Saying something is above your paygrade has nothing to do with income level. You implied I must be the expert..I am not. I can only fathom your incorrect post meant you did not know what you were talking about...hence my comment. One you are familiar with in your favorite section here on the Café.

Riley did post a fairly accurate definition of 'off broadway'. It typically refers to size.

Kevin

I only know about the term from hearing it used by people who work ON or OFF Broadway. Perhaps you know better as you claim? Perhaps my friends lie?

Seems you have a bit of a problem when RileyG says "Slim is Correct".

So my information comes from my friends experience so please place the blame on them

I don't work up North that often. It's too cold.

Here comes Xmas just in time!

I saw the Broadway show. It was horrifyingly bad, but we thought it was possibly more of a farce or satire so we were okay with it. It wasn't until I saw that he had a tv show that I realized he meant it to be serious.
He really isn't a strong live stage performer. He is more of a "see me, look at me, worship me" presence which wears on the nerves and gets boring quickly.
Not even Cirque could reel that in I think.

I have seen several Cirque shows (thankfully comped). I've yet to see one where someone didn't screw up. When I saw "O" people were slipping and falling off one of the aerial apparatus and the person attempting to fling fire poi around (and doing so terribly) launched one and had to be brought another. In Dralion the ring divers took out the rings. It happens.
The idea that Cirque shows are perfection is more myth when applying it to skill sets BUT their innovation and theatrical presentation is quite stunning. I will give them all the credit in the world for that.

I also have to point out a little known additional element of Believe. It had Emmy Award winning choreographer Wade Robson as the show choreographer. I've had the priveledge of seeing Wade's work live and have been following it for about ten years now. He is absolutely brilliant and I've never seen one of his choreographies that hasn't left me in awe.

So, if the presentational genius of Cirque and the choreo brilliance of Wade is not enough to elevate this show in the eyes of a lay audience, or critics (people do listen to them), then I don't see how a couple months of "hashing" things will improve it.
However, one of the things Cirque *is* known for is cutting the weakest link in any show. I've seen shows in developement mode and Guy LaLiberte didn't like a lead act and he removed it. Depending on CA's contract, it is entirely possible for this (seeming) commercial to be revamped sans CA with a more suitable replacement and story hook.

I completely agree with the idea of Jeff McBride in it. I think that would be phenominal and his presentations are already on that Cirque theatrical line anyway. I'd pay to see that.
I can't bring myself to waste anymore money on another Criss "all for the glory of me" Angel show.

Went back and read some of the new posts. At same time, realized mine wasnt so clear. didn't mean I heard show was closing down permanantly over holidays... but have been told within luxor that the show will break for new changes and added effects. Hearing more magic will be added...in my eyes, this is the only hope for saving the show. People are expecting magic and complaining due to the lack of magic in the show.

Most laymen ive talked to don't even know the show exists. So, could easily be saved. Criss has to carry talent he claims on tv to the stage. To do this you better have some nice effects, and a lot of them.

Could be a great show is focus was more on the magic side.

It seems to me that one problem with the show is that it doesn't know whether it's a magic show or a Cirque show -- it seems to exist in a limbo between the two. I think the Luxor wanted a new (but not too new) Siegried and Roy show -- big illusions and flamboyant theatrics. And it was probably someone's bright idea to marry the biggest current name in magic (Criss Angel) with the biggest name in flamboyant theatrics (Cirque) and, what the heck, let's throw in top line choreography (Robson). The result has not yet been fully integrated.

In addition, I have to say that I haven't been as intrigued by Cirque productions recently as I had been when I saw my first Cirque show. The first Cirque performance I saw was more circus and less theatre, if that makes any sense. It was an assault on the senses without any perceptible story line (at least I didn't detect any story line as I watched it). More recent Cirque productions seem to have some story line, but the stories are feeble.

For example, I recently took my children to see Wintuk in New York; the story was simply that some kid wanted to see it snow (kind of the standard presentation of Snowstorm in China, but used to try to sustain an entire Cirque production). I don't think it worked -- it seemed overblown in a 'much ado about nothing' kind of way. The show also suffered in that the venue was low-ceilinged and the company could not use any of their aerial routines. At any rate, I think if the production was more circus-y and less pretentious it would have been more entertaining.

