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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Nothing up my sleeve... » » Classic Palm Muscle Development - how often to exercise? (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

brettsaunders
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Hi Everyone,

I've just finished watching "Classic Palming with Coins" by Reed McClintock which is a great technique which I have already been doing for some time (but didn't know it was Reed's Method) to help my classic palming. I also did some reading on David Stone's site about building up the strength in the outer palm of your hand by literally doing "Pinkie Pull-ups" by attaching a bottle to your pinkie.

Does anyone know of any DVDs which cover how much/how often these muscle exercises should be performed so damage isn't done?

Thanks, Brett.


Posted: Oct 19, 2008 3:30am
---------------------------------
Sorry, I wasn't just looking for DVDs, but also any written material. Thanks.
The Amazing Noobini
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When we were kids a friend of mine used to read these silly martial art books that had the most bizarre workout methods for achieving something like... being able to crawl up a wall on your back. He insisted that it was possible. The book said so and there were illustrations.

I remember that one of these techniques started with "take a hammer and break all of your knuckles". Only then apparently could you develop strong enough bone structure for a proper punch because as the bone grew back, it would become stronger.

I talked him out of it and now I feel compelled to talk you out of doing pinkie pull-ups! It sounds like a really really really bad idea! I would urge you to not do something like that at all to such a weak spot but rather strengthen it by doing the actual moves you want to use the pinkie for.

When you feel pain or real strain you should stop and rest. Even for days if you have exercised repeatedly for a long time and feel pain. It is going to take time to learn magic anyway so there is no point in rushing it.

As I'm typing this, my wrist and left index finger hurts because of sleights I worked on almost two years ago.
"Talk about melodrama... and being born in the wrong part of the world." (Raf Robert)
"You, my friend, have a lot to learn." (S. Youell)
"Nonsensical Raving of a lunatic mind..." (Larry)
L Trunk
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You can do exercises, or you could just spend a lot of time doing classic palm which is going to be exercise as well as practice. If you require a strong classic palm for a particular routine, then practice away. However, keep in mind that you might be able to do the same thing with a different sleight (one that is easier).
harris
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Harris Deutsch
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For me short time spans done frequently works better.
Also practicing with one more coin than the routine requires.
Find a physical therapist that is also a close up magician.

I remember during a 6 month period that my right hand was not working, (tendons cut) that I "relearned" a lot of stuff using my non dominant left hand...

One coin at a time...Can't wait to see Mr. Reed lecture for the Ring 129'ers in November. First you palm 4 in your left hand 6 in your right...or was it 6 in your....

"Hey Harris, your thumb disapeared again", said Nigel the puppet that rocks...

Oh what fun it is to play...

Harris "palms of aluminum foil" deutsch
4 a lighter touch in coin magic
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
drlaugh4u@gmail.com
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brettsaunders
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Hi The Amazing Noobini,

I appreciate your concern - I did some damage to myself learning a sleight about 2 years ago (fully recovered now), so I am now more cautious about exercises so wanted some good advice before proceeding.

Thanks too L Trunk for your advice about classic palming - I'm classic palming every day (got the right hand almost perfect, but it's the left hand I need the strength in (so I'm doing lots of card manipulation practice to hopefully boost the strength as well).

Thanks folks,

Posted: Oct 19, 2008 9:02pm
Hi Harris, the funny thing is, I can actually classic palm 2 coins easier than one. Somehow, my left hand grips tighter when I have 2 in there, but I really need to build strength for just one coin - very strange. Perhaps I need to buy a really heavy coin (I actually use poker chips for all my classic palming as I use coin flourishes on stage & the bigger the coin the better for visuals). Do you know if such a thing as a heavy poker chip is sold??

Thanks,
phread
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The pinky pull ups work...muscle is the same in all parts of the body. exercise the pinky as you would the bicep or shoulders. It works, or you can "practice" with a coin and in 10 years you'll have it. The meat on the lower part of the near the pinky-is a ledge to support the coin and the thumb is the lever/mechanism that holds it in place.
Deckless Wonder
harris
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Harris Deutsch
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After 30 years I am still practicing, rehearsing and sharing.

Although I don't play poker anymore, I do know that some chips are heavier than others.

For a while about 5 years ago, my doctor advised me to switch to half dollar coins and smaller. These days I am back c/p ing with dimes to morgans.

For fun how about a c/p to c/p of a dime to morgan.

Just serious

Keeping it between tight and too loose (don't want things to fall until the routine calls for it) works for me. Routines such as Okito type where the coins go through your hand to spectator's hand/or table one at a time can help with your control..First 1, then 2, 3, 4, ....

Seriously I don't know if one solution fits everyone...and as some have written they have found great success with other tools.

Harris
2 old to know everything....
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
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brettsaunders
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Thanks Phread,

I've tried just moving my fingers around quite a bit with 3 casino chips classic palmed (fully extending the fingers & then curling them underneath - this has really strengthened the outer ridge - I am starting to feel the chip fit into my left hand in a "groove" like it does in my right hand. The one handed card fans are really helping too.

Thanks for the tip.

