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Jimeh
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My worst fear is anything that smacks of the 'Anyone see the movie "Religulous"?' thread...
Josh Riel
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So.... Did you see the movie Religulous?
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
Jimeh
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Don't start..... Smile
gaddy
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When the movie just came out I posted about it, but then within 10 minutes or so I remembered just who would jump into such a conversation and suggest that the Mods remove the thread, which they did rather quickly! (almost too quickly? Hmmm....)

Looks like my fears were justified in that particular instance...
*due to The Magic Cafe's editorial policies, words on this site attributed to me cannot necessarily be held to be my own.*
Josh the Superfluous
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The man of
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You won't feel that way when Carrie Sue and Payne announce their engagement.
What do you want in a site? "Honesty, integrity and decency." -Mike Doogan
"I hate it, I hate my ironic lovechild. I didn't even have anything to do with it" Josh #2
Kevvy
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 17:21, Carrie Sue wrote:

It appears that more people (especially black people) chose their President based on the color of a man's skin and not the content of his character. He's the Affirmative Action President. Don't worry whether he's qualified for the job. He's black, so we want him.


If that were true, Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton would have been more successful in their presidential bids. Most black people did not vote for either of them and their campaigns went nowhere fast.
Most black people vote democratic. So if Hillary Clinton had been the democratic nominee, she would have received the majority of the black vote. I think more black people would have voted for her even if her opponent was a black republican like Alan Keyes or someone like Clarence Thomas.

Affirmative Action President??

Please.

If there was ever a classic recipient of affirmative action, it was Sarah Palin. She definitely wasn't qualified to be VP. At first, it appeared she would tip the balance in McCain's favor. But in less than one month, she clearly demonstrated that she was completely out of her league. Mitt Romney or Condolezza Rice would have proven to be qualified and competent running mates.

One fear that a lot of people had was the possibility of Sarah Palin becoming president if something were to happen to McCain.
BTW, gender is irrelevant. I'm sure Hillary Clinton or Condolezza Rice could handle the task of being president.

The presidency wasn't given to Obama. That is not how Presidents are elected.

People of various races voted for him - In the primaries as well as the general election...And yes, that includes a LOT of white people. In fact, the black vote alone would not have been enough.

Quote:
And before anyone calls me a racist, I would just like to add that I voted for Alan Keyes twice in Presidential primaries.


Obama trounced Keyes in the 2004 Illinois Senate race.

Had Keyes been the republican candidate president, Obama would likely have beat him again.
Tom Bartlett
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 23:58, Kevvy wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-06 17:21, Carrie Sue wrote:

It appears that more people (especially black people) chose their President based on the color of a man's skin and not the content of his character. He's the Affirmative Action President. Don't worry whether he's qualified for the job. He's black, so we want him.


If that were true, Jessie Jackson and Al Sharpton would have been more successful in their presidential bids. Most black people did not vote for either of them and their campaigns went nowhere fast.
Most black people vote democratic. So if Hillary Clinton had been the democratic nominee, she would have received the majority of the black vote. I think more black people would have voted for her even if her opponent was a black republican like Alan Keyes or someone like Clarence Thomas.

Affirmative Action President??

Please.

If there was ever a classic recipient of affirmative action, it was Sarah Palin. She definitely wasn't qualified to be VP. At first, it appeared she would tip the balance in McCain's favor. But in less than one month, she clearly demonstrated that she was completely out of her league. Mitt Romney or Condolezza Rice would have proven to be qualified and competent running mates.

One fear that a lot of people had was the possibility of Sarah Palin becoming president if something were to happen to McCain.
BTW, gender is irrelevant. I'm sure Hillary Clinton or Condolezza Rice could handle the task of being president.

The presidency wasn't given to Obama. That is not how Presidents are elected.

People of various races voted for him - In the primaries as well as the general election...And yes, that includes a LOT of white people. In fact, the black vote alone would not have been enough.

Quote:
And before anyone calls me a racist, I would just like to add that I voted for Alan Keyes twice in Presidential primaries.


Obama trounced Keyes in the 2004 Illinois Senate race.

Had Keyes been the republican candidate president, Obama would likely have beat him again.


Great post the only thing I disagree on is Sarah Palin I think she was the only reason McCain did as well as he did.
Our friends don't have to agree with me about everything and some that I hold very dear don't have to agree about anything, except where we are going to meet them for dinner.
EsnRedshirt
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 21:40, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-06 21:18, kcg5 wrote:
And I am *** proud of it.

