performances.

The ball is too big for the tube - so by magic it shrinks and now it is small enough. BUT WHEN IT IS SO SMALL IT WOULD FALL THROUGH THE WHOLE TUBE. And when it is inside, what then? If it would become bigger, then it would not be able to move, because it is fixed in the middle of the tube, it cannot rise.

So there are two effects:

1) It is too big for the tube, so I make it smaller by magic and

2) Now when it is small, I can manage it, going slowly down and up again.

So I think the performance must be with the patter: "I want to show you, how I can influence a little ball with my magic power, it will slowly go up and down. Oh, it is too big for this tube. Okay I say some magic words . . . now it will fit in the tube (and we show that it falls through the tube and appears on the other side). And at the end I will show you my magic influence." (The ball sinks slowly and rises again)

Angelo
magicians
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Quote:
On 2008-08-27 15:01, Angelo the Magician wrote:

The ball is too big for the tube - so by magic it shrinks and now it is small enough. BUT WHEN IT IS SO SMALL IT WOULD FALL THROUGH THE WHOLE TUBE. And when it is inside, what then? If it would become bigger, then it would not be able to move, because it is fixed in the middle of the tube, it cannot rise.

Angelo

In earlier posts, I explain and give the short video of the ball going into the tube and then back up, then in a consecutive move the ball does go into the tube and out the bottom.
The DVD on the Ball and Tube, along with subleties and rationale of thinking, is almost done. It is in edit as we speak. Should anyone have their take or routine that we could add to the DVD, I would gladly do so. You will be in good company, Mike Tannen, Roy Fromer, Walter Gibson, Bob Olsen, and others.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Jimeh
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I'm looking forward to this. Thanks for the update Ian!
Lawrence O
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Quote:
On 2008-07-22 12:30, magicians wrote:
Well, Walt, I search this site endlessly ... took an innocuous puzzle and decided to do it justice by using my own techniques as a base then adding contributions from Bob Olsen, Al Cohen, Roy Fromer and Walter Gibson, to name a few...


I bought your little book but could not find the effect credited to Al Cohen.

Could you just indicate me the page number? Maybe I smoke the carpet again...
Magic is the art of proving impossible things in parallel dimensions that can't be reached
dcjames
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My vote is for the original ball and tube as well.

The locking set is thick and appears gimmicked even to the unsuspecting. The sheer thinness of the original set makes the effect appear completely impossible.
“Magic is very easy to do - poorly.”

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Rudy
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Is there any more information on the Ball and Tube DVD.

Thank you.
nonvpro
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I'm also interested in the Ball and Tube DVD.
Detlef
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I`m also interested.
Regards
Detlef
nonvpro
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Very interesting thread. Think I might dig out my old Ball & tube and revisit it.
TC Ryder
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Love the Ball and Tube. Been doing it for years. Magic Ian is the Ball and Tube King. I would love to get the DVD as well.

Thanks Magic Ian I read your book and have taken the Ball and Tube to the next level.

Cheers!!

TC
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Q&A
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Thanks for the video and clearing up the origins of the your handling of the ball & tube. I also appears that you have a impressive singing voice....love your take on the song "Windmills of Your Mind". Look forward to picking up a copy of your honestly priced ball & vase routine.
MarvinWang
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Interesting video, thanks for sharing.
Callisto
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Magic Ian offer for ball & tube + booklet is very interesting... don't miss it !
Dougini
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 10:20, Lawrence O wrote:
Maybe I've been smoking the carpet again...


Ha haa! Mr. "O", there are much better substances than carpet...(woo-WEE)...ahem!

Ah,yes...the little ball and tube. One of the very first tricks I ever bought. I remember it well, about April or May of 1970, The Magic Shop at DisneyLand in Calif...

I bought the Nickles to Dimes trick that same day...the MEMORIES!

And now, I find all this, and a BOOK by Magic Ian! I'm going to have to investigate this further...thank you for this topic!

Doug
magicians
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Quote:
I- bought your little book but could not find the effect credited to Al Cohen.

Could you just indicate me the page number? Maybe I smoke the carpet again...

I was in such a habit of name dropping, I confused the
booklets. Al Cohen is in my "Best Dam Tricks" booklet, not the ball and tube.
----------------
Trivia: Back when I wrote the booklet, it took a year to edit (BC- before computers).
We used compugraphic to edit with more typo edits after that). I contacted many contributors, some kept their routines proprietory.
The first 5000 booklets I sold, had photos from the Al Flosso museum plus stories about Danny Tsukalis, the Macy's demonstrator.
When I sold the booklet to Robbins, they condensed it and kept only the effects.
I fashioned the book with short paragraphs rather than patter routines. It was the popular way to do an accessory booklet back then. I would expand it and weed out a bit of the
oddity effects, if I wrote it today.
I love the cover art, an original hand drawing by Ed Mishel. He did it on a 30 x 50 poster using India ink. I also spent a lot of money to print it with a silver cover.
--------------
Some of the booklets intro, and the "ad cuts", were used by another "ball and tube" author without credit or permission. I will be curious to see if the "other guys" DVD has my effects as well.
--------------
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
Bob Sanders
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Magic Ian,

This effect is what started me carrying index cards in my shirt pocket many, many years ago. I still do!

Bob Sanders
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Christopher Rinaldi
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As for the E-ZMagic version I hafta say it probably is the best for only a few excellent reasons.

First, more natural handling.

Second, more innocent props.

Third, easier to control.

Fourth, teaches one the necesity to learn misdirection and palming.

5th...it is a cheap little piece of magic when it comes to the pocket book.

I haven't had one of these for many years I'll admit, but I will relate this little story to all of you...

