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Aaron Little Loyal user Lexington KY 263 Posts |
Let’s say I produce a DVD teaching my unique way to set up and finish an XYZ choke in a Mixed Martial Arts environment. I have spent years developing this and it is unique to me. The marketing for the DVD makes no mention of usage limitations. Would a purchaser not have an expectation of being able to use said choke in competition? If the purchaser done well for himself and earned a spot on a large pay per view show should I be able to then tell him, “Oh, by the way, you cannot use the choke I created and sold to you on TV”? Of course not. He bought the instructional with the expectation of being able to use the skill and unless I warned him ahead of time…that is the way I sold it to him.
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jstone Inner circle Someday I'll have 1473 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-07-22 02:08, Aaron Little wrote: You can't go wrong with ninja analogies! I believe that this conversation is over. We must all submit to your ninja choke-hold and hope that nobody is filming us. |
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Aaron Little Loyal user Lexington KY 263 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 02:22, jstone wrote: Now that is funny. I needed that. Thanks. |
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Paul Shirley Inner circle Melbourne, Australia 1206 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 01:50, jstone wrote: We must be related somehow mate.... us Shirley's LOVE hammering a point home!! ha. Back to the 'Hammering' Playing chess on TV using info from a book... and presenting the books content on TV as your own knowledge are 2 different things.... the latter does not compare to exposing an effects workings.... it does however compare to receiving credit for an effect you performed on TV ... wether it was your effect or not. Its just the nature of magic. Someone else's work yet .... the performer receives the gasps, applause and kudos. Which is fine.... IF the creator allows it. The 'definitive' way of performing magic IS actually decided every time you choose the effect you wish to perform. The term 'Definitive' being relevant, and at the mercy of, the level of performer you are, the knowledge you have, experience etc..... I only perform effects that I think ARE the best available. Now, my idea of the 'Best effects available' changes all the time as I am constantly learning. If you are asked to perform a spot on Conan... you will naturally choose the best effect you know, at the time, to show case your talent to the world..... if that effect happens to be someone else's then I believe the creator deserves the courtesy of being asked for the right to perform his creation. T.V can change an effects value in the community. And this is primarily what this thread is about... TV rights. How many effects are on the 'Do not buy' list purely because Criss Angel has made them famous.... great effects but, they become too popular.... the effect is discussed and revealed 1000 times on youtube and becomes useless to anyone other than kids performing tricks at school. The originator of the effect should retain the TV rights because of the major impact it can potentially make on the effect... and OUR community. And.... as the lucky purchasers of many of these fine contributions to our art we should be HAPPY to let the creator do so. If we could all agree on this very simple notion imagine how much more freely some of our information would flow through our community. No one would be scared of releasing effects because the notion of respect and deserved dues being paid would just be expected. |
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Paul Shirley Inner circle Melbourne, Australia 1206 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 02:22, jstone wrote: Yeah??, I actually DID use your XYZ choke and still got my ass kicked. I want my money back. Oh, BTW, may wanna clean your Ghee before shooting the next instructional DVD... those mysterious stains are NASTY. Seriously folks.... My mention of the 'Arts' did NOT assume to include MARTIAL! |
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R Gould Regular user 193 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 01:53, TT2 wrote: I didn't ask to see you perform, Jerome. Let me know how your performing life works out for you if you insist on deciding whom to perform around. You'll probably keep a whole lot of secrets hiding it under that little bushel. |
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Aaron Little Loyal user Lexington KY 263 Posts |
I am rather new to this world and I realize that my view is skewed. The more that I read here at the café the more I realize that the magic world is much different than I ever realized as an outsider.
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Paul Shirley Inner circle Melbourne, Australia 1206 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 03:05, R Gould wrote: What? Like the copy of Jerome's 'Thought Dial' that you wanted to buy ?? I get the feeling that Jerome's performing life is gonna work out just fine. |
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Paul Shirley Inner circle Melbourne, Australia 1206 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 03:13, Aaron Little wrote: Hey Aaron This isn't a loaded question but... how is the magic world different to what you imagined? Keen to hear your thoughts. |
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Rosemary Loyal user 245 Posts |
Hehe... Paul Shirley, the man who posts faster than his shadow!
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LukeB Loyal user 294 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 01:38, Aaron Little wrote: |
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LukeB Loyal user 294 Posts |
Oops.
I agree with Aaron here.But Paul has a valid point. I don't however, object to upfront asking for a higher fee to perform on tv. If I create an effect and I sell it I want to see it go far..to vegas and the castle hopefully. |
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Paul Shirley Inner circle Melbourne, Australia 1206 Posts |
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On 2008-07-22 03:59, Rosemary wrote: Ha Yeah, my shadow isn't much of a typer.... and isn't in bed with the flu.... thank god for my laptop! |
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DT3 Inner circle Hill Valley 1920 Posts |
"What does Armando Lucero do?"
For the record I now have "WWAD" bracelets available for sale at $9.99 usd apiece. But you are not allowed to wear them on T.V. DT3 |
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Dynamike Eternal Order FullTimer 24148 Posts |
Rosemary, I am now convinced.
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jstone Inner circle Someday I'll have 1473 Posts |
Quote:
On 2008-07-22 03:59, Rosemary wrote: He's a ninja... watch out for that choke-hold. Quote:
On 2008-07-22 06:41, Paul Shirley wrote: Same here... my laptop dies... I die! Thank God for Carbonite.com. I've also noticed that when I'm in bed sick, my post count goes waaaaay up... Although, I haven't been sick for almost 3 years now, other than that pesky diabetes thing... My last few days, I've been posting like a madman because I'm trying to move from "Special User" to "Inner Circle." I'm just not to keen on being called a "Special User." |
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Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
"Shouldn't we just KNOW the same way we do for other arts and media?"
In the case of magic and related art forms,it would require a whole new mindset and learning curve; one that rewrites the entire history and expectations of the creator-dealer-customer dynamic. Personally, I think the additional paranoid red tape would damage the magic dealer business, at least in the short term. If I were bound up by the prospect of creator's contract red tape, I would buy NO new effects. I would simply dust off old, "pre-performance-law" effects as well as invent new effects of my own and keep them to myself.
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
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jstone Inner circle Someday I'll have 1473 Posts |
Steve,
Good point... I prefer the "sharing" side of things. I live in the States, and I've received emails from magicians in japan, korea, portugal and other places telling me that they performed one of my effects "the other night at the club and it killed." I love that. Of course, it's a huge ego boost, but at the same time a magician somewhere on the other side of the planet is being inspired. That's just cool. |
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Douglas Lippert Inner circle E Pluribus Unum 2343 Posts |
How about...we all set a goal to create our own "good" and "original" effects in our lifetime.
Then, when we die we can say we gave back to magic AND most importantly..for this thread. -did not have to worry about t.v. rights.
Douglas Lippert
Former I.B.M. Ring #8 Secretary |
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Steve_Mollett Inner circle Eh, so I've made 3006 Posts |
Capital!
In the meantime, feel free to use the escapes in my recent book freely, on TV or off; I'll just be honored to know they are being performed: http://www.cannonsgreatescapes.com/Shopp......ase.html :handcuffs:
Author of: GARROTE ESCAPES
The absurd is the essential concept and the first truth. - Albert Camus |
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