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The Magic Cafe Forum Index » » Shuffled not Stirred » » New Aronson Stack Viewer (0 Likes) Printer Friendly Version

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Lawrence O
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Greenwich (CT)
6799 Posts

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Hi Milesg

Since the principle is versatile I would dare suggesting two improvements

The first one is the ability to up-load other stacks than the very good Aaronson stack. If I'm using my own stack (which I do) I'd like to be able to enter it and then use your neat idea/software.

The second has to do with time: I think that allocating a fixed time per card is improper. If one is already good, it seems long, and in the opposite case it seems too short. What the Japanese "Intelligence" Tests are doing works bettere IMHO.
They allocate an average global time. People answer in whatever timing they can, pressing down any key when they want the next question to appear, and when the time is up, they are told how many card over 52 they found in what type of time. Thus both beginners and experts have a use for your great idea.

This is just my 2 cents but maybe it contains a problem that I didn't see.

In any case thank you for your always creative mind and your willingness to share your good ideas with us here.
Magic is the art of proving impossible things in parallel dimensions that can't be reached
milesg
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(of experimental medications)
160 Posts

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Thanks Lawrence,
You've got a hand in all of these sub-forums don't you? I'm always happy to hear your input.

My programming skills are a little weak, and as a result I hard-coded the order of the cards into the program (this is why I haven't made a Mnemonica version yet. I'm just too darn lazy to sift through all the code and update it with the different order.) In order for the program to accept custom input I'd have to rework the whole system again, but with extra functionality to parse user input. It's a bit beyond my scope of programming skills.

Of course I do understand the benefit of having such customization option available, but for now I think I'll keep it as just an Aronson Stack viewer.

The timing idea is actually quite nice! I have added the ability to set the test/reveal time to any value so that both beginners and experts have some adjustment of difficulty, but as you stated, the timing per card is fixed until you type a new value.

The global timing option would be great, but I see one major problem with it. The user would need to somehow input an answer for the program to grade him. Typing the answer wouldn't work because it would take time and rely on perfect spelling. Multiple choice maybe? But that too wouldn't be ideal because it may by too obvious to simply guess which of the choices is right based on deductive reasoning.

I'm open to any thoughts on how to overcome these issues.

Also I just received a PM from Simon Aronson with a suggestion which I'd also like everyone's input on. He suggested that I replace the antique card faces with normal Bike faces because the lesser recognizable faces add an extra delay in the translation of the card face to the stack number. Mind Process: see card face => translate into known card => Recall Stack #.

With regular bikes, the thought process would just be: See familiar face => recall stack #.

Of course this kind of surprised me, because my reason for using strange card faces was directly to address the issue of accidentally making visual associations which you might not be able to benefit from during a performance. EG: A spectator naming a card does not give you the visual cue.

However, in retrospect, I generally disable the card faces when I'm testing myself, and only use the written name of the card anyway. In this case, the strange card faces become a hindrance because I have to think harder to figure out if I was right during the reveal phase.

So I guess my question is, what do you all think is better in the long run? Less hang ups on visual associations, or less hang ups on getting the answer?

Or, are there other pros/cons to the card faces which have not been brought up yet?


Whew! sorry for the long post. I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts.

-Miles
Dennis Loomis
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1943 - 2013
2113 Posts

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The idea situation would be the flexibility to work with either the visual images of the cards or the names of the card spelled out. That's because in some work with the stack you will be looking at the cards and for other routines cards are being named. These are different but related cues and optimal facility would be achieved by using both. The images could be any card faces, but I second the idea of using Bikes because that's what most magicians work with.

Dennis Loomis
Itinerant Montebank
<BR>http://www.loomismagic.com
redeagle
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Regular user
South Florida
144 Posts

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Well, I was linked to your application. Great tool. First thing I thought was that the cards are pretty (I like antique/vintage cards) but they make the memorization a bit more difficult. Then I read this thread and see the same comment at the end. I will second that request for a standard Bicycle face on the cards.

Your next mission, should you decide to accept it, is to turn this into an applet that can run on a blackberry! Then I could carry it around everywhere I go. Smile
Turk
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Portland, OR
3545 Posts

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Quote:
On 2009-04-21 14:47, redeagle wrote:
Well, I was linked to your application. Great tool. First thing I thought was that the cards are pretty (I like antique/vintage cards) but they make the memorization a bit more difficult. Then I read this thread and see the same comment at the end. I will second that request for a standard Bicycle face on the cards.

Your next mission, should you decide to accept it, is to turn this into an applet that can run on a blackberry! Then I could carry it around everywhere I go. Smile


Miles,

Assuming that you might be thinking about making this change, before you go to the time and effort to utilize Bicycle backs or faces in your viewer, I would respectfully suggest that your check with the U.S. Playing Card Company to see if they have a problem with such use of their designs. I might be wrong but, as I understand it, USPC is quite "picky" and protective about 3rd party use of their proprietary information and design work.

Then again, I could be wrong on this assumption. Hopefully, others more knowledgeable than myself on this issue will pipe up and provide more certain information in this regard.

And, as before, thanks for taking the time and effort to put together this great stack viewer.

Mike
Magic is a vanishing Art.

This must not be Kansas anymore, Toto.

Eschew obfuscation.
milesg
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(of experimental medications)
160 Posts

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Thanks for the heads-up Mike. I had already considered this potential issue, and I have found some faces which are similar to Bikes, but not the same. They're as easily recognizable as normal Bike faces, but they were made available for free online. The only issue is that they aren't the sharpest images. I'm gonna keep looking for some better faces before I actually do the switch-out.

I have been absolutely swamped with other work-related tasks and I'm leaving the country for a few weeks, so it may be a while... Jeez, I haven't even picked up a deck of cards in a several days -_-

-Miles
Retchin
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What's up with the URL?
dfeder
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126 Posts

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Great job - and thanks for making it available by download. Hope you're feeling better,

Dov
milesg
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160 Posts

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Hey guys,

What IS up with the URL? Seems fine to me, except for maybe the lewd nature of the domain Smile

Dov, definitely feeling better, than was months ago

Just wanted to mention that I FINALLY got around to updating the program with new card art. Someone in another forum pointed me to some good bike scans which I modified slightly to work with my program.

Enjoy!
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