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Rotten
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I took from the original post what was needed and will ignore the slander so many of you relish. Before I walk out on stage I don't tell myself I am sub par or not as good as someone else. I tell my self to be funny and take no prisoners. At one point in the show I tell the audience they are the best I have ever had. Every time. I took from the post that if your mindset is GREAT you will be great. I have never felt the need to enter a competition since I was in highschool. Awards don't mean squat to an audience, it's all in the head and that can translate into greatness. I suppose if a trophy helps convince yourself your great then go for it.

I have known a few, okay most, performers that were only great in their head. They didn't make a living at it, or at least it was meager. But for the profesional, you have to tell yourself your GREAT. Perhaps using another word. Pick up a thesaurus if you want.

Gaddy, you cracked me up with the bald spot touche. Obvious but the other fella was asking for it.
Freak Prodigy
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I'm the best sword swallower here.


Say I'm not...
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Pauldela
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So then...
Josh Riel
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I'd join in with the whole "Prove your a better magician than me" thing, however, I have yet to see anything from anyone that makes me care.

Whit Haydn, he's a guy that would make me care; about my abilities. While I am nowhere near his level, it is a target. He makes me want to be a better magician (Not better than anyone, just better than I am).

Otherwise, before I felt the need to be better than anyone, I would need to care about them.

Your sense of style, your opinions, your digital nimbleness... Irrelevant to me.

Where you might be relevant to me is when you try to make a point that may well lead some student of magic (Who may not know how full of crap you may, or may not be) astray.

To which hot and bothered gentleman are you referring.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
Hart Keene
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So are we going to have like a "magic" off, similar to a dance off?

Youtube style?
-Hart

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Magician Portland Oregon
Josh Riel
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More like "Magicing with the stars". won't-be magicians with has-been stars = success!

Nothing like e-peen enlargement to prove your the coolest kid in the green room.
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
Review King
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Quote:
On 2008-11-15 17:47, Magic_Steve wrote:
See...then this is where we differ. I don't give two cents about what other magicians think of me, or even being the "best" magician. TBH, it's almost impossible to decide who the "best" magician is, since there are so many categories of magic. David Kaye isn't going to be as good at working a restaurant as Paul Green. And Paul Green can never be the type of magician Lance Burton is. And Lance Burton doesn't do anything remotely close to what David Blaine does.

Some magicians are great technically, yet can't hold an audience for more than 2 minutes. Some magicians do the very basic of sleights, yet can properly entertain an audience for an hour with nothing more than a deck of cards and a TT. Being the best is a very loose term IMO. Smile

P.S. What's the point in proving someone's opinion is better than yours?? An opinion only matters if you let it. Otherwise, they're meaningless.


Are you sure you're in High School? You have an old soul and rock the house!
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the saddest are, "It might have been"

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liampower
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Quote:
On 2008-11-16 15:59, Hart Keene wrote:
So are we going to have like a "magic" off, similar to a dance off?

Youtube style?


I hope so that would have me laughing for days
Carducci
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I have to say, I interpreted Nate's original post in a completely different way.

It sounds to me that Nate is challenging himself to live up to the ideal he's created in his mind. This is something that any true artist should aspire to. While many here might disagree with how he's chosen to challenge himself, it's a noble pursuit.

Perhaps he should have phrased it better; instead of saying "I am the best magician" he could have said "I am fulfilling my true potential." That's clearly what it comes down to. He admits that it is "impossible to have an objective best" but that if we all strive to be the best magician we can be that that will elevate the art.

Perhaps Nate's challenge comes off a little cocky, but I feel he's already declared his intentions when he says that he's "hoping this will push me to get better and better"

For some 'good enough' is good enough. It's too easy to get to a point where we have good material, get consistently good reactions and we become comfortable. It gets harder to push ourselves at that point. It's a lot of work for little payoff. Many people would agree that entering competitions is a good way to push yourself. You have a clear deadline and a clear goal. No, winning a completion doesn't mean you're going to perform well in the real world, but it can challenge you to grow as a performer. Bad to the balloon has a different but equally valid goal for competitions; to create buzz. We can also see from his resume that Bad to the balloon is also striving to elevate his art (recent master classes etc.) and I applaud that. Nate is striving to elevate his art in a different way, and I applaud that too.

I believe the 'challenge' approach works especially well for competitive people. If that works for you Nate, I say go for it! Don't ever settle for 'good enough,' and always strive to reach your full potential as a magician and as a human.
Josh Riel
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Quote:
On 2008-11-16 23:38, Carducci wrote:
I have to say, I interpreted Nate's original post in a completely different way.... "Lots of other words"....


Reinterpret them. Perhaps I can help you by quoting his last statement?
Quote:
This especially applies to the gentlemen getting so hot and bothered by my opinions on here - show me why yours are better.