I had some very simple props, some of which may have been considered slum magic. However I proceeded to weave a story of my life to an innocent lady that didn't know me. My story began with me being on the run from the law which I was. The reason being I had mental powers and was a wanted fugitive...which really wasn't very far from the truth at the time.

Basically I wove a story about having powers inherited from extraterestrianals, having been abducted and all and as a result I was hunted by CIA...it really was the FBI but what is this lady gonna know right, they hadn't qeustioned her yet right?

By the end of my little story I performed the silly little old cheap steel ball & tube to demonstrate to her what I was aying was true...well this lady flipped out man I mean really freaked, she was crying and didn't even want to be around me ever again.

I refuse to let you all know what eventually happened to her but I learned to never again use my knowledge and skills in the arts of deception to blindly fool an innocent person with somewhat obvious mental problems.
magicians
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Quote:
On 2009-10-27 00:34, Christopher Rinaldi wrote:
As for the E-ZMagic version I hafta say it probably is the best for only a few excellent reasons.

First, more natural handling.

Second, more innocent props.

Third, easier to control.

Fourth, teaches one the necesity to learn misdirection and palming.

5th...it is a cheap little piece of magic when it comes to the pocket book.

I haven't had one of these for many years I'll admit, but I will relate this little story to all of you...

I had some very simple props, some of which may have been considered slum magic. However I proceeded to weave a story of my life to an innocent lady that didn't know me. My story began with me being on the run from the law which I was. The reason being I had mental powers and was a wanted fugitive...which really wasn't very far from the truth at the time.

Basically I wove a story about having powers inherited from extraterestrianals, having been abducted and all and as a result I was hunted by CIA...it really was the FBI but what is this lady gonna know right, they hadn't qeustioned her yet right?

By the end of my little story I performed the silly little old cheap steel ball & tube to demonstrate to her what I was aying was true...well this lady flipped out man I mean really freaked, she was crying and didn't even want to be around me ever again.

I refuse to let you all know what eventually happened to her but I learned to never again use my knowledge and skills in the arts of deception to blindly fool an innocent person with somewhat obvious mental problems.


Along those lines of performance, it is most likely the reason for the Hilford popularity. The booklet he put together is plagiaristic in layout and technique, yet I understand that his performances using the ball and tube in a serious vein is compelling. If this effect is to rise from puzzle to "vehicle" of your serious magic, it requires drama.
One of the things I seriously lacked in my booklet is to draw the effect out with patter and performance. In 1979 when I was just a pup, I was more concerned with innovation and technique than patter.
I must admit, that the original handling of the ball and tube as shown in the short paragraph included in the ez-magic box, I had thought to be unworkable. In actuality, the simple tilt of the ball and tube towards the spectator which allows them to stare into the apparatus and thus hide the finger movement, has redeeming value which I used to discount.
Back on point, since the apparatus is so small, the ball and tube winds up being a one on one affect. If you are into macabre, bizarre or hypnotic patter, the b&t requires a strong, serious performance.
My booklet deals with the mechanical and versatility of the trick. I only set the tone of my performance with the premise that I have metaphysical powers over the size of the ball or the tube and its movement.
The holdup on the DVD is the dilemma of whether to show the dramatic side of performance. The serious approach to this effect requires perhaps the patter of a Ron Dayton, or Hilford.
The techniques shown on the DVD, are the quirks and moves I devised 30 years ago (my second booklet). I was a showman and huckster back then, now I am an actor and magician, but I still hesitate as to whether to perform or demonstrate.
I think I will attempt a serious vignette with a few of the moves.
--------
I would like to show the simple modifications using wax, water and fire in a routine which I have never performed, only demonstrated to a select few. But, keeping it simple, the B&t is compelling on its own.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
funsway
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I purchased a copy of this booklet (and the Ball&Tube) to honor the creativity, and perhaps a bit of guilt over many tricks abandoned years ago that are worthy of review and revitalization. Every day we see posts from someone seeking something new, and also post about everyone's drawer full of junk. Using Juan Tamariz model, IAN took the Skeleton of a simple trick and gave it Flesh, leaving it to the performer to add the Clothing and Make-up. Now,apparently, someone else is trying to add the Cloths also and charging a lot for the effort. Sad!

Not that he would plagerize in this manner -- but that magicians will buy it and miss out on the best part of magic -- making something uniquely their own.

Thanks for the reminder, Ian!
"the more one pretends at magic, the more awe and wonder will be found in real life." Arnold Furst

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magicians
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You know, I sold the rights to the booklet to Robbins about 10 years ago. When he printed it, I insisted on the original cover and artwork, however, he shortened my 32 pages to 28. What was deleted was some history, and articles about Danny Tsukalos the "Macy's demonstrator, and Jackie Flossos ball and tube collection (photos) of the showcases.
I am glad you liked your copy, I don't understand the Tamariz reference, but I do like the analysis of giving the trick flesh and letting the performer dress it up.
The plagiarism of my competitor is there for the viewing. It was only annoying when magi's purchase it at $20 and I get my lowly $3. Pricing was deliberate. I always felt the accessory booklets should always cost less than the effect.
That did leave me between a rock and a hard place, as a silver cover raised the cost quite a bit. You can, however, always spot my booklet on the magic shelf.
-------------
My first booklet "Best Dam Tricks" had a crisp pure white cover (white on white), which also made it stand out.
I can't wait to finish the DVD.
------------------
I have another booklet which I only printed a few copies of. I sell it as a PDF download instead. "Haunted Deck: Book Of Revelations" has 62 routines and methods for using the Haunted deck.
Illusionist, Illusionist consulting, product development, stage consultant, seasoned performer for over 35 years. Specializing in original effects. Highly opinionated, usually correct, and not afraid of jealous critics. I've been a puppet, a pirate, a pawn and a King. Free lance gynecologist.
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