Posted: Oct 23, 2008 6:44am
Thanks Harris - I just looked on Wikipedia, and they list Casino Chips weighing as much as 13 grams - I'll have to try looking around to find some. I actually haven't practiced classic palming coins of smaller sizes, as I'm usually doing stuff on stage, however have been trying to back clip (Goshman pinch) the casino chips, which is quite difficult for angles.
Mb217
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I don't know...No disrespect to Reed's fine work on the subject but to me Classic Palming isn't all that big a deal as it has been made out to be. It does take practice but not like preparing to go to war or anything...Smile I used to (actually still do) play with the move matter-of-factly just about everyday now and again. It's really not any chore as it's just part of my day and I actually enjoy going through sleights and routines. Smile

*fyi brett...Again briefly, I've mentioned several times before that I found that if you pressed a coin (half dollar) hard into place in your hand and held it there for about a minute, that a good Classic Palm would immediately appear. The pressing of the coin into position while tightening the hand around the coin helps the muscles there to conform. Many have tried my suggestion and found it to be just as I instructed. It will work for you too. Smile Oh, and welcome to the Café. Smile -Mb
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic Smile


"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb Smile
harris
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Harris Deutsch
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Nearly normal exercise..

coin roll a dime then c/p it
while dime is still there, roll a penny then c/p it
while dime and penny are in place roll a nickle then c/p it
while the dime, penny and nickle are in place roll a quarter...then c/p it.

as the King of Siam said, Ect, Ect, Ect...

Shall we dance ...said the coins....

keep your magic poetic, emotional, and as was well said Find the stuff that is you..

Harris
"palms of aluminum foil...for a lighter touch....

For fun reverse the process retrieving the larger coin ..rolling it then putting it into a display...then the next largest....

then pass on what you learn...
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
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music, magic and marvelous toys
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Mindtrap
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Most of the risk is avoided by properly warming up your hands prior to any stress and giving sufficient rest if you feel any strain the next day. I recommend the powerweb as a useful warmup and strength building tool for your hands and amazon stock them. Theyre color coded for strength; don't buy the weaker ones as they will only tear (unless you need rehabilitation).
Cheap poker chips are plastic thru and light, casino quality ones are clay-filled and heavier.
MT.
harris
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Harris Deutsch
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Warming up is a great thing to do...
physically and mentally....

Pro athletes stretch...so why shouldn't us coin people. ....

Harris "stretching the possibilities" deutsch
Harris Deutsch aka dr laugh
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Lawrence O
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Like Marion, I have a few coins in my pocket and practice some moves now and then during some of the short dull times in a day (elevator or any transportation -plane being a convenient one for me-, places where even the king goes alone...) We can do this in our pocket with nobody else even being aware of it.
We can eat a lunch with a coin palmed, read a book or a paper with a coin palmed, telephone with a coin palmed, write with a coin palmed, type on your keyboard with a coin palmed: doing something else with a coin palmed teaches to have a light grip without being focused on the move and keeping the fingers free for something else... Just don't forget to change hands so that you develop a second nature with both hands.
Magic is the art of proving impossible things in parallel dimensions that can't be reached
brettsaunders
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Hi Mb217,

Thanks for the welcome and for the suggestion about pushing the coin up into the hand hard for a minute - I've just tried it for the first time today and have gotten an instant classic palm - I'll keep trying it each day and see if it continues to work - thanks for the great tip!

Posted: Oct 24, 2008 7:36pm
Hi Harris,

I've yet to learn the coin roll, but having seen it performed I'd have to say it looks like an excellent warm-up move (sorry, haven't actually handled a dime, but if you can classic palm a penny, I am impressed - we've got five cent pieces here in Australia and even though I can classic palm them as well as ten cent & twenty cent pieces, I find my hands look much more natural with bigger coins palmed (must be hand size). I do like the idea of locking coins under one another - I'll have to come up with a presentation idea for that.

Lawrence O,

I'm quite like you, classic palming coins most places - I work a lot on a computer and have just started classic palming while typing - a great way to build muscle endurance.

Posted: Oct 24, 2008 7:42pm
Hi Mindtrap,

I agree totally about the warming up - a while back when I was getting pain from repetitive typing in my job, I bought this DVD off Ebay called "Healthy Hands Wrists & Forearms" (C) Magic Planet Productions (also sold at http://www.wisdomandhealth.com) - I've got no affiliation with their company, but the hand stretching exercises I learned off there have kept me pain free at the keyboard and have really made my hands more flexible and supple. I've used a powerweb before for strength building - great idea!
Mb217
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Brett, glad you gave my suggestion a try. As you found out, it really does work. And it lasts quite a while, so you can even practice things with it. The goal in doing this is not only to get the "Instant Classic Palm" but to then understand a bit better why it works, what muscles are involved in the better palming of the coin and to practice that better (physical & mental) understanding toward making your CP better. It also could give you the immediate ability to do effects specifically/primarily using the move that usually take a bit more time to pick up or to do convincingly. Finally, it's a sort of jumpstart that allows you some success with something that would normally take you a while to grasp, so to speak. Smile Glad it helps. -Mb
*Check out my latest: Gifts From The Old Country: A Mini-Magic Book, MBs Mini-Lecture on Coin Magic, The MB Tanspo PLUS, MB's Morgan, Copper Silver INC, Double Trouble, FlySki, Crimp Change - REDUX!, and other fine magic at gumroad.com/mb217magic Smile


"Believe in YOU, and you will see the greatest magic that ever was." -Mb Smile
brettsaunders
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Mb, it will help me especially before I'm going up on stage to do a few pushes into the hand also to know I've got the groove ready. I just watched your video from your signature (short pockets) - man you've got some amazing coin skills - I was just laughing to myself in astonishment because I enjoyed it so much - very entertaining.
marty.sasaki
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Some muscles really respond to this type of exercise. Perhaps the classic palm does.

I know that one of the best ways to build up muscles for shooting archery is to properly draw a much heavier bow than you normally would and hold it. You do this to just the edge of pain/exhaustion. Then you rest these muscles for a few days. This causes the muscles to break down and then to heal stronger. The problem is to do this properly, otherwise you end up doing damage that won't heal properly.
Marty Sasaki
Arlington, Massachusetts, USA

Standard disclaimer: I'm just a hobbyist who enjoys occasionally mystifying friends and family, so my opinions should be viewed with this in mind.
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