Does Nate have any other friends he can PM to defend his foolish statement?
Magic is doing improbable things with odd items that, under normal circumstances, would be unnessecary and quite often undesirable.
Carducci
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It seems I don't come here often enough to know the full story regarding the "hot under the collar" gentlemen.

Nate's last two paragraphs, I would describe as cocky. The last is pretty much asking for trouble.

I know little of hip hop but the concept of setting a goal for yourself and working towards it, I get.
Destiny
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I think I can sum it up for you.

The other guys are proud of their balls, but Natanel is embarrassed by them.

He apparently experimented with them earlier, but as he has grown older he has come to abhor the inelegance of balls.

Then there is the subtext - concerning how much time is suitably spent in the closet.

Destiny
Natanel
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I am well aware that no such challenge will likely emerge. The last section is meant to be playful, and is influenced by the braggadocio and swagger that makes hip hop music so much fun. Also: magic is show business, and developing a sense of Kanye West style theatricality IMHO will help us promote ourselves in the real world where it matters.

I think Carducci captured the essence of my point well though. I am trying, first and foremost, to push myself forwards and this GOAT concept is a novel way to do so.

As Lil' Wayne said in the song I quoted earlier. "I am the greatest rapper alive....and I hope everyone feels this way, it elevates the game for everyone"

Bad to the Balloon: I never tried to make this a ****ing contest about art or anything else. I enjoy art,music and fashion so that's where I draw my analogies much as someone else hear probably does so with cars or technology. Indeed this wasn't supposed to be a ****ing contest about magic either, but a fun way to challenge ourselves. I've noticed that while you seem to put forth the most vocal derision, you are the only one who has played along.
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Natanel
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Addendum: Why is is this "not very magical, still"? I would like to think that for some of us it merits "food for thought."
People who work for Theory 11: Do you want a young guy without a stupid gelled haircut or eurotrash jeans for your videos? PM me.
Bad to the Balloon
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Quote:
On 2008-11-17 11:33, Natanel wrote:
I am well aware that no such challenge will likely emerge. The last section is meant to be playful, and is influenced by the b
Bad to the Balloon: I never tried to make this a ****ing contest about art or anything else. I enjoy art,music and fashion so that's where I draw my analogies much as someone else hear probably does so with cars or technology. Indeed this wasn't supposed to be a ****ing contest about magic either, but a fun way to challenge ourselves. I've noticed that while you seem to put forth the most vocal derision, you are the only one who has played along.


Don't know how I can be vocal on a text only site.
Where did I ever get that idea? Hmmmm....

"Let's put our money where our mouths are - I challenge anyone here to prove themselves a better magician than I. This could be settled by an informal contest, or entering contests at magic conventions, or even having video judged, though I think it would be much better suited in person."

They are mixing rap and country together ... it's called C R A P

BTW I like Plastic Destiny's analogy, at least people can related to it.
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Whit Haydn
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I have always found Hip Hop's braggadocio very adolescent--a lot of antler rattling.

Showing off is not the best paradigm for artistic performance.

Even though it can be a fun and exciting sort of game on occasion, it gets old really fast, and it puts the performer in the weakened position of being "judged" by the audience. He is automatically "one down" with the audience simply by asking them for approval. This is not a strong position to be in.

Excessive competitiveness and bragging results in limited cartoony art--like pro wrestling.

Magicians should strive to give something to the audience, not ask for approval.

If you scare them, they will applaud for the scare you gave them. If you make them laugh, or pull their legs--they will applaud you for the smile you gave them. If you make them cry, they will applaud for that. These are real applauses--thank you's for what you gave to them.

On the other hand, if you let the audience think you want to show them "you are the best," they will assume the role of judges and crucify you if you don't impress them. If you do impress them, they will give you a half-hearted applause--"I have to admit, the kid is good..."

This is the weakest possible theatrical position.

In any contest in front of lay people, the first guy that does Invisible Deck or the floating bill will win.

The way to become a great magician is to look within oneself and find the deepest meaning and attraction for magic you can find. Why do you like it? What does it really mean to you? Then try to get the audience to share that feeling and understand what makes you love magic. Get them enlisted in the cause. You will have committed real art.

Most magicians never really try to analyze and understand the elemental attraction to the art that got them hooked on magic to begin with. Figure it out. Find a way to share it with your audience. You will be a great magician.
stoneunhinged
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Does this thread have a nadir?
Pakar Ilusi
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Ok, ok, Natanel...

You're the goat...

You're the goat...

Rest of us are sheep...

Some are Wolves in sheep, er... chic clothing... Smile
"Dreams aren't a matter of Chance but a matter of Choice." -DC-
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