I think the "Believe" production may suffer from the same malady. We have all seen those magic shows that are routined around the theme of "how I became a magician." I think that that theme is really a lame pretense for stringing together a bunch of tricks. Even the standard Six Card Repeat patter ("I once saw a magician who showed me a trick with one, two, three, four, five, six cards ...") suffers from the same affliction -- and no one really cares about it.

Similarly, Criss Angel, even though a "phenomenon" of sorts, has not shown the public sufficient depth of personality to make the public really care about him or his life, which seems to be the through line of "Believe." He is a one-dimensional character at present (I think Lance Burton and Mac King have given audiences much more in terms of characters to care about). Criss Angel needs to make some major changes in how he is perceived, both on and off the stage, in order to be successful -- he needs to expand his audience beyond the teen-aged male Goth (which is actually passe) and emo (who are often the object of ridicule by their contemporaries because, let's face it, they are ridiculous) crowd, and then make that wider audience care about him.

And that is a very tall order.

It isn't working since Jim Callahan put a Stick Pin in a CA VooDoo Doll
True Story!

where did Jim get the fingernail clippings since the restraining order?

I don't know but you can't seem to be able to purchase a ticket in February or after .... Just try
(Jim was at three more shows with CA after the confrontation and before the court order wasn't he?)

Plus a scary disclaimer too! (Even if you could buy a ticket)

Who said, "The BEST MAGICIANS are the BEST ACTORS playing the role of a magician". Maybe Laurence Olivier could have given Criss, David Caruso and William Shantner some pointers.

Mike Weatherford gave “Special” status to Believe in his 2008 Top 10 Vegas Shows column today saying, “Criss Angel Believe” still deserves a special honor — Why not? These are made-up anyway — for providing the year’s most dramatic narrative arc: an $80 million-plus train wreck that snapped Cirque du Soleil’s five-show Vegas winning streak and may still prove to be beyond fixing.”

Dave, I think you posted that in enough places. Give it a rest LOL.

That's an excellent idea.

I don't think age is a factor. I have told people how old he is and they don't believe me.
As for the 'biker culture' not drawing big money gamblers...
Have you ever been to Vegas?
Every casino has an OCC chopper on display.
The Harley Davidson casino/restaurant/whatever, does fantastic business,
especially during their annual "Worlds Strongest Biker" event.
This comment strikes me as ageist. It is also just a blatant attck on a culture that you obviously just don't understand.
The fact is, all sorts of people come to Vegas to see shows.
I like Harley's, and I had front row seats to every magic show I went to.
I also do not gamble. And I plan to see his show the next time I go.

"4) Criss's image needs an overhaul, over 40 biker dude with a shirt off/open is not his strong selling point. And I don't think this image will pull the $$$$ gamblers. (At his ticket price, and bearing in mind their age range.)"

Any updates on criss's show. I heard the ticket sales were not not bad.

CA is no Biker dude... maybe a RUB at best...

signed, a real biker... http://www.BloodBrothersMC.org

CA is no Biker dude... maybe a RUB at best...

Yes, people with money are less prone to road rash and bugs in their teeth due to the incredible powers of their blue blood. Everybody knows that.
Labels are crap.

This is off off topic, but the term "Biker" is specific to a certain Motorcycle Lifestyle. Something you cannot understand unless you are exposed to it or research it.

I have been riding motorcycles, (Harley-Davidson), for 20+ years and I have never referred to myself as a "Biker". Yes, I have long hair, tattoos and certainly "look" the part to any layperson, but I know enough about the culture to recognize a Biker when I see one.

Riley put it best, he's a "RUB" or "Weekend Warrior". Not that there is anything wrong with that. If Criss digs motorcycles and has the money to spend on the custom stuff, good for him. It certainly does not make him any more talented as a performance artist. And I highly doubt it will sell more tickets...

So it's a box that someone puts themself in as a self-imposed limitation?
Isn't that what bikers are supposed to be against?

My opinion is that there is no such thing as a biker because "Biker" is a label, and labels are false.
And that's from a guy who spent his childhood around Hell's Angels and members of the Vietnam Veterans MC.

My best summer was in 1996 on my then 1994 HD Ultra Classic when I rode 43k miles around the USA... Most of that solo, and about 12k miles with 3 buddies of mine... Yes, I flew my colors, as I always do...