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Special user
western Pa
527 Posts

Profile of raywitko
As a builder and user of the dove tray I tend to agree with Dave.
Sometimes it seems there are more than one of me.

Tabman USA
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val and noid
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New user
5 Posts

Profile of val and noid
Hey dudes,
How do fake doves do with this one? I grew up in Norfolk, which is PETAS headquarters, and I just can't bring myself to use a live dove, at least not for this trick. Someone posted earlier that a shoe might be a bit awkward, so how about a fake dove?

Sean the Bleeding Heart
Dave Scribner
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Assistant Manager
Lake Hopatcong, NJ
5005 Posts

Profile of Dave Scribner
I suppose if you were doing a comedy act, a rubber dove would work. When the dove is produced, being that it's rubber, unless you have it fastened down in some way, it's going to bounce all over the place. You could incorporate I suppose and after it is produced, you could transform it into a live one with a sleeve toss or something like that.
Where the magic begins
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116 Posts

Profile of abra
I've been using Balloon to Dove for 16 years in all my kid shows, and I have never gone over 6 minutes with leaving my dove in the holding compartment. I am very safety concerned about my doves and treat them with respect. Sorry to say, in my opinion I think 15 minutes is way too long. In my routine, I make this my third effect in my children's show so the dove does not sit any longer than what I said.

Dave Scribner
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Assistant Manager
Lake Hopatcong, NJ
5005 Posts

Profile of Dave Scribner
The 15 minute rule pretty much applies to almost every dove production or vanish effect out there. We are all saying it is the longest that should be used. We are all concerned with the safety of our doves and don't want to keep them closed up any longer than necessary.
Where the magic begins
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Inner circle
Puerto Rico
2492 Posts

Profile of Hansel
On 2009-01-18 09:15, bry1513 wrote:
I am a dove. I am very comfy for up to fifteen minutes in a balloon to dove tray. Thanks guys.

The Dove

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Inner circle
The Holy City of East Orange, NJ
6438 Posts

Profile of Spellbinder
Just letting you know that Jim Gerrish has recently released his version of the Ian Adair 1963 thin balloon to dove tray. Improvements include making it easily from readily available materials in 2009 (some of the 1963 stuff is hard to get and work with). Jim has also made his version able to be used as either a tray (held by an assistant) or a table for solo work, something not possible with Adair's 1963 version. Unlike most of the other commercial balloon to dove trays and tables, this one does NOT use the Brunel White flip-flap method- no high powered springs, etc. It can be made in a week-end, following Jim's photo plans. It's on my site in Book 2 of Jim's Hardboard and Duct Tape Magic (however, no duct tape is used in this effect, just hardboard and some wood trim).
Professor Spellbinder

Professor Emeritus at the Turkey Buzzard Academy of Magik, Witchcraft and Wizardry

Publisher of The Wizards' Journals
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Regular user
Erie, CO
190 Posts

Profile of MattMagician
You can put the dove in the l**d c*****r right before the trick by leaving the tray and the dove in your case.
Matt Simonsen
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Eternal Order
24089 Posts

Profile of Dynamike
I can't see how some of you can disagree with Dave about a balloon tray. Because I have performed with the dove balloon tray for years. Never had a problem with a dove. I double agree with Dave about there is more space in a Balloon Tray than inside of a dove harness.

I can understand if there is a misunderstanding about a balloon tray or type of balloon tray.
Bob Sanders
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Grammar Supervisor
Magic Valley Ranch, Clanton, Alabama
20494 Posts

Profile of Bob Sanders
In the Dove in Balloon from Chalet that I've used professionally the last 30 years, and I have several, the dove is safer in the prop than he is in his cage. It's dark. But dark never hurt a dove in a safe place.

Like Dave I have no idea who Diane Lavell is or her expertise in dove magic. My suspicions are that Dave is right and she is with PEDA rather than a dove magic expert. She could also be with some pet supply or food company. Since I was the founder and author of Dove HotLine for magicians performing dove magic long years before there was a Magic Café, my research has never quoted her. As an old graduate university professor, with a record of refereed publications, I am not that bad at doing research. In 47 years of professional magic, her name is unfamiliar to me. We certainly have not crossed paths on the magic or dove lecture circuit.

Bob Sanders
Magic By Sander
Bob Sanders

Magic By Sander / The Amazed Wiz
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28 Posts

Profile of meekomagic
Chalet Dove in Balloon served me well.
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