What does it say about our country when a mans election causes dancing in the streets? ( by all races)


kevin


Let's see...of every 200 eligible voters, about 75 stayed home, 65 voted for Obama, 58 voted for McCain, and 2 voted for someone else. Yup, it's a mandate!

LobowolfXXX- if you don't bother to vote, you don't count.
That's exactly how it works.

Carrie Sue- Black voter turnout made up 13% of the voters, compared to 11% in 2004. That's a scant 2% increase (in a population that is already very politically active.) Obama won by 6 points- the victory cannot be attributed to black voters alone. Take a look at the exit polls sometime, you may find them interesting. Obama won the majority of votes from every demographic except for white males.

I'm an optimist- I'd like to think that skin color was not at all a factor in this election. However, at least one poll has stated that for at least 20% of the population, it was, in fact, an issue. (But regardless, of those 20% who said it was an issue, at least 60% still voted for Obama.) The fact of the matter is that we elected Obama in spite of his skin color, not because of it.

-Erik
Self-proclaimed Jack-of-all-trades and google expert*.

* = Take any advice from this person with a grain of salt.
Payne
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 17:21, Carrie Sue wrote:
The Gloat Factor rears its ugly head once again.

It appears that more people (especially black people) chose their President based on the color of a man's skin and not the content of his character. He's the Affirmative Action President. Don't worry whether he's qualified for the job. He's black, so we want him.

And before anyone calls me a racist, I would just like to add that I voted for Alan Keyes twice in Presidential primaries. I would love to see a black President, but one who shares my values and upholds the Constitution.

I don't have either for the next four years.

Just remember when Obama's socialist policies begin to be enacted, putting more shackles of government on the necks of the people ...

... you voted for it!

Carrie


Carrie Sue should become a Mentalist because she always seems to know what other people are thinking.

Uncanny
"America's Foremost Satirical Magician" -- Jeff McBride.
Josh Riel
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Quote:
On 2008-11-06 17:21, Carrie Sue wrote:
It appears that more people (especially black people) chose their President based on the color of a man's skin and not the content of his character.


That gets my vote for the stupidest thing I have read recently (And I read Josh #2's stuff)

All you silly white republicans chose your candidate based on crazy. But don't worry, I have republican friends so I can say whatever I want.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
Kevvy
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Quote:
On 2008-11-07 00:06, Tom Bartlett wrote:

Great post the only thing I disagree on is Sarah Palin I think she was the only reason McCain did as well as he did.


I agree that she helped him by energizing his base. I also think she could have posed a real threat to the Obama campaign if she were more qualified.

Her interviews with Katie Couric & Charles Gibson didn't help.
kcg5
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who wants four fried chickens and a coke
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That last sentence was really good josh, I mean really good.

I didn't even want to approach what Carrie said.....
Nobody expects the spanish inquisition!!!!!



"History will be kind to me, as I intend to write it"- Sir Winston Churchill
Tom Bartlett
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Quote:
On 2008-11-07 03:08, Kevvy wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-07 00:06, Tom Bartlett wrote:

Great post the only thing I disagree on is Sarah Palin I think she was the only reason McCain did as well as he did.


I agree that she helped him by energizing his base. I also think she could have posed a real threat to the Obama campaign if she were more qualified.

Her interviews with Katie Couric & Charles Gibson didn't help.


Do you feel Obama was more qualified than Palin, if so why?
Our friends don't have to agree with me about everything and some that I hold very dear don't have to agree about anything, except where we are going to meet them for dinner.
Pakar Ilusi
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He's intelligent, that's why.

Palin is not. Not yet at least.
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
Kevvy
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I agree with Pakar. Experience AND intelligence are important.

Obama spent eight years in the Illinois senate before his two years of service in the U.S. Senate. He also taught constitutional law for 10 years and was a civil rights attorney.

I think people looked beyond Palin's executive experience and realized she was in over her head. Her folksy "Hockey mom" schtick may or may not have been a bonus, but McCain needed more than that.

Look at what Bush has done with his years of experience. As the last eight years of failed Bush policies have proven, it takes a lot more than just experience to be a good president.

Dan Quayle mentioned in the '88 VP debate that he had more experience than Jack Kennedy did when he (Kennedy) sought office. And that was true, he actually did have more experience.

...But Quayle's performance as VP indicated he was no Jack Kennedy.
LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On 2008-11-07 00:12, EsnRedshirt wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-06 21:40, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-06 21:18, kcg5 wrote:
And I am *** proud of it.

What does it say about our country when a mans election causes dancing in the streets? ( by all races)


kevin


Let's see...of every 200 eligible voters, about 75 stayed home, 65 voted for Obama, 58 voted for McCain, and 2 voted for someone else. Yup, it's a mandate!

LobowolfXXX- if you don't bother to vote, you don't count.
That's exactly how it works.

Carrie Sue- Black voter turnout made up 13% of the voters, compared to 11% in 2004. That's a scant 2% increase (in a population that is already very politically active.) Obama won by 6 points- the victory cannot be attributed to black voters alone. Take a look at the exit polls sometime, you may find them interesting. Obama won the majority of votes from every demographic except for white males.

I'm an optimist- I'd like to think that skin color was not at all a factor in this election. However, at least one poll has stated that for at least 20% of the population, it was, in fact, an issue. (But regardless, of those 20% who said it was an issue, at least 60% still voted for Obama.) The fact of the matter is that we elected Obama in spite of his skin color, not because of it.

-Erik





Ummm thanks for pointing out that bit about not counting if you don't vote; I was puzzled by that. At the risk of being understood, I'll rephrase: In response to a post that suggested that most of the whole country is overjoyed that Obama won, I broke down the numbers a tad to point out that the fact is that less than 1/3 of registered voters bothered to vote for him, and just barely over half of the people who DID vote voted for him. If you glanced at a crowd of 50 voters and did a show of hands, you wouldn't be able to tell at a glance that more of them voted for him (26) than didn't (24).

Having said that, it was certainly still a decisive victory by presidential election standards, but it's not like in a country of 300 million, 200 million are rejoicing at the election results.



With respect to your math directed at Carrie's post, the fact that Obama had a 6% edge in the popular vote doesn't mean that a 2% increase in black voter turnout couldn't swing the election, as the election is decided by the electoral vote. Compare a hypothetical Obama-McCain election with Bush - Gore: Let's say everything else is the same, but Obama increased his edge by 6% in California among white voters. This would have had no effect on the election: the Democrats won all the electoral votes there anyway. Let's further say that a few thousand African American voters (FAR less than 2%) in Florida voted for him only because he was black. BAM - Obama wins the election because he's black.

I'm not saying that's what happened; I'm saying it's flawed to suggest that the 2% vs. 6% comparison proves that it didn't happen.

The increase among black voters from 11% to 13%, btw, is an 18% increase FWIW.

If at least 60% of those who said skin color was a factor favored Obama, then he didn't win "in spite of" it; it helped him. Whether it helped him enough to swing the election is another matter.

Like you, I'd like to think that it didn't (and in fact, I do think that it didn't. I think and hope that votes based on skin color largely cancelled each other out, as I'm sure they happened on both sides, and I'm sure that it wasn't a major factor for an overwhelming majority of voters).
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
LobowolfXXX
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Quote:
On 2008-11-07 11:08, Kevvy wrote:


...But Quayle's performance as VP indicated he was no Jack Kennedy.


What did Quayle do as Vice President that you found problematic?
"Torture doesn't work" lol
Guess they forgot to tell Bill Buckley.

"...as we reason and love, we are able to hope. And hope enables us to resist those things that would enslave us."
kcg5
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who wants four fried chickens and a coke
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Used an "e" to many times
Nobody expects the spanish inquisition!!!!!



"History will be kind to me, as I intend to write it"- Sir Winston Churchill
Kevvy
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Quote:
On 2008-11-07 11:41, LobowolfXXX wrote:
Quote:
On 2008-11-07 11:08, Kevvy wrote:


...But Quayle's performance as VP indicated he was no Jack Kennedy.


What did Quayle do as Vice President that you found problematic?


Although Vice Presidents are limited in their formal responsibilities, (Dick Cheney may be the exception) Quayle was widely ridiculed in both the USA and overseas as incompetent.

Like Bush & Palin, (I've heard Palin referred to as "Quaylin") Quayle had a tendency to make public statements which were either self-contradictory, logically redundant, or painfully confused and inappropriate.

The general perception of Quayle as a joke was somewhat problematic for Bush Sr.

When Bush ran for reelection in 1992, some republicans urged the president to dump Quayle from the ticket. Public opinion polls showed him to be the least popular vice president in forty years, scoring even lower than Spiro Agnew. However, Bush and his staff concluded that changing running mates would be a sign of panic and would serve as an admission that his original choice had been a mistake.
gsidhe
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My biggest fear...President Carrie.
If I need to clarify why...
Gwyd
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